Should "Ender's Game" be boycotted?

Discussion in 'SciFi & Fantasy' started by Magical Realist, Oct 4, 2013.

  1. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Quote from Orson Scott Card:

    "Laws against homosexual behavior should remain on the books…to be used when necessary to send a clear message that those who flagrantly violate society's regulation of sexual behavior cannot be permitted to remain as acceptable, equal citizens."

    It gets worse. Seriously.

    "How long before married people answer the dictators thus: Regardless of law, marriage has only one definition, and any government that attempts to change it is my mortal enemy. I will act to destroy that government and bring it down, so it can be replaced with a government that will respect and support marriage, and help me raise my children in a society where they will expect to marry in their turn.

    Biological imperatives trump laws. American government cannot fight against marriage and hope to endure. If the Constitution is defined in such a way as to destroy the privileged position of marriage, it is that insane Constitution, not marriage, that will die."


    Card represents the Mormon church on the board of the National Organization for Marriage. Card's words speak for Card. But does he speak for the Mormon church and the National Organization for Marriage? Unless we hear otherwise, we can assume that he does.---http://www.theleftcoaster.com/archives/014059.php
     
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  3. wegs Matter & Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    The reason we should not purchase the work of people such as this is because any potential fame and fortune may very well be used by them to build a larger platform to promote their bigotry, and their homophobic agenda. (There are other reasons not to support people with such views, but that aspect of it should be of concern to us all.)

    In my opinion, I will have played an indirect role in helping to support that agenda by purchasing this bigot's work. Even though Card's hateful beliefs about homosexuals are not part of his work, I would feel I'm inadvertently funding them. I also don't want to be inadvertently funding the Mormon church through Card, and any potential political agenda it may have, as well.

    It does make one wonder though how many authors, movie directors and producers, music artists, etc..have personal views such as Card, but are just quiet about them. (And I've been inadvertently funding them, because they're not outspoken.)

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    This is more than separating the author from his work. His work as I see it, are tools for Card to gain popularity and wealth in order to promote his bigotry. It is his allegiance to his church and anti-gay public agenda that drive this man. Why be a part of this if one knows the truth about Card?

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    Last edited: Oct 27, 2013
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  5. Balerion Banned Banned

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    I can understand where you're coming from. My own decision to skip his books was rooted in the same concept. But, just to play Devil's Advocate, is it fair to dismiss acts or art simply because the person who created them is a scumbag? You mention being curious about other, less-vocal entertainers/artists you've been funding; I ask, does it actually matter, so long as they're not using that fame and fortune to spread their venom?
     
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  7. wegs Matter & Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    If I'm aware of the person's personal views and they could be categorized as hate speech, bigotry, outright prejudice, etc...then, yes. Someone as outspoken as Card, has a possible political agenda, and the wealthier and more famous he becomes, the easier it can be for him to attain his goals.

    Someone as outspoken as Card has an agenda. Why be so vocal as it relates to one's hatred of a particular group of people, if you have no motive behind it?

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    I can't separate what Card stands for, and his work, even though the two seem unrelated.
     
  8. Balerion Banned Banned

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    That's not what I asked. I asked what if the person isn't vocal about it.
     
  9. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Good points wegs! Ok you've convinced me. But DAMN I really wanted to see Ender's Game.

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    I remember a similar fiasco that occurred when the movie Powder came out. Turns out the director was accused of sexually-harassing/assaulting a minor. My sister said she would not support him by seeing his movie. I saw it anyway, arguing that I don't really research the personal lives of every director of every movie I see. The movie wasn't THAT good anyway..
     
  10. wegs Matter & Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    I'm glad! Plenty of entertaining movies out there, without giving this asshole one dime of your money. This type of thing is very insidious, in my opinion.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2013
  11. wegs Matter & Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    Then, how would one know? I do read up on people's political views, religious views, etc when I get interested in a certain music artist or author. If an artist isn't very open about such things, then...one can't draw any conclusions either way. I will buy their product/work, but should I discover down the road that they support things that I'm directly opposed to, then I will cease buying their product/work.
     
  12. Yazata Valued Senior Member

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    As long as reviewers thought that Card was "indicting" "the military mind" (a long-time target of the cultural left) he was applauded. But when people started thinking that he was indicting homosexuals, suddenly there were calls for boycotts and blacklists.

    I do think that the stuff MR posted was deplorable. But I have no way of knowing whether that accurately reflects Card's views.

    The thing is, I'm not particularly interested in knowing either.

    Whatever his personal social views may or may not be, I don't see them as all that relevant to whether or not 'Ender's Game' is a good science fiction novel. I think that it is.

    What's more, I know for a fact that quite a few people associated with the film industry hold what I believe to be loony-tunes left-wing opinions. Several actors and actresses are outspoken activists for causes that I strongly disagree with. Nevertheless, they are often very good at their craft. As long as books and movies aren't explicitly political, I don't care a whole lot about what a writer's or filmmaker's private opinions are. I try to judge books or movies on their merits.

    If militants on the political right started calling for boycotts of movies featuring Hollywood left-wingers, I wouldn't be very happy either.

    I'd hoped that a thread about 'Ender's Game' in the SciFi forum might really be a thread about 'Ender's Game'. But this seems to just be another political thread, so I'm outta here.
     
  13. Balerion Banned Banned

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    Where's the irony? The boycott isn't an indictment of the film or book, but of its creator.

    So you'd rather just assume it's some left-wing conspiracy?

    No one is suggesting that it is.

    So you're bothered to know what many Hollywood insiders care about, but you're apathetic to Card's beliefs, in spite of him being one of the loudest anti-gay propagandists in the entertainment industry?

    Suspicious. Did you actually read the title of the thread? What on earth would give you the notion that it was a discussion of the merits of the book?
     
  14. Balerion Banned Banned

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    So you think there's no way to know a person's beliefs unless they're an activist? That doesn't seem right.

    I'll try again: If a person's bigoted beliefs became known to you, but they were not mouthpieces for the rhetoric usually associated with such beliefs, and were not trying to push their agenda through the media, would you still avoid their work? I ask because you offered your fear of funding their campaigns of hate as your reasoning behind a boycott. If there is no campaign, would you feel the same need to keep your money?
     
  15. wegs Matter & Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    Yep.

    (Since you're equating ''being vocal about it'' to ''activism,'' which there's a disparity between the two, I'll just leave it at... ''yep.'') lol
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2013
  16. kwhilborn Banned Banned

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    It appears Card was speaking on behalf of his vested religious interests at the time, the same way Mitt Romney might speak of it now.

    I think it is important that he has recanted his views publicly

    Card has stated,

    Wikipedia

    From Opening Post
    Quaker Thomas Hilborn is my ancestor and lived at the house in this painting.
    http://explorepahistory.com/displaygallery.php?gallery_id=1-7-8&bcolor=ggreen&showimage=2

    So I am speaking as a decendant of people who boycotted sugar because of Slavery (DON'T TELL TIASSA, OMFG). When Gay marriage became legal in Ontario, Canada I opened Gaymarriage.com and Gaymarriage.us as guides to help gays arrange marriages in our country. It was our (myself and my wife) first popular website and it ran off donations.

    http://home.earthlink.net/~kseitz/quaim.html#STEP_5

    I think boycotting a movie based on a persons recanted viewpoint is childish and silly. 1985 was 28 years ago. Let it go.

    The movie industry creates thousands of jobs and they spent over One Hundred Million Dollars ($100 000 000.00) on jobs/items creating this film, and this film will employ hundreds of movie theaters and their staff. I can assure you many of these thousands of people taking a piece of this movies revenue are gay and could be hurt worse by a boycott than Card would.

    If you have read my post you will not boycott this movie. It is too silly a notion.
     
  17. Balerion Banned Banned

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    I didn't do that, you did. You called Card "vocal." The definition is yours, not mine.
     
  18. wegs Matter & Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    And you equated that to activism. Either way, my answer is still "yes."
     
  19. Balerion Banned Banned

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    You equated it by calling Card's activism "being vocal."

    But okay, at least I'm clear on where you stand.
     
  20. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Critic's Grade: B-

    "There’s no denying that Orson Scott Card's well-documented political and anti-gay views are cockeyed and bear the distinct odor of batshit. Still, this adaptation of his 1985 sci-fi novel deserves notice: It makes clear how salient and eerily prescient the author was, back when he wasn’t busy equating Obama with Hitler.

    Much in the same vein as The Hunger Games—and, of course, The Lord of the Flies long before it—Ender's Game taps into the brutality and ruthlessness of which children are capable. In the speculative future first envisioned by Card in a 1977 short story, Earth is at war with the Formics, an alien insectoid race (no longer nicknamed “Buggers,” thanks to writer-director Gavin Hood's good sense).

    With another invasion seemingly imminent, children have become the military's best shot at victory. After all, kids possess a knack for comprehending complex data and adopting new technology, so of course they're ideally suited for a training regimen of complex computer games and zero-gravity exercises. The fact that these trials (realized through some impressively understated CGI) leave the kids increasingly disassociated from their actions and desensitized to violence doesn't seem to be costing their commanding officers (Harrison Ford and Viola Davis) any sleep.

    Ford's Colonel Graff uncovers a potentially sociopathic Skywalker to wage an all-too-familiar “war to prevent all future wars” in loner Ender Wiggin (Asa Butterfield), who's first seen launching a preemptive strike against a school bully. Continuing to display a remarkable aptitude for portraying isolated characters, the otherworldly Butterfield is just as compelling here as he was in Hugo. And while convincingly demonstrating Ender's unnerving cunning and callousness, the disarming young actor likewise invests us in the boy's struggles to preserve his own humanity.

    With its obvious parallels to Starship Troopers, Ford's grumpy old military man routine and an appearance by Ben Kingsley as a Yoda-like mentor adorned in Maori tattoos, Ender's Game could easily descend into ridiculousness with the slightest misstep. However, Hood keeps a firm handle on the somber tone and ensures that we're never once at ease with the sadistic environment. But while there's no shortage of tension, there is a lack of dramatic escalation. Structured around a succession of increasingly elaborate training sequences, Ender's Game doesn't naturally build to its epic climax so much as it smash-cuts to it.

    Arguably, this might actually heighten the sense that Ender’s Game is an adolescent power fantasy that suddenly spirals horrifically out of control. To its credit, the film never flinches as it poses the harrowing question: What if an outsider finally finds his calling only to discover that it's genocide? This futuristic adventure remains resolutely grounded thanks to the moral morass that ensnares its characters. It's that rarest of cinematic offerings: a young adult film that refuses to be easily dismissed."----http://www.wweek.com/portland/blog-30880-game_on_enders_game_reviewed.html
     
  21. wegs Matter & Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    You're still going to abstain from seeing this movie, riiiight Magical? :scratchin:
     
  22. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Probably..Sounds like Wargames meets Starship Trooper.
     
  23. Mazulu Banned Banned

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    My honey and I are either going to watch Ender's Game or Insidious 2. I wonder which one is better?
     

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