Yeah it is. How else would he get one? Are you saying it's fake? Who does Obama have to prove his citizenship to if not the State Department?
Several ways, several of them need no more that the word of some adult. Exactly what kinds of birth records does Hawaii provide? Posted by Mijgreb on Thursday, February 05, 2009 12:00:00 AM Generally, folks don't know that Hawaii law, even in 1961, provided for multiple kinds of birth records, most of which are not what people think of when they think of birth certificates. The following is a description of those, including certificates for people not born in Hawaii. Go figure! 1. In the State of Hawaii, back in 1961, there were three different birth certificates that were obtainable: a. If the birth was attended by a physician or mid wife, the attending medical professional was required to certify to the Department of Health the facts of the birth date, location, parents’ identities and other information. (See Section 57-8 & 9 of the Territorial Public Health Statistics Act in the 1955 Revised Laws of Hawaii which was in effect in 1961). b. In 1961, if a person was born in Hawaii but not attended by a physician or mid wife, then, up to the first birthday of the child, an adult could, upon testimony, file a “Delayed Certificate”, which required endorsement on the Delayed Certificate of a summary statement of the evidence submitted in support of the acceptance for delayed filing, which evidence must be kept in a special permanent file. The statute provided that the probative value of the Delayed Certificate must be determined by the judicial or administrative body or official before whom the certificate is offered as evidence. (See Section 57-18, 19 & 20 of the Territorial Public Health Statistics Act in the 1955 Revised Laws of Hawaii which was in effect in 1961). c. If a child born in Hawaii, for whom no physician or mid wife filed a certificate of live birth, and for whom no Delayed Certificate was filed before the first birthday, then a Certificate of Hawaiian Birth could be issued upon testimony of an adult including the subject person) if the Lieutenant Governor was satisfied that a person was born in Hawaii, provided that the person had attained the age of one year. (See Section 57-40 of the Territorial Public Health Statistics Act in the 1955 Revised Laws of Hawaii which was in effect in 1961). 2. In 1982, the vital records law was amended to create a fourth kind of birth certificate for children born outside of the Territory or State of Hawaii. HRS Chapter 338 was amended to add a new section authorizing the Director of the Department of Health to issue a birth certificate for a person NOT born in Hawaii either as a Territory or State, upon sufficient proof that the legal parents of such individual had declared the Territory or State of Hawaii as their legal residence for at least one year immediately preceding the birth of such child. 3. The language of the statute clearly applies to births in the days of the Territory of Hawaii, so also births in 1961. Now here is a long form birth cetificate as issued by Kapiolini Hospital in 1966, so yes the long form birth certificates are avalable from Hawaii.... Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
And when has Obama proved His status as a Natural Born Citizen? Citation please. Again we are talking about eligibility to be President, and so far Obama has provided nothing that is definitive by Constitutional Standards, full disclosure. Question? why did McCain have no problem releasing His Birth Certificate, it showed where He was Born, the Canal Zone, and also that both of His Parents were American Citizens, and it is a Historical fact, His parents were in service of the American Government, and that by U.S. Law and International Law, make John McCain a Natural Born Citizen of the United State.
Intellectual Dishonesty As Bells pointed out in #216 above: Okubo explained that the Health Department went paperless in 2001. "At that time, all information for births from 1908 (on) was put into electronic files for consistent reporting," she said. Information about births is transferred electronically from hospitals to the department. "The electronic record of the birth is what (the Health Department) now keeps on file in order to provide same-day certified copies at our help window for most requests," Okubo said. Asked for more information about the short-form versus long-form birth documents, Okubo said the Health Department "does not have a short-form or long-form certificate." "The birth certificate form has been modified over the years and decades to conform to national standards and models," she said. Okubo also emphasized the certification form "contains all the information needed by all federal government agencies for transactions requiring a birth certificate." (Watanabe) This issue point has come up before, in a post that you actually responded to. Additionally, as one who has spent so much time and energy fretting over the certificate you're aware of the fact that— Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Image via FactCheck.org —it was issued after Hawai'i transferred its records to electronic format. Providing a sample birth certificate dated thirty-five years before that happened speaks nothing of a document issued six years after the conversion of records. As such, your argument is a clear example of intellectual dishonesty. You are simply ignoring what has been put before you in order to pretend the issue is still in play. It's not. The issue is settled, Mr. Roam. Continuing to raise phantom arguments to drag this out only reminds of your aversion to fact. Let it go. You've brought nothing new to this fake and desperate assertion of scandal. And your argument doesn't fly because it has been shot to pieces. There's an old joke about the windshield wipers being on the inside of a Norwegian airplane. Maybe they should be on yours. ____________________ Notes: Watanabe, June. "Born Identity". Honolulu Star-Bulletin. June 6, 2009. Archives.StarBulletin.com. September 13, 2010. http://archives.starbulletin.com/content/20090606_kokua_line Henig, Jess and Joe Miller. "Born in the U.S.A." Updated November 1, 2008. FactCheck.org. September 13, 2010. http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
To whom? It was deemed acceptable for any Federal Government office by the court as per your Constitution. I never supported caricatures that involved killing or murdering real people. Do you? Stop trolling. I said, quite clearly, and provided proof of my claim, that Hawaii does not issue long form or short form birth certificates to anyone. What I have shown you, and others have shown you, which you have ignored because of your blatant intellectual dishonesty, is that the birth certificate issued by the Health Department in Hawaii is deemed acceptable for not just legal purposes in Hawaii and all other States of the US, but also acceptable, as recognised by your Supreme Court, for, and I quote: Now, it seems that you, the common man, has issues with reading and comprehension and have thus, decided to troll this thread and this subject matter with your intellectual dishonesty. Which he has proven, and the Courts and State Department, as accepted as being proven with his birth certificate, beyond reproof. They have accepted the format in which the Heath Department in Hawaii, a US State, issues its birth certificates and the Supreme Court has deemed the birth certificates from Hawaii (ie. the one issued to Obama) as "meeting all federal and other requirements". What part of that escapes you, exactly? What part of the simple fact that Hawaii do not issue short or long form birth certificates and only issue one type, the type issued to Obama and which is accepted by the US Supreme Court as being acceptable and "meeting all federal and other requirements" escapes you exactly, Buffalo? More trolling and intellectual dishonesty from you. This point has been addressed repeatedly and you have wilfully ignored it. Are you dim, intellectually disabled or intellectually dishonest? I am sorry, but I feel that I have to ask at this point because this has been repeated to you so many times now that the only way you could not get it is if you were stupid, intellectually disabled or intellectually dishonest. So which are you? Again, I shall repeat it and make it in pretty colours, just for you. The birth certificate issued by the State of Hawaii is deemed to meet "all federal and other requirements". And again, Hawaii does not issue long or short form birth certificates and again, this has been explained to you repeatedly now. So what part of all of this do you not quite understand? Which Hawaii does not issue. So pray tell Buffalo, how exactly would he get a Long Form birth certificate when the state he was born in does not issue such birth certificates and only issues the type they gave him? Again, to reiterate - because you just don't seem to get this. Okubo explained that the Health Department went paperless in 2001. "At that time, all information for births from 1908 (on) was put into electronic files for consistent reporting," she said. Information about births is transferred electronically from hospitals to the department. "The electronic record of the birth is what (the Health Department) now keeps on file in order to provide same-day certified copies at our help window for most requests," Okubo said. Asked for more information about the short-form versus long-form birth documents, Okubo said the Health Department "does not have a short-form or long-form certificate." "The birth certificate form has been modified over the years and decades to conform to national standards and models," she said. Okubo also emphasized the certification form "contains all the information needed by all federal government agencies for transactions requiring a birth certificate." She added that the U.S. Supreme Court has recognized the state's current certification of live birth "as an official birth certificate meeting all federal and other requirements." (Source) Simple, ya? Do you get it now? Which is irrelevant when one considers he was born on US soil and was issued with an American birth certificate identifying him as being US born and thus, free to run for President. Nope. Are you? Because from all your prattling on in this thread about Obama not being American enough for President and harping on about the Constitution, I query whether you are American or if english is your first (or second) language. Not only can you not understand your own Constitution, but you also seem to have difficulty in understanding findings of your Supreme Court and its application of your Constitution to birth certificates issued by the State of Hawaii. So are you American? And as has been repeated to you.. constantly.. Hawaii does not issue long or short form birth certificates. I am not bringing colour into this argument. You are the one who keeps reminding us that his father was Kenyan - ie - black. The OP describes people who seem to think that he is a criminal alien, worthy of shooting and allowing children to shoot him as a result in a school fete. He issued his birth certificate as it was given to him by the Heath Department of Hawaii. The State of Hawaii allowed and accepted people, from all quarters of the political divide (Republicans among them) to inspect his original birth certificate and all have advised that he is American born and thus, allowed to run for the highest seat in the land. The State of Hawaii has no cause to now allow all and sundry to tramp in and view his original birth certificate. The court was satistifed that the certificate satisfied the constitutional requirements. How else is a black man to be acceptable to you as President Buffalo? What more do you want? You want him to issue a birth certificate in a form that the State of Hawaii does not issue since they went paperless and all records were kept in a particular format (deemed acceptable by your Supreme Court for all Federal purposes [US Presidency is a federal position and thus qualifies])? And as has been stated to you, the form issued by Hawaii is neither short nor long form. And has been stated, the form issued by the State of Hawaii was deemed acceptable by the Supreme Court as Constitutionally meeting all federal requirements. My attitude to your harping is all you deserve for you intellectual dishonesty and trolling. I did not bring race into it Buffalo. You did and other birther's did. He was deemed, by your courts, to have met the Constitutional requirements to be President. In short, whining about this over and over again shows distinct bigotry - that a man born of an African man in America should not be President because he will not be deemed American enough for the role.
"Shoot the Darky" is an idea/motive which assumes racist bias and has been ascribed by spidergoat to the carnival game. Yes? Which is significant in what way? Is it more significant than someone calling me a birther? Does its importance exceed that of a label of "Republican" applied to me by certain persons for simply espousing the wrong beliefs? What does "alien" have to do with it? We all know it goes way deeper than that... Deep South. Well, normally I'd say you're correct, but my teacher told me that racial lines shouldn't be crossed. Those lines have clearly been defined by spidergoat, et al.
And Buffalo manages to prove the point I was making in this thread, which is that Obama's opposition has managed to convince their retarded minions that he is an alien. Now blow it out your airlock and purge.
Citation please. Really? and who was murdered or killed? and where was your voice when; George Bush assassination film wins top award | Mail Online Sep 18, 2006 ... George Bush assassination film wins top award ... However, the £2million movie sparked controversy in America and the British film-makers ... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-405644/George-Bush-assassination-film-wins-award.html Sarah Palin effigy hung in Halloween display | Reuters Oct 27, 2008 ... LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - An effigy of US Republican vice-presidential nominee Sarah Palin hanging by a noose as part of a Halloween display ... http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE49Q79N20081027 - I don't remember you showing any angst when Republicans were the targets of such actions.... Because I don't kow tow to your opinion I am trolling, I have very clearly out lined my points and rational an all you have done is intimate bigotry and racial bias, it is you who keep bring race up as a issue. And I didn't question that, and went on to point out that Obama could quite easily put this all to bed, release His Long Form Birth Certificate, they exist and are available, especially to the the person who is named on the certificate. What your source clearly show is the opinion of Okubo and no the case law; Okubo also emphasized the certification form "contains all the information needed by all federal government agencies for transactions requiring a birth certificate." She added that the U.S. Supreme Court has recognized the state's current certification of live birth "as an official birth certificate meeting all federal and other requirements." I would like to see the case that shows that. Now how about this from Okubo http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2009/Jul/28/ln/hawaii907280345.html From the July 28, 2009 article "Hawaii officials confirm Obama’s original birth certificate still exists" (link, bolding added): In 2001, Hawai'i's paper documents were reproduced in electronic format but "any paper data prior to that still exists," Health Department spokeswoman Okubo said. Okubo would not say where Obama's original birth certificate is, but said "we have backups for all of our backups." "Our Certificate of Live Birth is the standard form, which was modeled after national standards that are acceptable by federal agencies and organizations," Okubo said. "With that form, you can get your passport or your soccer registration or your driver's license." So you still want to say that Obamas Long Form Birth Certificate doesn't exist? Okubo admitted that it still exist. Again what don't you want to hear about the Facts of the Constitution, and that the office of the Presidency has a specific requirement above any other Federal requirement for Public Office, again I have stated that for any other office, or purpose the COLB is acceptable, but for the Office of the Presidency, a National Public Elected Office, the Constitution is the Supreme Law, and that Law requires proof of Natural Birth as a Citizen of the United State. What part of that escapes you, exactly? Hawaii does issue long form birth certificates, just as of now they are electronic document, which they were not in 19611, and it still has Obama's original LFBC....according to Okubo; Is that your best, to accuse me of "trolling and intellectual dishonesty" and then call names? Are you dim, intellectually disabled or intellectually dishonest? Yes, who is the troll and the dishonest intellectual? I have given documented rational for everyone of my questions about Obama. Now really Bells, is that the best you can do, call names? Pitiful, just Pitiful.....and you wish to assume the title of Intellectual, Pitiful, just Pitiful Bells Hawaii has a copy of Obamas long form Birth Certificate, Obuko has stated that fact, and it can be issued, if Obama request it, now instead of running off at the keyboard, committing slander, and proving just how intellectual bereft you are, why don't you provide the Supreme Court case that show that the Supreme Court has issued a ruling that accepted Hawaii's Certification of Live Birth as proof of Natural Born Citizenship for the office of President of the United States. The Constitution is the controlling law of America not the Federal Government, and according to the Constitution I as a Citizen have the right to question any public official as to His qualification to hold office...... Because according to the Constitution all rights belong to the People to the Citizen. IX Amendment X Amendment Above the Federal Government or State. ps: Bells you and your liberal friend have always played the race card, your intellectual dishonesty cannot accept the fact that as Conservatives we can question the fact of Obama's birth without any question of Obama's color, and when you cannot answer with factual discourse, you resort to names calling and slander. Now if you care to notice, in this whole discussion I have not called you one name or questioned your intellect, called you stupid, or intellectually disabled, that has been and your tact. I have never once brought Obama's color into the this, you have repeatedly. Now show were I ever questioned Obama's right to be President because of His Color? One little post, you can do that since I am such a blatant racist according to you. Now from your; So I can assume you are not a American? Now since you seem to want to claim that I don't understand My Own Constitution, please show where I am wrong in the Constitution. And again, please provide the Supreme Court Case that accepted Obama's COLB as definitive proof of being Natural Born and ellegeable for the Office of the President. I cannot find such, what I can find are decision that as a Citizen, and a Voter, it has been ruled that I or other citizens, don't have the standing to bring a case and have this dilemma resolved.
How much of this racism has been proved? Especially your assertion made in the title of this thread? Hold your horses. He will be dead, at least figuratively, once he has outlived his usefulness. Hold your horses. The faulty space-heater office fire has not yet occurred. Oh, but isn't it glaringly obvious? Oh, I forgot, people can't seem to address "the point".Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
But a lot of data on the Internet has disappeared into the ether, sights that I have used for information are now coming up under 404 Not Found error message. Is 1984, now Big Brother 2010?
Shhh! Der Feind Hört Mit... I encountered something recently where I got a what is the code, 403 Forbidden on a news site. Two articles gave me that, but the rest were fine. It was a touchy subject that was being addressed there. Aside from the obvious of old articles disappearing due to age and reorganization or purging because of storage issues, it is a real possibility that certain things from time to time are blocked by ne'er do wells. I know that in countries where Internet censorship is routinely practiced, forbidden addresses, articles, etc are masked using various techniques like displaying 404 and what not. It would be convenient though to have a fire. Electronic documents can be spread wide and copied profusely with a few clicks. One original doc can be destroyed irreparably. Arggh. I find myself making lots of edits lately. Do you have any specific examples? Are these recent news articles or something? I know I have really old bookmarks or links from years ago, and those routinely disappear if they're dated.
Desperate, eh? Who PM'd who to revive a "discussion" that was going absolutely nowhere fast? You're the one who keeps hammering the same ridiculous scrap metal composed of a dozen or so statements by you and others and yelling about how there was a point there and how people keep ignoring it. The point. You should write a book. People will come away fascinated. "My, how eloquent and verbose! So many words." "Yes, indeed! It was brilliant!" "I didn't really get it. It conveyed the same vague message in each chapter, just worded differently." "What? It wasn't obvious? I mean, c'mon!" I'll take a less hostile tact with you in the future. Maybe. This thread has not been one of your strong points. Facts? Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Which are... a bunch of opinions? Voiced by certain people who see a racist ghost in every room like some people see scary bearded Al Qaeda under every bed? But if it makes you happy, I'll waste my time replying to each of those so-called issues you raised in an earlier post... Originally addressed to Madanthonywayne. —"They only dream of shooting aliens." (Bells; quoted and ignored in response) Fairly obvious and basic. A sarcastic remark on the effigy itself, and how it was not REALLY an alien, but the President. I think everyone here gets that it's the President. —"Think on this, from the article the game is called "ALIEN ATTACK". Could it not be that whatever dipshit thought that this would a funny stunt was playing on the "birther" take that Obama is in fact an alien from a different country and it's a play on terms (note the antennas on his head)?" (Clusteringflux) Note the antennas on the head? No, please don't! Here we have a reference to "birthers" and his citizenship status. And? —"The belt buckles reads "THE PREZ", he's wearing antennae, and the game is called "Alien Attack" (perhaps alluding to claims by the extremist "Birthers")." (Cifo)Another "birther" reference, this time accompanied by the word "extremist"! And? Does this word mean we're getting closer to racism, Daddy? How much farther? —"The issue is that people think they can get away with shooting the president in effigy because he has been portrayed by the lunatic right as alien." (Spidergoat)Uh, oh. Effigy alert! Alien alert! Alien president effigy alert! Race shields up! Here we have no reference to birthers, illegal alien, OR racism. Dissapointing. Recall the Bush effigy with even larger, more defined, more obvious target rings on it? —"Alien Attack. Heh. What kind of alien is that, then? You know, like outer space? Or a president who "wasn't born in the U.S."?" (Tiassa; response to Bells)Here we have a rather pointed allusion to his birth status. Racism? Are we closer? —"I found it typical that they portrayed him that way, to be honest. I mean could they be more obvious?" (Bells; response to Tiassa)I guess a "more obvious" reference to the same thing as above? Or not? I mean, could they be more obviously vague? —"As we see, they weren't obvious enough for some people to get the point." (Tiassa; response to Bells)Oh! Here we go with that point again. The point being? That someone wants to shoot Obama in effigy? Someone's practicing to shoot the actual president? That someone is alluding to his questionable citizenship or qualifications as natural-born? That someone is being xenophobic? That someone wants to "shoot niggers"? The "point" here is not explained. Over and over Tiassa refers to a point, but so far in all these examples I see a melting pot of motives and allegations. —"... I'll only suggest that the title mocks the obvious. Bells and I had a laugh about the reasons it's obvious .... Look, this is just one of those things, Will. It's just one of those occasions someone somewhere clearly went too far. There are plenty of excuses that some would accept for this one, but they all lead back to a sublimated racism." (Tiassa)Here we go, the first of these examples to mention racism, albeit sublimated. So is this the point? Tiassa's opinion? —"And the whole thing probably does go back to well before G. Gordon Liddy shot effigies of President Clinton with live ammunition. But, if you want to make the race-baiting complaint by reiterating your distorted Ackerman quote, please address certain points Bells and I have discussed earlier in this thread." (Tiassa; response to Madanthonywayne)Well, this is beyond my ken, at least partly. This involves some other issue which I am unaware of. As for Gordon Liddy shooting Clinton, a reference to a presumably non-racist effigy. Non-racist because it was a white guy? I'm not sure. —"It is still amusing to realise just how much people do not get it. Even when it is blatantly spelled out for them, they still don't quite get it." (Bells; response to Tiassa) This is just a reference to one of the previous "points" by Cifo already addressed above. Nothing new here. —"In the grand scheme of things, this particular demonstration of poor taste—the Alien Attack game—isn't particularly worrisome. But the number of ways in which people will either defend the statement, or find one way to insist that the only response is to further pile on the president as if the problems he both faces and demonstrates are somehow unique in history ...." (Tiassa; response to Bells)Here Tiassa says that it is a "demonstration of poor taste" and that it isn't particularly worrisome. Huh? Not even a reference to his citizenship or race, let alone proof positive of racist intentions. —"As has been noted previously ... the Alien Attack bit was pretty clear to those not already sold on the spurious conservative accusation of Obama's illegitimacy as president." (Tiassa)Another reference to allegations that Obama is ineligible to be president. As most of these quotes are. Again, nothing new here. —"There is a specific point on the record in this thread that people don't particularly want to answer. (Tiassa) oooPlease Register or Log in to view the hidden image!ooo A specific point! Here we go, again! Tiassa's continuously repeated mantra about a point that is not being addressed. He doesn't explain it, he just refers to it over and over. There are a number of ways in which people draw attention from the Secret Service. I'm sure something like this might. So, in those points addressed above, we see Tiassa's insistence and persistence in hammering this so-called point which is nothing more than a vague, nebulous idea that has been ill-explained. His arguments on that "point" have been rather circular and repetitive. I see nothing that is concrete in those references above. There is an amalgamation of allegations and supposition. And THAT is the point. Nothing of substance.
Tiassa??? Anyone? Anyone? I didn't mean to exclude Tiassa with that statement. I'm going to give this thread another 24-48 hours for final statements before I drop this increasingly ridiculous and futile thread.
From what I gather, the point you're ignoring is that Obama is part black and, therefore, everyone who criticizes him is a white supremacist.