Sciforums religion survey 2014

Discussion in 'Religion' started by James R, Dec 21, 2014.

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What do you believe? (Select all that apply.)

Poll closed Jan 11, 2015.
  1. I don't believe in God now, and I never did.

    12 vote(s)
    26.1%
  2. I don't believe in God now, but I used to.

    15 vote(s)
    32.6%
  3. I believe in God now, but in the past I did not.

    4 vote(s)
    8.7%
  4. I believe in God now, and always have.

    5 vote(s)
    10.9%
  5. I have no opinion on God/do not wish to select one of the above options.

    6 vote(s)
    13.0%
  6. I don't believe in God, but I believe there is a higher power, life force or similar.

    4 vote(s)
    8.7%
  7. I don't regard myself as religious, but I am a spiritual person.

    7 vote(s)
    15.2%
  8. I believe that human beings have a soul or life force which remains after the death of the body.

    5 vote(s)
    10.9%
  9. I believe in reincarnation.

    4 vote(s)
    8.7%
  10. I describe myself as a follower of a recognised religion.

    3 vote(s)
    6.5%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

    Messages:
    30,519
    I thought I'd post a poll to see what the religious mix looks like on sciforums right now.

    Please select all applicable responses, above.
     
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  3. Enmos Staff Member

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    43,184
    I voted "I don't believe in God and now and never have," ignoring that I kind of believed in god as a small child.
     
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  5. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    2,241
    I think one can pick the first option if any God belief as a child lasted no longer than the Santa belief

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    That was my logic in picking #1 as well.
     
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  7. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    33,264
    I don't believe in any supernatural being that has the power to control me or the entire universe. I do however think that all of those who do believe in that supernatural being should have the right to do so as long as they don't force others to believe it as well. I would fight for their right to believe as much as those who don't. Life is tough and many people need to believe in something to get them through it. I just believe in myself, not egotistically but just as a human that does what he can to get by.
     
    precious and cosmictotem like this.
  8. Aqueous Id flat Earth skeptic Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    6,152
    I only believed in God as a child because I was indoctrinated. The scales fell from my eyes in Social Studies class when I discovered that I was merely aligned to a demographic; had I been born in another place, to a different family, from a different culture, then my alignment to some other demographic would have cast all ideas about Ultimate Reality in an entirely different light.

    I did not yet know the word "indoctrination" but at that moment I understood its meaning. I made an immediate break with religion, and resisted all attempts to drag me back into the fold.

    At the same time I began to sense that if something so deeply insinuated into the mind could be forcibly imposed through a system that pretends to be founded in truth, honesty and justice, then the system must be fundamentally corrupt. With that new outlook, I drew lines in the sand, determined to free myself of all such influences. I joined millions of young people similarly situated in my opposition to The Establishment, even to the point of ending up in jail (naively believing that the police could not legally deprive me of my civil rights). At an elite school where I had been given a 4 year scholarship, I quit in the middle of my senior year, in protest over the use of a course (studying Plato no less) as a stump for the teacher to vent his Establishmentarian apologetics.

    Indoctrination is a terrible thing. People die, or are tortured and maimed either as a direct consequence of indoctrination, or as a consequence of their subsequent awakening and rebellion against it.

    Charles Dickens once came to the US to see for himself the conditions of our prisons. He wrote

    I hold this slow and daily tampering with the mysteries of the brain, to be immeasurably worse than any torture of the body: and because its ghastly signs and tokens are not so palpable to the eye and sense of touch as scars upon the flesh; because its wounds are not upon the surface, and it extorts few cries that human ears can hear; therefore I the more denounce it, as a secret punishment which slumbering humanity is not roused up to stay.
    Indoctrination shares this aspect of adjudication of a crime. It is the slow and daily tampering with the mysteries of the human mind, perpetrated against vulnerable victims, which ought to shock the conscience of those who have either been spared the manacles, or who managed to throw them off as I did.

    Unfortunately, under the pretense of Freedom of Speech ( freedom of religion) the practice so far remains legitimized.

    But I believe the day will come, that as long as a person is too young to die in combat, to consume alcohol, or to consent to sex, the world will wake up to the urgent need to establish protections, ensuring that such a person is to too young to consent to indoctrination.

    I don't believe in God because the entire concept has "the mark of fraud stamped upon it" as Thomas Paine eloquently described it. In the first place every conception of God originates from superstition, myth legend and fable. It is the highest most fatal fallacy to set this fact aside in preference to the illusions of indoctrination. Worst of all is the illusion of an immortal soul. The belief that one can cheat death is insane. It is nothing more than the self preservation instinct run amok.

    And this is the bridge the indoctrinaires have for sale: buy this plan, do these tasks, and you will cheat death.

    I believe that future generations will look back to the present age as one marked by naive, foolish and deliberately ignorant people, in denial that the Information Age has long since obsoleted their insane attachment to this, the oldest Establishment.
     
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  9. Photizo Ambassador/Envoy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,519
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2014
  10. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    33,264

    Can you show proof of a soul?
     
  11. Photizo Ambassador/Envoy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,519
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2014
  12. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,503
    I have no opinion on God/do not wish to select one of the above options.
    I don't believe in God now, but I used to.


    I voted the above two, simply because I'm interested in science in general, and see God as an unscientific explanation.
    I see science as pushing back further and further any logical need for any God of any sort.
    I did at one time believe, as I was raised a Catholic and as such was indocrinated with that dogma.
    Finally I have nothing against any religious person, as long as that religious person keeps his or her comments in the religion forum, and as long as they dont set out to deride science and logical scientific concepts.
    Then I will open up with both barrels.
     
    zgmc likes this.
  13. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

    Messages:
    24,690
    I'm a third-generation atheist. I never heard of God until I was about seven. Another little boy was telling me about this fellow named "God" who lives up in the clouds and can see everything we do. I thought it was a really clever story he created, and laughed my head off. I couldn't understand why he didn't appreciate my response.

    When I asked my mother about it, she got a very sad expression and told me that millions of adults believe in that preposterous fairy tale.

    This was the moment when I became a cynic.

    Fortunately I got good grades and was admitted to Cal Tech, where almost all of the other students were atheists too. I learned that if you hang out with brainy, well-educated people, you're less likely to encounter religionists.
     
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  14. Photizo Ambassador/Envoy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,519
    At that same time Jesus was filled with the joy of the Holy Spirit, and he said, "O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, thank you for hiding these things from those who think themselves wise and clever, and for revealing them to the childlike. Yes, Father, it pleased you to do it this way...
    For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. Jews demand signs and Greeks look for wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. For the foolishness of God is wiser than human wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than human strength.

    Brothers and sisters, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. God chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things—and the things that are not—to nullify the things that are, so that no one may boast before him. It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. Therefore, as it is written: “Let the one who boasts boast in the Lord.”
     
  15. zgmc Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    759
    One of the only believers in the poll has the most posts in this thread. It seems they cannot help themselves sometimes...
    I voted, I don't believe in God now, and I never did. I also kind of believed as a small child. I was forced to go to ccd classes and receive the first "holy communion". This was when I was around 7 . By the age of 8 I had already decided it was all a bunch of BS, and refused to go to church any longer.
     
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  16. sculptor Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,498
    how about:
    intuit a motive force which operates within myriad but limited pattern(s) and that goes far beyond energy and matter to things we ain't even dreamed of yet. Within which other forces and entanglements operate within our potential understanding. fragments of fractals ...A crystal with almost infinite faces, and, we're lucky if we can see clearly through one or two.

    If, however: You wish for an opinion on/of the god of abraham and/or moses, then you're too late in asking. they're dead and gone these many centuries, and, it would seem, so too is their interactive god.
     
    KilljoyKlown likes this.
  17. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,188
    Photizo,

    Quite often small children invent imaginary friends to provide comfort, Christians do nothing different except extend the concept into adulthood. A number of surveys consistently show that the better educated and those with higher IQs tend to reject religion. This has little to nothing to do with pride or being boastful, but about an ability to discriminate between credible and non-credible claims. Children are often conditioned with imaginary concepts from Santa Claus to various fairy tales, so for them to create their own imaginary friends is not difficult to understand. They are also ripe for religious conditioning, so it is not surprising that many people begin their lives believing in the Christian stories, myself included. I was was raised in the UK school system 1956 to 1969 where Christianity was taught by law.

    I am not particularly well educated or have much above average IQ - the description of Autodidact fits me quite well since I have been quite successful in my career working in PhD level positions before I retired in 2010, without of course those academic certificates. But I would propose that it was my analytical nature that made me successful and also enabled me to have a high level of discrimination when it came to religious claims.

    Your post/sermon represents one of the many canned pieces of Christian indoctrination that Christianity has developed over its past 2000 year history. They all have a similar approach - attempt to belittle human effort, distort the facts to make it appear that humans are prideful/stupid, and unable to see anything beyond themselves, and of course make it appear that God/Jesus comes out on top. When your text is analysed closely it says nothing of value or factual - it is just pure propaganda.

    For many/most of us who do not believe, it is not because we think we are wise or clever but more the opposite - that there is so much to this universe that is complex and beyond our understanding, and that there is so much to learn - but to crunch it all down to - God did it - is just childlike.

    It was not until I was 18 that I intellectually rejected my Christian upbringing, but those early years of indoctrination took quite a few more years to be expunged entirely from my psyche. But I can fully understand how so many feel the profound comfort of the imaginary Christian god, and will fight fiercely to protect that belief, because without that fantasy there is nothing to replace it, just ourselves and eventual non-existence when we die. People tend to believe whatever they wish despite the lack of evidence or in many cases in spite of the evidence against. The human outlook is not inherently rational or analytical, those traits tend to come from advanced education or higher intelligence, or genetic traits.

    Christianity is entirely mythical, and it is still questionable whether an actual Jesus ever existed. Without any evidence for the existence or possibility that your god could exist, your beliefs are indistinguishable from fantasy. You have simply created an imaginary friend for yourself - backed up by 2000 years of cleverly prepared propaganda and indoctrination texts - take all that away and all you have left is - nothing.
     
  18. Seattle Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,241
    Yes, there should be an option for New Age psychobabble

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    Fragments of fractals...what does that even mean? Crystals are pretty but the physics within them is the same as in a piece of wood.
     
  19. sculptor Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,498
    ergo my hesitation in attempting an explanation
     
  20. Photizo Ambassador/Envoy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,519
    Hi, Chris,

    Good to hear from you. Thanks for taking the time to post what you did and I hope you are enjoying the holidays. Take care.
     
  21. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,188
    Hi Photo - thanks.

    Yes today the winter solstice - the real reason for festivities this time of year - was the day to celebrate. And here in Phoenix AZ the sunsets are superb as I looked across the desert towards the mountains - the view from my home. It would be nice to return to normal tomorrow but huge commercial profits all next week make for extra heavy traffic everywhere - sigh!
     
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  22. cosmictotem Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    747
    I haven't believed in God since I was 22 but I should clarify I do firmly "believe" in a non-religious, non-supernatural, totally naturalistic reincarnation.
     
  23. cosmictotem Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    747
    That is an almost unreal life to me. I would have loved to have had parents like that.
     

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