Quantum Physics...scary

Discussion in 'Physics & Math' started by Ankit, Aug 22, 2001.

  1. Ankit The Angel Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    40
    Who believes that the superstring theory that supposedly accounts for all 4 main elements (nuclear: weak and strong, gravity and electromagnetism), and is thus the theory of everything? Einstein couldn't find it, Stephen Hawking is trying to find it...

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    8,616
    Unless I have been misinformed, Stephen won't find it either. He has joined Mr. Einstien at the great chalk board in the sky.
     
  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. Ankit The Angel Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    40
    Wait a sec...

    Surely you jest?
     
  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. Catalyst Registered Member

    Messages:
    5
    scary or not

    Scary or not the advancement of science is a fascinating thing. What will become possible in the time of this generation will have been only the dreems of the last thousand years. In my opinion, for better or worse the future will be glorious.....now if only we can survive it!


    Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the most..
    Catalyst
     
  8. kmguru Staff Member

    Messages:
    11,757
    Somewhere I read, according to physicist Julian Barbour, and Wheeler-DeWitt equation, TIME does not exist. Even the Universe is too small. We live in Platonia, where every instance lives forever. (Plato argued that reality is composed of eternal and changeless forms...). The impression of motion only arises due to a special structure of our perception...

    Some think, that when physicists finally iron out a new theory of the universe, both time and space may not be included...

    Interesting....does that mean everything is predetermined in million ways?
     
  9. Xerxes asdfghjkl Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,830
    I dont believe it

    I dont believe in the superstring theory. They havent even discovered all the energys in the universe yet I believe but eventually maybe in 100 years we will understand. Hawking isnt as smart as he sounds. People just think he is because he sits in a wheelchair and talks funny. common stereotype. He doesnt even measure up to Einstein. Now Einstein was WAY ahead of his time. Imagine, singlehandedly dismissing the ether. Thats what I call smart.
     
  10. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    8,616

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!



    For some reason I have Carl Sagan on the mind, not Stephen Hawking. Stephen still lives... Prehaps you would enjoy this take...

    CAMBRIDGE, ENGLAND--Nobel Prize-winning physicist Stephen Hawking stunned the international scientific community Monday with his latest breakthrough, a remarkably advanced cybernetic exoskeleton designed to replace his wheelchair.
    Hawking, paralyzed since early adulthood with the degenerative nerve disease ALS, unveiled the new creation at a press conference at Cambridge University.
    "I am faster, stronger... better than before," Hawking told reporters via his suit's built-in voice synthesizer.
    The hulking, hydraulically powered titanium-alloy exoskeleton is expected to assist the famed Brief History Of Time author tremendously in his ongoing theoretical physics research. "With the new exoskeleton, Stephen will be able to safely handle radioactive isotopes in the high-radiation area of the new supercollider particle accelerator. And his new robo-arms are capable of ripping open enemy tanks like they were nutshells," said Cambridge physics chair Sir Geoffrey Neville Shropshire-Kent.
    The exoskeleton is also equipped with special infra-vision goggles, which will allow Hawking to observe sub-atomic phenomena firsthand.
    "Wait a minute," said Hawking, testing out the high-tech infra-vision goggles for the first time. "I see now that the curvature of space-time follows previously unmeasured vectors that I will need to recalibrate in my equations. Also, there appears to be some sort of trouble on the moon."
    Among the suit's other features: laser terminals; oxygen pressure-tanks for deep-sea and outer-space research; jet boots; and the most advanced crime-lab database in the world.
    Constructed in Hawking's secret underground headquarters over the last two years by the famed scientist and his orphaned teenage sidekick and research assistant Hawk-Lad, the exoskeleton has already proven invaluable, not only in increasing the paralyzed Hawking's mobility, but in rounding up the notorious international gang of diamond thieves known as "The Fearsome Four."
    The $55 million exoskeleton, which Hawking operates through slight movements of his left wrist, is powered by a pair of bio-morphogenetic servo-motors, and boasts the most advanced cyber-robotic technology anywhere, freeing Hawking of the wheelchair in which he has been confined for much of his adult life and giving him greater freedom of movement when engaged in battle.
    "Beware, would-be evildoers," Hawking said. "My crimefighting powers are as infinite and unknowable as the very universe itself."
    As for the future, Hawking said he plans to continue teaching and hopes to take a sabbatical in Italy with his wife and nurse. But primarily, he will focus on preparing for his greatest mission yet: a descent into a black hole in mid-1998.
    "Only by penetrating the event horizon itself will I be able to observe the effects of singularity on neutrino decay and complete my research," Hawking said. "It should also prove invaluable in the construction of my new Anti-Gravity Gun. It may be our only hope for stopping Monstro, The Living Behemoth."
    Hawking has already received the International Science League award for his invention, as well as a prestigious chair at the Helsinki Cybernetics Institute. He is also widely regarded as the favorite to win this year's Nobel Prize For Physics, and he recently received an honorary key to New York from Mayor Rudolph Giuliani after saving the city from the Galactons.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2001
  11. kmguru Staff Member

    Messages:
    11,757
    I miss him...I was hooked on Cosmos...enjoyed Contact...
     
  12. Tristan Leave your World Behind Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,358
    Same here. I am a little bit through "Cosmos". I want to read More of his books to read including Contact. But first I will probably read Cosmos over and over and over!? With a dictionary at side of course.
     
  13. josharuni Registered Member

    Messages:
    21
    don't down the superstring theory....

    Hey, hey, hey .....it sounds like everyone is dismissing the string theory as a bogus idea...
    It seems rational; everything is made/composed of one dimensional "wavy strings"......
    why not?
    from what I heard there are still some problems to be weeded out, but everythings seems to be pointing in the right direction.

    I am however a little confused about something... if anyone can help me out: what are all those subatomic partciles for - mao's, tao's, neutrinos ....and such???
    I mean, are they just zooming in and out of space and existence for no good reason??? what the hell.

    and another thing..... if anyone has read "the elegant universe" and happened upon the topic of particles "borrowing energy" to do certain things, say......, pop into existence for no good reason! and then pop back out!....can you tell we why then isn't there elephants and bathtubs appearing in weird places at any given moment...?
     
  14. Ankit The Angel Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    40
    Suprstrings

    This is a theory used in particle physics and cosmology that makes use of a one-dimensional object in the form of a line or loop (closed string) to replace the concept of a pointlike elementary particle. Let's say, the the states of a particle may be seen as standing waves along this string. By combining this theory with the idea of supersymmetry, the superstring theory has been created.

    Supersymmetry introduces a hypothetical symmetry between fermions (elementary particle, and this, josharuni , involves muon and tau particles, as well as neutrinos, just elementary particles) and bosons (also similar, Boe-Einstein physics), with new bosonic partners for existing fermions and new fermionic partners for known bosons. Although there is no evidence for this doubling of particles, the concept has been more successful than quantum field theory in approaching a unified field theory involving all four fundamental interactions, as it appears to avoid the infinities that the gravitational interaction creates in other field theories.

    Superstring theory makes use of a ten-dimensional space in which particles appear to have energies far above those attainable in current accelerators. It has not, therefore, been possible to provide direct evidence for the superstring concepts.

    I have lifted part of this from an encyclopaedia, and hope this answers your queries, josharuni.

    This theory is supposedly the closest we come to explaining all 4 natural forces (weak& strong nuclear, electromagnetic and gravity).

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  15. Crisp Gone 4ever Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,339
    Hi josharuni,

    I think most scientists don't dismiss string theory, they just have wait for experimental evidence to support the theory before praising it as if it were THE theory of everything. The problem is that string theory is with us for about 25 years already. Loads of mathematical progress has been made, and there are some very nice things that stringtheory can explain. But that's not really enough: you also more or less need to know if your theory has any ground. So far, string theory has no experimental base whatsoever.

    Well, that would seem totally irrational to me since that immediatelly pops the question "and where are those strings made of" in my mind. They can vibrate, so this more or less implies they are flexible, and hence probalby consistute of smaller parts that are not that flexible.

    I should also mention that in the 3000 years of mathematics in human history, the "point" has always been the smallest possible object. A whole new branch of exotic mathematics has been developed to handle string theory (since in this theory the smallest possible object is a string, not a point).

    So I think string theory doesn't qualify as "rational"

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    .

    I think the answer to that question is a potential Nobelprize-winner. In the 1930's, right before the muon was discovered, scientists had mapped all known particles at that time (which must have been the electron, positron, proton and neutron). In 1934 a completely new particle was observed in the cosmic background radiation, and it was later named "the muon". At the time of discovery, scientists asked themselves "so who ordered the muon?". That question is still unanswered today as far as I know

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    .

    So there is no real reason for these particles: they have been observed and they have been included in our catalog of known particles.

    Well, I never really liked/believed the idea of those particles borrowing their energy and popping into existence, but anyway, the theory says the following: when these particles "borrow" energy, they have to give that energy back within a specific time interval (energy-time uncertainty relation: Delta(E) * Delta(t) > h-bar/2). This time is really incredibly short (for a regular particle this would be around 10^(-40) seconds). So if you want to construct an elephant out of elementary particles, the energy you borrow for that would have to be given back to the universe very - very - fast, too fast for you to even notice there was an elephant in the first place. With our current measuring techniques, we can hardly see the effect of just a few particles popping into existence, so an elephant is definitly way out of our technological reach

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    .

    Bye!

    Crisp
     
  16. Xerxes asdfghjkl Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,830
    hahaa, I got a kick out of that article! Thanks for posting it wet1. I'm glad somebody else on this forum is capable of seeing the humor in the stereotipical belief that hawking is smart because he sits in a wheelchair! I never thought of that guy as a once in a generation genius, although he is undoubtablly a genius it isnt fair to discriminate against the abled like you or me.

    As far as the superstring theory goes, I've almost completely written it off. Sure it sounds catchy but things are alot simpler than that. Maybe too simple for a human mind to comprehend. Space in my opinion is only 0 dimensional. I'm sure there have already been physicysts saying that but I haven't heard of them yet (Im 15) space is nothing so it is 0 dimensional like a paradox or something basically being something yet nothing at all. Opposite of something which would be like a 1 dimensional truth which would account for the existence of everything.

    Anyway I'm losing myself, so I'm gonna shutup now. The best way to look at a unified field theory in my opinion has to be something FAR more simpler than that. So even the most intelligent would have their minds blown. I dont want to sound stupid saying that the superstring theory is not simple but I just dont think that it is simple enough. A string just doesnt sound right to explain everything. once discovered even the stupidest people should have a hard time figuring out how they didnt understand in the first place.
     
  17. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,188
    Wet1,

    Thanks for the humor - nice article.

    String theory - wonderfully imaginative, but overly complex. It is not the right approach.

    Cris
     
  18. Xerxes asdfghjkl Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,830
    what

    you just repeated what said?? are you trying being to sarcastic saying that the string theory isnt complex. maybe to your mind. eventually they will try to say what is in those strings and what is in those things that is in those strings and then what is in those things that is in those things that is in those strings.

    Its just gonna keep going!?!?! That's why it sounds complex to me. How does Hawking think he knows everything?? I dont like that guys ideas.
     
  19. Ankit The Angel Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    40
    Hawking

    Hawking must be very intelligent...he currently occupies the post of Lucasian Professor Of Mathematics at Cambridge University, England, a niche whose previous incumbent was a Sir Isaac Newton.
     
  20. Xerxes asdfghjkl Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,830
    Sure he IS intelligent, no doubt. But that guy gets extra credit cause he sits in a wheelchair and talks funny. I hate that stereotype. People will listen to his every word nowadays 'cause of political correctness, while some other brilliant ideas get overlooked.
     
  21. Ankit The Angel Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    40
    Hmm...

    What's this? Some residual resentment? Are we a brilliant scientist(Elbaz)?
     
  22. Xerxes asdfghjkl Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,830
    what the hell? I openly consider myself stupid. besides I'm 15 I dont care about hawking but the situation in whole. I just think all this pollitical correctness stuff is crazy. Its like when I get older someone less qualified than me gets a better chance at a job because they're disabled or black or something. I got nothing against those people but dont forget there are other scientists out there and other theories that make sense, but nobody gets to hear about them. You probably lived half your life already, but this is the stuff I got to deal with.
     
  23. kmguru Staff Member

    Messages:
    11,757
    Calm down Elbaz. Geniuses do not need crutches. They sign whether they are in a wheel chair or green - because it is the knowledge that counts...

    So, when you get old, remember to shine with "your" knowledge and you will be fine. Dont be afraid to get old...
     

Share This Page