Process, Ethics, and Justice: An Inauspicious Note Regarding the Politics of Rape Culture

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Tiassa, Dec 17, 2017.

  1. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Ok lets look at some rape culture here and how the police deal with it, can anyone tell me how this should have gone down better?



    Does anyone think the two psychos that did this did so because culture told them to?
     
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  3. pjdude1219 screw watergate i want to know about zaragate Valued Senior Member

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    its not slander if its true. your entire outlook is ghoulish and just more of your entitled whinying that the "real victims" white men aren't being taken care of enough. and your right i'm not trying to have an argument with you because your incapable of an honest debate. your entire argument, if you want to call it that, is that sexual assault victims need to nut up and just go to the cops and quite possibly be ignored, have all their actions called into question, and yes quite possiblely be verbally and emotionally harassed. you've shown no knowledge of the issues at hand and zero desire to learn about the issues. you still feel the biggest victims in this are the poor people being accused and not their victims.

    and again calling you out on attacking a belitting is not slandering you you fucking did it. anyone like you who feels the need to belittle assualt victims is by any objective standard an asshole.
     
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  5. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Well that is your perspective, projection, unfalsifiable, untrue, opinion. I do not qualify "white men" as victims. May argument is and has been police and legal actions is the ONLY viable and civil means for recourse for sexual assault, be the victim female or male, despite all the flaws of the justice system (which I have no problems fixing).

    So you have a better alternative? Yes it sucks as I have said so repeatedly: you see that women above, while she still chained to the back of the van they have to photograph it all for evidence, only after that they cut her out. How should they have done that better?

    Nope never said that, for the "real victim" is society and civilization if we allow a system of justice outside the law and without due process. Again if you have a better solution please tell me, I have asked repeatedly now.

    Oh I'm an asshole, boo-hoo, I care about bigger things then your feelings buddy. Why is it so assholish to say victims of assault need to go the police? Why is it so assholish to say social ostracizing of the accused is not proper punishment, is not moral and is an offense to our modern society?
     
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  7. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

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    #eghow | #dontask

    PJ, this corps of advocates aren't actually arguing anything; they're just saying embittered things in hopes of hurting people.

    Because remember, he can take the time out to make up lies as response to discussion of the problems about reporting sexual violence, but still find time↑ to ask, "Why is it so assholish to say victims of assault need to go the police?" That is to say, he can't seem to find the time to get it right.

    The answer, of course, is his persistent refusal to acknowledge and address such issues.

    Furthermore, remember what this equals, behaviorally. After all, he's "totally gettting off on this"↗. And while there is virtually any spectrum we might reasonably devise to describe the self-gratification of demonstrably antisocial behavior, the impulsive displays according to subject matter reiterate undeniable themes. That is to say, as we witness multiple strains of argument functionally requiring safe space for sexual violence itself, note how the variations become more focused and personal to the advocate; at some point, they're not telling us, explicitly, what is on their minds, and the implicit already on the table and spilled to stain walls and carpet—(¿and how did tracks get on the ceiling?)—being all we have to work with, the totems become important.

    'Tis a grim tea and crumpets joke if the reason for carving out an antisafe space is because someday someone might need to make an excuse; to the other, the bit where we're looking over our shoulders, wondering about our own conduct, is actually part of the point. But even such manners of settling up mommy issues, or resentment of ex-wife, or envy of sister, or whatever the hell any one dude's personal problem is, have nothing on wallowing in satellite and tributary rape behavior. Someday, for instance, humans might get around to parsing the psychopathology of robosexuality as a phenomenon other than fetishist masturbation, but mgtows seeking gratification and validation of their masturbatory practices will not be leading the way; so far, they're just a bunch of ignorant wannabes who need to be seen with their envy hanging out.

    We're witnessing particularly focused antisocial behavior, and antisocial is as antisocial does; the focal object, however, is pretty much what it looks like. It's kind of like a poorly-made swiss roll of lard and, y'know, we don't want to know what the other layer is, but the whole point is being jealous of a Ho-Ho.

    Sometimes people want to be seen as dangerous, as if they think there is something stylistic about it. And come on, we both kind of know the general feeling of putting on a don't fuck with me strut and knowing it has an effect. But this? This isn't squaring up your shoulders and meeting a pool shark eye to eye before dusting him off; this is something else. And people who do not share such admiration generally fail to respond kindly when this context of danger is afoot. It's like trying so hard to create a stylish context of danger one actually achieves a projection of danger they cannot control.

    Such determined wallowing in rape behavior is actually somewhat extraordinary. Still, y'know that sentiment we men are supposed to resent, about how we're all dangerous in our own way? Well, yeah. It's okay to acknowledge that from time to time, because in the grand question of sinister or stupid, the difference isn't being smart enough to be sinister, but, rather, smart enough to be stupid in a different way.

    Like the lulzies; we cannot overlook lulzing, yet, even as a fallback, what would any particular lulzy behavior describe? In this case it would still describe wallowing in sentiments and attitudes of rape in order to behave in a particularly focused antisocial manner.

    It's not so much a matter of not worrying about it, because, well, right. Still, though: This is the best he can do. This is his contribution; it is all he has; he apparently cannot do any better. And no, that's not intended as comfort. It's not a matter of not worrying about it because the behavior is determined to be worrisome. So even come a day when he feels cornered enough to tell everyone he's just yanking chains, people won't so easily overlook the months spent seeking some manner of gratification wallowing in rape behavior.

    We get that he wants attention. His priority of focus is telling in its own right.

    Remember, he's not actually making any real argument; he's just wallowing in antisocial behavior focused on themes and attitudes of sexual violence.
     
  8. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    There is that dishonest lying again. I have repeatedly laid down my argument, only to have my arguments ignored and slander by you and your ilk. Let me list them:

    1. Rapeculture is a unfalsifable ideology in line with Ptolemaic epicycles only using emotion as a shield against detailed analysis. I present the alternative hypothesis that rape is caused by a small population of psychopaths devoid of empathy or ability to be told "to just stop" and need to be arrested, imprisoned and treated chemically or surgically. That the majority of men in our western civilized culture already know women are people, want equal rights for women and go out of their way to appease women.

    2. Whinging about rapeculture and naming names on social media is counter to the principles of due process, civility and does nothing productive, it only empowers a counter culture that now has full power of our government include a moronic ignorant pig boar as president, thanks a fucking lot!

    3. For something to be done about rape, sexual assault and harassment one needs to go the police or at the very least sue. Yes the justice system is not nice, if you want that improved I recommend arguing specifically for that instead of turning a plurality of the electorate against us by insinuating they are inherently evil.

    Are you saying SAM did not say that?

    And that is?

    What issues? Give me "such issues", be specific.

    ... hail satan! You forgot to quote the "hail satan" part, because your either too stupid or intentionally trying to misquote me and remove any sign I was joking.

    What safe space for sexual violence? Where can't the police go?

    That is some gross projection there.

    What rape behavior? Who am I going to rape? Cartoons?

    Envy for what? Having money to spend, no responsibilities but to ourselves? It leads the way in japan, even in mouse models it leads the way, all you have is spiet.

    Dangerous? How am I dangerous? I treat women like men, I don't touch them, I accept no come ons, especially from a co-worker or student, and I advocate a life of sexual detachment from harmful want and redirection of sexual energy to harmless forms. What danger is that? The extinction of men; I don't care, you don't care, who cares?

    What are you jabbering about? What makes me dangerous???

    What "rape behavior"? That is mindless slander?

    Complete mindlessness from you.

    lulzies? "sentiments and attitudes of rape"?

    What rape behavior? Who am I going to rape?

    Well then ignore me, and stop talking about me and slandering me.

    How so?

    Once again:

    1. Rapeculture is a unfalsifable ideology in line with Ptolemaic epicycles only using emotion as a shield against detailed analysis. I present the alternative hypothesis that rape is caused by a small population of psychopaths devoid of empathy or ability to be told "to just stop" and need to be arrested, imprisoned and treated chemically or surgically. That the majority of men in our western civilized culture already know women are people, want equal rights for women and go out of their way to appease women.

    2. Whinging about rapeculture and naming names on social media is counter to the principles of due process, civility and does nothing productive, it only empowers a counter culture that now has full power of our government include a moronic ignorant pig boar as president, thanks a fucking lot!

    3. For something to be done about rape, sexual assault and harassment one needs to go the police or at the very least sue. Yes the justice system is not nice, if you want that improved I recommend arguing specifically for that instead of turning a plurality of the electorate against us by insinuating they are inherently evil.
     
  9. Bells Staff Member

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    22,660
    Mod Note

    Numerous studies, articles and stories have been posted to explain why victims are reluctant to contact the authorities after being sexually assaulted. You have victims telling you why.

    To keep making the same demand, that is frankly designed to question the veracity of what victims have endured and to cast doubt on their assaults, despite all evidence that is literally telling you why they don't "go to the police", goes beyond trolling.

    In effect, you are pushing what is tantamount to a myth or conspiracy to cast doubt on victims for the sake of embracing rape culture. I mean, people keep asking for examples of rape culture and you are the perfect example.

    More than half of your country's population are or will be victims of sexual assault. How you can think that something that detrimentally affects the lives of more than half your population is somehow 'smaller' than other issues you think are more important, says more about you as a human being than it does about anything else.

    Put simply, it's not just "assholish" to say that victims should just go to the police, it is inherently cruel and downright evil to demand that victims subject themselves through second rape to fit your misogynistic ideal of how victims should behave.

    You might not care about his feelings or the feelings of any other victim (that has been clear in your posting on this site), and that's on you. Empathy and understanding is a foreign concept for you. To wit, we aren't all psychopathic arseholes like you. But if you keep acting like a psychopath, I will treat you like one. And if you think mocking and demeaning victims like this is acceptable, then I'd suggest you think again.
     
  10. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I think anyone who hurts or disrespects another male or female should be executed.

    Motivation by fear is not the only motivation but it works reasonably well and shows that everyone needs to treat the issue seriously.

    Nothing short of extreme will work.

    There should be a special place where women can report sexual attack set up for the sole purpose of investigating all complaints in a manner where victims feel secure and respected with a legal team to assist seeking convictions.


    Hollywood needs to change so as to present women as real people and not as objects only on the planet to provide sex to males.

    Hollywood must present violence as wrong and the way of the loser and that being peaceful is the new cool.

    The various religions need to get away from sex is sinful and stop screwing up folks thinking that has them developing odd attitudes to sex and women.

    The image of the playboy gifted by Hugh H. must be shown to be totally uncool.

    The Spartens had the right idea, let the women run everything and let the boys play war games.

    Alex
     
  11. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    Do you have a reference for that?

    It would be for (different board) another argument purposes.
     
  12. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    If you need a reference I could look for one however that would deprive you of the joy of investigating their approach to life.
    I bet wiki will cover it.
    Let me see what I can find for you.
    Alex
     
  13. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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  14. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah thank for being unbiased

    yeah and that makes twitter the alternative how?

    First all my demand is not designed to question the veracity of the victim, it is to get the guilty arrest, imprisoned or treated. It is to have due process for a serious crime, not relegate such crimes to internet gossip like twitter.

    Once again if you want making going to the police easier nice process sure, that has nothing to do with the illegitimacy of anonymous accusations on social media.

    Ask for due process for a serious crimes is rape culture? This is what I mean by unfalisifiable, any counter argument to rape-culture is rape-culture, this is cult level ideology.

    yeah I have been, what is your point? I care more about jobs and healthcare then getting my ass pinched again.

    Yeah I don't care what you think of me, I care about things bigger then me, like this country not being ruled by a moronic ignorant pig boar. Once again review the facts: American voted for that pussy grabber, a majority of white women, 47% of women, clearly enough Americans simply do not care about sexual harassment.

    Oh boy and you have a better alternative to going to the police? What would that be?



    No your imagining I'm "demeaning" victims, I'm asking for due process because what you are demanding leads to far more victims and rights being stripped and conservative rule. Look you and Tiassa have called me a misogynist, implied in primed to rape(?), dangerous, and your call me an "psychopathic arsehole"... do you have an actually argument? I argue that your tactic of slandering anyone that questions your ideology has created the counter culture that has gotten Donald Trump elected as president, donald fucking trump.

    Back to the issue here: A women has been sexually assaulted or harassed, what should she do?
     
  15. Bells Staff Member

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    I am not talking about twitter or social media, EF.

    There are books, studies, articles on the matter.

    Here:

    https://www.researchgate.net/public..._Experiences_With_Community_Service_Providers
    https://www.amazon.com/Second-Rape-Societys-Continued-Betrayal/dp/0669271896
    http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/088626001016012002
    https://mainweb-v.musc.edu/vawprevention/research/victimrape.shtml

    Are just some.

    So when you repeatedly argued about victims being "adults" and reporting it to the police and when you repeatedly commented on how that is when they should be taken seriously, you weren't questioning the veracity of what the victims experienced?

    Not only do you belittle victims when you do that, but it goes directly to raising questions as to why they did not report it to the police, thereby questioning the veracity of their claims.
    For example:

    This kind of rubbish does raise questions about the veracity of what these victims are reporting.

    Do you know why women are coming forward with the #MeToo hashtag? Because there is comfort in numbers, they know they aren't alone and they have a world full of other victims to support them. To declare that these victim's claims are somehow illegitimate because they posted it on social media and because you assume they did not take it to the authorities is devaluing what they experienced and it does lessen the crimes committed against them.

    Not only that, you seem to think that all it would take would be to make going to the police an "easier nice process". We aren't asking for "nice". It's about being treated as a victim of a crime. I mean, surely you can't be that obtuse?
    Due process for whom?

    You are pushing a line that women in particular, are lying when they say they have been sexually assaulted because they have not fulfilled your ideal of how rape victims should behave.

    You are pushing a myth and conspiracy, one that is inherently damaging to victims. And you are hiding behind the words "due process" to do so.
    Well great for you!

    Your employment and healthcare is not affected. Sexual assault victim's are affected, in that they are denied access to healthcare, doctors don't take them seriously, rape kits are either fumbled or not done or processed, the police treat victims like criminals and they can and do lose their jobs, they aren't given access to mental healthcare to treat the psychological trauma.

    Your vapid 'I care more about jobs and healthcare then getting my ass pinched again' is a means to dilute the effects of sexual assault on victims, your demand for due process, is not about protecting the victim, but about protecting the accused only, you demand victims go to the police, while ignoring what happens when they do report it to the police.

    The reason people voted for the "pussy grabber" is because rape culture has watered down these offenses and there is a culture of making excuses for it to the benefit of the men who commit these crimes.

    Why are you aiding and abetting that, EF?

    When you embrace that culture as you are, when you excuse it as you have been, when you defend it as you have been, then it normalises it. You are a part of that cycle.

    I have already cited the changes that need to occur at the police level to start to fix the issues. You responded by whining about how you think this would affect the accused. By doing so, you completely ignored the fact that these changes would ensure the police investigated each case properly, ensuring "due process" for the accused and not victimising the victims even further.

    You keep asking the same thing over and over again and ignoring what has been said, repeatedly.

    You are essentially trolling to defend rape culture.
    Again, due process for whom?

    Because you have already shown loud and clear that you don't care about the victims. You are only concerned about your healthcare and jobs, while ignoring how 'second rape' results in lack of access to healthcare and employment for victims and is geared towards protecting the abusers.

    You demean victims by demanding they behave in a certain way, despite all evidence of what happens to them when they do adhere to what you demand of them, and you are doing so to protect the accused and condone the crimes. I think you are a psychopath because you seem to lack the ability to show any form of empathy or understanding for pain in others and the joy you seem to get in causing further pain and you seem to believe that you are well within your rights to behave this way. Your utter lack of remorse for your own behaviour, your selfishness has shone through. To wit, you behave like a psychopath towards victims and I will treat you like a psychopath. I believe I made that point quite clearly.

    And if you want to know why your fellow Americans voted for Trump, look in the mirror. It's that same inability to feel empathy for others, that played a huge part in it. And you have displayed that in spades here.
     
  16. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    Not just the Spartans - (a bit of a myth, but not entirely) - but several of the long-range raiding and hunting outfits: some members of the Iroquois Confederacy, some Scandinavian and Scot tribes, some Central African tribes, etc.

    When the Brits conquered the Picts, one of the most significant changes imposed was the elimination of inheritance through the female line - the house, the physical property of domestic life, belonged to its makers and caretakers in several cultures now subsumed under "Western" hegemony. That institutional setup had to be broken by physical, military, force.

    Inheritance of household wealth from mother to daughter makes fundamental sense in many circumstances, and the sheer nonsense or fantasy/delusion aspect of patriarchal inheritance of property (on top of the abstraction of "property" itself) is revealing.

    The mental confusion - the strange inability to register the simple facts of what is in front of them - we find in the early accounts of Western patriarchal observers of these people, is at once comical and tragic. My own favorite example is the beehives found in the stained glass windows of older Christian cathedrals - most of them, and the tradition of them, date to when bees were thought to exemplify Christian ideals of selflessness and purity of effort, the incorruptibility of honey and its goodness the sign and symbol, the keeping of bees a suitable devotion of monks. And then the Very Odd Discovery: bees had no king. Bees were governed entirely by female authority. And the reaction? Confusion, complicated theological rehab, and often silence. Bees quietly set aside, and not spoken of as much, and the little picture in the stained glass window become more of a decoration or minor puzzle of casual observation, occasionally a minor lesson in humility and industry. Not a model of the Christian ideal society any more, but a lesson for individuals.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrilineality
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2017
  17. parmalee peripatetic artisan Valued Senior Member

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    In North America, the Hopi, as well.
    For me, this extends as well to the inability of both anthropologists and ethologists to recognize the non-hierarchical, egalitarian social organization amongst both human and social non-human animals, as well, i.e., the myth of the "Alpha wolf," and the marked differences in social structures between those raised/kept in captivity and those in their natural environs.

    This kinda makes the "mental confusion" aspect to be more of a willful ignorance nature--as Chomsky (and others) have noted: it ain't out of ignorance that the likes of Kropotkin, von Uexkull, et al, aren't "officially" accorded their place amongst the rightful founders of ethology and animal behavior studies.
     
  18. parmalee peripatetic artisan Valued Senior Member

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    Part of the reason I'm having difficulty resolving the matter of whether it's willful stupidity or genuine we are witnessing here is this.

    I have no doubt that misogyny primarily lay at the root here, with both EF and Kitt (though perhaps of slightly different natures--one being pretty deeply entrenched, the other seeming more like knee-jerk defensiveness), but one really has to wonder how some can entertain such ridiculously simplistic, binary views of things. You have one person saying things like, "there is no rape culture," and then citing the fact that "America elected the pussy garber Trump" as somehow supportive (?!) of this, and then another person thinking lifeboat ethics (the trolley problem) is somehow applicable here--with no glaring ambiguity--and both going on about "due process" (for whom?). It's just bizarre.

    I mean, it just seems that the stupids, and plain old lack of critical thinking ability, is also factoring here. Bigly. Either that, or some people simply don't mind appearing stupid to their audience.


    Edit: There's also that "social media is stupid--I use researchgate" consistently coming from the guy who regularly "cites" Youtube troll bullshit and calls it "science." I mean, what the fuck?!
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2017
  19. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Well I have been! My argument is we can't move to some internet mob form of justice, that all we have is police and courts for settling crimes, you seem to argue that is not enough? what more do you want?

    Yes! How are these crimes to be punished if they don't go to the police? What alternative are you asking for?

    Well then we have a catch 22 here, they need to go to the police, but can't be told because it 'belittles' them and questions their claims. Then how are they going to get to the police?

    Oh so you want claims reported on social media taken as abject truth, no, no pretty sure you don't want that you child murdering cannibal you.

    Yeah like children, worse like sheep, no worse like a coven of 11600s colonial american school girls: there is comfort in numbers and if they call cry "witch!" no one will question them all! I would think privately going to the police about being violated would be more comfortable, at least that is something I would expect from adult human beings that women are, not the child like angelic beings of fragile gossamer you seem to treat them as. Airing that across the internet just does not make sense as a form of comfort, it does make sense as a form of attention seeking though.

    So no I counter your argument on why so many women come forward with the #MeToo hashtag: Because they are seeking attention and popularity via social media, social media: bane of our times because people have not adapted to use them properly, like researchgate.

    Well nothing can be done, because they did not go to the police, did not sue, nothing can be done... except of course raise an internet mob to harass the accused, which would be wrong, immoral, slander and counter productive because it would create a counter culture like the one we have that has elected Donald Trump as president.

    yeah sure, and that would entail what exactly?

    For the accused. I'm not going to advocate jabbing electrodes into someones brain willy-nilly.

    That is projection, I have repeatedly stated the same thing for men, I have repeatedly stated the nature of our judicial system is prone to type II error for a reason, that it is consider better to let criminals go free then imprison innocent people, that the social damage of a draconian kangaroo court system would be worse. My argument is the necessity for due process, a justice system of police and courts for arresting accused and determining guilt, over a popular opinion/lynch mob/tar and feathering system of justice you are either intentionally or unintentionally advocating for.

    What myth? That people lie? that social hysteria happen? Did the satanic panic not happen, did McCarthyism not happen, did Salem not happen?

    yes, truly a shame, so we prioritize that issue and oh look who wins the presidency, oops. Here in the USA EVERYONE (that not rich) is denied access to healthcare, to psychological healthcare, and yes people do lose their jobs and file bankrupts here when they get sick and can't pay for treatment, that problem people care about MORE, they are so despite for better jobs, stable income, stable healthcare, a stable future, that they are willing to elect a huksters over a traditional politicians who has failed them one election cycle after another.

    Yeah and? what do you want to fix when they report to the police, i'm sure we can agree on things there.

    unfalsifiable!

    Why are you murdering and eating children?

    unfalsifiable!

    and I said I agree, we have no problems there. So what more do you want?

    Well thank you for answering my questions now, so we can do away with using social media to call out sexual harassers?

    For the accused. You have been arguing for social media as a form of calling out and harassing sexual harassers, have you not?

    Incorrect. As long a republicans rule nothing you ask for, improvements in police, etc, can happen, and social hysterias like #metoo movement does nothing to change that, in fact it aids the republicans by making liberals look bad. So in order to win elections and get reform to the justice system, we need to priorities which issues we evangelize to what most people care about most.

    But there is no legitimate alternative way to behave. It is either go to the police, or nothing happens, going to social media just makes problems worse for everyone, except on average republicans.

    I have said repeatedly what needs to be done to the accused, that can't happen without a court of law. Harassing the accused, their employer, getting them fired or force to resign or expelled does not provide justice for a crime.

    and I think you eat children. Now does it matter what I think, no, so it does not matter what you think either.

    Yeah well that inability can't be fixed by whinging about it on social media.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2017
  20. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

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    Did you notice that at no point does he appear to understand what the term due process actually means?

    I mean, I'm not disagreeing with your point; his construction is obvious. Still, though, nowhere in any of this whining about due process has our neighbor demonstrated any actual understanding of the term.

    Which in turn might be why he keeps coming back to the term without addressing the details of the discourse around it; he cannot address those details if he does not understand how they work. To wit, if we set his epicycle argument↑ up for scrutiny and defense, I mean, really, how is anyone supposed to take that string of words seriously? It's not a matter of being indefensible, but, rather, incoherent clapscat. No wonder he won't pitch it in any other context than petulant retort to the human rights of women.

    Nor can we forget the tremendous overlap with his Title IX incoherence↗ about institutional disruptions to reporting and prosecution of sexual violence.

    In a month that saw a leading American employer commit to ending forced arbitration for sexual harassment and violence claims, Hollywood continues to ripple as word circulates of an effective blacklist against sexual harassment victims, and accused Congressmen continue to prefer that what happens in Congress stays within Congress, one of the reasons our neighbor cannot seem to address reality might well be simple ignorance.

    Then again, neither something about sadism goes here; I think the hip formulation is, reaction↑ formation↑ much?

    To the one, the behavior pursues empowerment; to the other, it does so in the manner known for demonstrable failure; to the beeblebrox, target package or victim typology, such as it is, reminds a certain measure of sloth. In these United States, it's really easy to bully women if one has nothing else to wield against self-perceived inadequacy.
     
  21. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Oh by all means do tell. Explain what due process actually means then.

    Everything else you say is just projection and slander against and argument I have laid down time and time again that your ilks tactics and priorities have cost us the whole fucking government and put donald trump in power as president. reality is a lot of things, it is 1/5 child dying of malaria in southern and central africa, do you care, I never see you talk about that, rather your obsessed over upper to middle class usually white women being sexually harassed or assaulted, yes serious crimes, horrible, but not as important negating and even attacking those that demand attention on issues that win elections and not lose to the likes of Donald Trump. Worse your ilk slanders any counter arguer and produces an air of misandry that has empowered the right, no worse the alt-right, your demands for a female president regardless that she was the most un-electable candidate we have ever put forward, and that anyone that questioned that as a misogynist, cost us everything. And yet you have not learned, what do you want done about Hollywood sexism, whinge about it? Demand special laws? How with the republicans in power?

    I don't really qualify Youtube as social media, it is just TV to me.
     
  22. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

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    It sounds almost like a scold, I know, but (ahem!) if we pay close enough attention, the (cough!) "whinging" will make its point.

    I know it's obscure, but I come from a time that learned words like "blacklist", applied to notions like being a communist, or not hating black people, or being too nice—or too mean, as some accusations went—to Jews. In a way, it makes perfect sense to me that the outer boundary, the threshold that should not be crossed, is women telling each other who is dangerous.

    Hey, here's a note on social punishment: Tom Schweich; Spence Jackson. To clarify, since the point feels vital, while it seems nearly an impossible task to explain the notions of social punishment↑ that lead to a body count↱ in the wake of being accused of being Jewish, neither am I surprised at the suggestion that the absolute line to be drawn on word of mouth is women protecting one another against sexual assault.

    That is to say, I don't know what to tell you about our neighbor, but he clearly hasn't any substantial clue what he's on about. It's all just word salad in his case. No, really. Just stand by for the lecture on epicycles↑; it cannot fail to be enlightening.
     
  23. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

    Messages:
    13,781
    I guess my big issue in all of this is that I don't see an effective solution being put into place following the path that things are headed down. At best it may result in a slight net positive but, I fear, that far more likely we are going to simply further inhibit and encumber victims who come forward and seek justice, primarily due to the increased scrutiny they will undergo as a result of things like this:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/31/us/politics/sexual-harassment-politics-partisanship.html

    Once sexual harassment is turned into a political power play (and you can be sure that it will, if certain parties are given the opportunity to do so), I can only imagine how much easier it will become for powerful people to simply wave away accusations as "fake news" or whatever the motto of the month is, leaving victims stuck without recourse yet again.
     

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