Religion is stupid

Are you trying to find common ground or be divisive?

 

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I'm defining religion, which you asked me to do.
Now tell me how your scenario involves religion when it's a moral decision?
Or are you under the impression that morals come only from religion?

 

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Gotta go, my apologies. I will respond at a later date.

 

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Hmm... where's that silly, juvenile smilie LG likes?.....

Oh.. there it is-> :roflmao:

 

Oli, with all due respect, what are driving at? Excepting your submitted definition for religion for the sake of this discussion, to the best of my knowledge religions normally have a spiritual head that professes knowledge, principles values and beliefs one should follow.

I don't know what this sentence means:

"tell me how your scenario involves religion when it's a moral decision"

 

The thread is about whether or not religion is stupid: your scenario does not involve religion but morality, which is NOT religion.
Morality does not stem from religion.

 

Not to be smart, please give me a definition of the word "moral".

 

mor·al
Pronunciation:
\ˈmȯr-əl, ˈmär-\
Function:
adjective
Etymology:
Middle English, from Anglo-French, from Latin moralis, from mor-, mos custom
Date:
14th century

1 a: of or relating to principles of right and wrong in behavior : ethical <moral judgments> b: expressing or teaching a conception of right behavior <a moral poem> c: conforming to a standard of right behavior d: sanctioned by or operative on one's conscience or ethical judgment <a moral obligation> e: capable of right and wrong action <a moral agent>2: probable though not proved : virtual <a moral certainty>3: perceptual or psychological rather than tangible or practical in nature or effect <a moral victory> <moral support>

 

Thank you, so we have a compromise to our understanding of these words. Why do you say that people do not derive a moral code from religion?

 

No, I didn't say they don't derive a moral code from religion, I said that religion is not the stem for morality. Religion may add supplementary morality.
There are neurological/ evolutionary origins to morality.

 

Would you agree that "morality" is conformance to a set of morals, and morals are that set? They are not interchangeable to me.

 

Morality is conformance to a given set of morals, yes.
"Morals are that set"? What set?

 

There are different "sets" of morals, thus different moralities, derived differently, one being religion. Have I answered your questions?

 

No: there ARE different complete sets but there are also underlying common moralities.
Religion provides "extras" on top of the biological set.
And, as you have said, religion is only ONE set.
So, once again: morality is not defined solely by religion, therefore the given scenario is not about religion.

 

ok.

 

spidergoat,

Firstly. The "religious" are individual people, with individual reasons as to why they worship God. They also have individual moral codes, much like the non-religious. Some act out of fear, some don't.
To "act morally" is different from being moral.
A moral person, is a good person, a good person can be religious or not.

What is "religious morality"?
Morality stems from goodness, and good intelligence. Groodness includes, kindness, compassion, fairness, empathy, humility, patience, cleanliness, and other virtues.
What real religion does, is help to nuture these qualities, for which there are different processes.

Not at all.
Our morals are formed through our parents, family, freinds, society, our environment. Religion is a way of understanding our selves, God, and ourselves in relation to God.

What you regard as "morals" in religious texts, highlights the position one should be in order to develop a clearer understand of oneself. For example, the 10 commandments were specifically for those people, or people in that position, because they lacked those qualities.
Just as it is expected that someone claiming to be a doctor to have some qualification to support his title, being situated in the mode of goodness is a qualifaction to understanding more about God, and yourself in relation to him.
It is not enough just to say you are religious, or, "i believe in God", to actually be these things in reality.

I believe there is just "morality".
Everybody has morals, or some code which they live by.
I believe there are different levels of morals, according to the different levels of intelligence.

If that is all we have, then we are not human, and there is no question of moral behaviour.

You make it sound as though you can turn on a switch and behave morally because it suits. I guess this is the type of thinking that comes with the idea of TOE.

jan.

 

Reading the above debate, I think religion is ONE basis for ethical behaviour (but perhaps not the only one). To see it as "a bunch of rules and rituals based on some deity and it's need for worship" is a complete travesty.

IMHO, religion is the belief in our inter-connectedness (etymology: latin ligo, ligere to connect or bind), which is why it is a justification for ethics.

If we are expressions of the same Source, we are finite individual parts of an infinite Whole (aka 'God'). To see ourselves as isolated units, forever at war is the road to Hell. To be an essential part of an interconnected, inclusive Whole - the road to Heaven.

That I think is what religion is all about, not the worship of some all-powerful-deity who rewards/punishes us using the 10 commandments.

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Being an atheist who believes in a universal moral code is just as ignorant as being a theist.

 

I feel the same way. So what's with all the talk I hear about religion being the source of morality?

 

People say all kinds of stuff.

jan.