Posting to Ethics may be wasted effort

Discussion in 'SF Open Government' started by zanket, Jan 22, 2003.

  1. zanket Human Valued Senior Member

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    In the Ethics, Morality, & Justice forum in this thread the moderator said:

    And he deleted all the posts in the thread except his own.

    (This may be better for Site Feedback but I'm not able to delete it to move it.)
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2003
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  3. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

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    Posting in any forum might be a wasted effort

    Given how rude the lot of us are, there's not much point to posting anywhere. Christians, finally getting around to possibly discussing the problems of their own house, get sidetracked by atheists who won't let them be. Topics better-suited to other forums get put in the wrong place because posters don't care (and this is a fine place for this topic, unless of course you'd rather make it an official complaint, in which case Site Feedback ... I know, I know). Topics get buried by long strings of news topics that, quite often, nobody's going to debate because nobody takes issue with them, and how much of a hallelujah chorus can we really put up with before we go stark raving bonkers? (Geez, for the first time in months that Adam and I didn't fight, someone dared mock us for "mutual backscratching" ... I mean, we're not even allowed to agree on anything, apparently.)

    Moderators are here to fix all that. Dave went as long as possible without moderators, and they've done well for a bunch of folks learning on the fly. There was a time when our posters actually cared about keeping the forums organized and being relatively polite to one another, but those days are past. My old example of an ugly board was Parascope, and that place doesn't exist anymore insofar as I can tell. I'd rather this place not go the same way.

    And, frankly, I support Asguard's stand against the idiocy that goes on. I'm all for acrimonious debate, but most of our posters don't know how to insult one another effectively. It's not just a matter of one-upmanship. Having the bigger stick means nothing if you can't hit the broad side of a barn with it.

    Free speech is a pretty cool thing. But it's not a guarantee here. Technically, I'm one of the most notorious violaters of the TOA, but anyone who's been around long enough knows I escalated to that point over time. One of the reasons I never wanted to be a Mod here is because I would be tyrannical. Asking such simple things as relative civility and posting in the right forum doesn't seem like a whole lot to ask.

    Wasted speech, however, is a fucking tragedy. And no, here it is not a right. It never has been. Our host and moderators have been quite kind in the sense that they let us carry on and be insanely rude to one another here; but if giving two seconds' consideration to the TOA is too much to ask, perhaps we need the kind of moderators I ran into at a video game board (TacOps) who wouldn't let anyone say anything bad about the product, or perhaps those at the Christian boards I've seen who won't tolerate anything but mushy affirmation of Christian faith.

    If a moderator demanding the civility we posters agreed to is really that problematic, there are always other boards to go to.

    thanx,
    Tiassa

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  5. Asguard Kiss my dark side Valued Senior Member

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    thanks tiassa for the surport

    zanket you will also notice i deleted those posts favoring me, The thread was there for a reason and i made the mestake of leaving it open in the first place

    i would also remind you of what you agreed to

     
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  7. zanket Human Valued Senior Member

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    That's fine, but I'm talking about the posts that were not obscene, vulgar, sexually-orientated, hateful, threatening, or otherwise violative, but still deleted.

    Although posts may be deleted for any reason, I certainly wouldn't bother if that was done capriciously. If you inadvertantly left the thread open, that's okay.
     
  8. ndrs The Anti-Cthulhu Registered Senior Member

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    tiassa gave me an idea.. Why don't we, instead of sending insults organize net-games like Quake. We could blow our anger out this way.. I am sure this would be perfect for Adumb, he loves being a little soldier.
     
  9. *stRgrL* Kicks ass Valued Senior Member

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    Zanket

    Sorry to bring this to your attention, but you will find that certain moderators do not know the meaning of being moderate. I saw this happen mid-last year in another forum (I will not mention any names here) but I am in total disagreement. I think the reason for a moderator is make sure things are not getting out of hand in a thread - not delete anything they do not disagree with. Also some of them are on power trips and will delete threads to fulfill their need to be powerful.

    In other words - dont take it personal. Just dont post in their forum anymore.

    This would be fine Tiassa if Asguard wasnt only acting the same "idiotic" way and crying like a 2 year old that just had his rattle taken away everytime he doesnt agree with you on something. If he was free from acting this way then I would say "Fine, delete away" but the sad truth is he is not. And until you give members around here the same descency you put out - you shouldn't have the authority to delete anything you want to.

    Just my take on it anyways... without my coffee yet of course

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  10. goofyfish Analog By Birth, Digital By Design Valued Senior Member

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    Without your coffee?!?!?!
    Holy crap, girl.. it's NOON!!
    Sleep the whole day, why don'tcha!

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  11. ndrs The Anti-Cthulhu Registered Senior Member

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    Actually, I prefer the idea, of not having moderators, but rather allowing the _thread creator_ to delete posts. That way there would be more order, don't you think?
     
  12. goofyfish Analog By Birth, Digital By Design Valued Senior Member

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    A very interesting thought... but what would prevent them from causing the same type of problem being alleged here - deleting posts that present an opposing point of view?

    :m: Peace.
     
  13. ndrs The Anti-Cthulhu Registered Senior Member

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    Eh.. nothing.. you could create your own thread though!
    Also you could judge by the creator, if posting is worth it. Hmm, maybe deleting a post would require a comment.
    It's sort of decentralized anarchy!

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  14. *stRgrL* Kicks ass Valued Senior Member

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    Goof,
    Hey! I had a late night

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    And FYI - I think you are an exemplary moderator. (even though I dont agree with shit you say)

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  15. zanket Human Valued Senior Member

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    I second that.
     
  16. goofyfish Analog By Birth, Digital By Design Valued Senior Member

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    Guess I better delete that!

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  17. *stRgrL* Kicks ass Valued Senior Member

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    Naa, your way too moderate for that

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  18. Captain_Crunch Club Ninja Valued Senior Member

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    I dont agree in what asguard did. I dont agree that he doesnt give a damn, he is a mod and should care.
    I dont agree with the principles of mod election (The poll method)

    Isnt the point of forums to have free and open discussion, opinions and all that shit? If a power crazed mod (or someone who doesnt take their responsabilities seriously) deletes a whole thread mearly because it doesnt agree with him, doesnt that sort of defeat the purpose of the forum?

    I think the actions of Asguard needed looking into.

    Just because i think Asguard is an alright guy and have had many discussions on msn with him, doesnt mean im gonna hide my opinion of his action.

    No offence or anything Asguard.

    Cheers.

    edit - I havnt witnessed the deleting of posts in Sciforums before never mind 10+ posts.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2003
  19. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

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    Comparatively, stRgrl

    I agree that our moderators bear an additional burden of conducting themselves better than the common rabble; it's one of the reasons I never asked to be moderator when Dave was looking for people to undertake the responsibility. But ... "crying like a 2 year old (yadda-yadda-yadda)"? Maybe I'm just not up to speed; I was happy when he called for an end to hostility in his forum. It would have been nice if people had paid attention. But life is a learning process, and yes, he should have made it a sticky the first time around, and I'm not going to fault him for learning on the fly.

    And it's not so much to ask that a debate focus on its ethical issues in an Ethics Forum (see "Homosexual Laws") instead of resting on "God says" and stupid accusations of demonic infection or possession or whatnot.

    This site was never meant to be fully anarchic. I used to joke that when Dave got rid of banners once upon a time, it was because nobody would want to advertise to this lot. Imagine if you went to see where your ad service was placing your ads and you found your audience to be as ridiculous as we have been in the past, are now, and will be in the future. I wouldn't want to waste the money.

    We've always been flashy and biting at this site, but people are ridiculous if they expect free license to tromp all over the place without restraint.

    There is also the consideration that some posters just don't get it until you cuss them out. I don't feel sorry for the people who feel stung. Even I've transgressed Asguard's request, and also the TOA on a number of occasions. Do I feel particularly guilty about it? Not a whit. But one thing I don't do is get offended when the forum moderator seeks to bring a forum back to its intended limits, as they are, technically, limits I agreed to respect.

    We've still a ways to go before moderation gets so out of hand as to resemble other posting boards I've seen. In the meantime, a little more civility around here would be nice. And if the moderators have to cram it down our throats, so be it. The only question remaining is "Spit or swallow?"

    thanx,
    Tiassa

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  20. CounslerCoffee Registered Senior Member

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    It's okay! Your coffee is here now. /Bad Cheesy Joke

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    I think that sometimes mods get thrown into bad moods. Ive seen a mod get very mad before (different forum site) and just start deleting a certain members posts. Why did he do this? He was mad! We have to remember that mods have feelings to, they get angry, they can be happy, and if not well fed; can die.
     
  21. spookz Banned Banned

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    6,390
    crap!

    keep your personal shit out of modding. impartiality is the key! if you cant maintain that, take a hike
     
  22. The Marquis Only want the best for Nigel Valued Senior Member

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    Re: Comparatively, stRgrl

     
  23. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    31,639
    I think the moderators here are pretty fair, from what I've seen (though obviously I'm a bit biased). If anything, we tend to err on the side of being too permissive of insults directed at other posters.

    In my time as moderator, I think I have probably deleted around 5 threads. One of those was a mistaken repeat-post which appeared elsewhere; another deletion was requested by the person who posted the thread in the first place. Then, there are cases where a poster cross-posts to several different forums, and the occasional post which is either completely off-topic or nonsensical (though even those are more often moved than deleted).
     

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