# of jobs vs quality?

It's simple, once a long time ago this fellow on the forums told me something in a thread of mine, he said a job doesn't matter if it's so meager you cannot earn a living off doing it. So while Americans may have more jobs than other countries or perhaps more are generated every year, even so, the quality is what counts. He said who cares if there are jobs when they don't pay you enough to survive....

Do you concur with this fellows opinion? I seem to think this logic is unmistakable... so what if we have thousands of new jobs each year, if they pay minimum wage they might as well not exist?!

Determine what you think then tell us.

 

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This is sometimes called the "MacDonaldization" of jobs. E.G. fired auto workers take jobs at half or less of the previous pay. MacDonald's has actually taken some legal steps agains some newspapers who refer to low pay / benefits as "MacJobs." They point to the many advantages, other than money, MacDonalds provides in their ads now to fight the critical idea that the real MacJob is an undesirable job, but that is what "MacJob" has come to mean.

For several years now the average wage in US has been going down in real terms (purchasing power) This is complex.For example, some of this is due to the fact that high salary baby boomers are retiring and the average age of the worker is falling slightly. (Generally the older you are, the more you make.)

All in all, it is very different from China, where the average wage is rapidly rising, so much so that China can no longer compete with other lower wage areas in Asia. China is getting out of low value added production - it has to. Why china now makes all he world's computers, most of the other complex electronics, but lets others do the simple things like airconditioners and micro waves. China now builds it airplanes, cell phones of its design, is a space going nation, world leader is some areas -(computer games, pebble bed nuclear reactors, magnetic levitated trains* etc.)
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*They have the only one in world in regular commercial service and the highest rail line in world, which needs to supply passengers with oxygen, but their mag train was a German design.) US is falling behind, as it "MacDonalizes" and out sources the higher paying jobs (but not the very highest ones - US CEOs still claim them.)

 

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So what do you think the final effects of this will be? After-all I think this fellows statements were right and a sign of the collapse of US economics. You see the business models we've gone by here are not sustainable. Who wants to work for miniumum wage? And if they don't then who? What happens when people stop working even though they may be homeless? Can they even survive on minimum wage?

Better still is the question why have minimum wages at all? Set the price for any job at a fixed level that's sustainable. Let companies deal with the after-effects... if companies are forced to pay real wages then they must rebuild how their organization works, but in the end it would be for the best.

No one is going to have a job very soon, the middle class is falling apart and land prices are increasing, in all honesty the US is doomed now. You see in China there is honor, here there is greed. Companies are nothing in the US compared to outside it...

Now let me say I really would like to see homeless all over, then the gerks running it all can say "oops we should've hired them for wages that are real".

I'm babbeling now, so ummm jobs suck.

 

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Everyone has a different version of what it takes to "survive".

Me and my GF live below the poverty line(in Canada!) for a family with 2 kids, "somehow" we manage to make ends meet + 2 vehicles a detached house and still sock away some gold.

People(in general) spend too much money and they don't know how good they have it(in general) right now.

 

I live very comfortably on $24,000 per year. that's $2,000 per month. And I'm making house payments, insurance on car and health insurance, and, of course, food and utilities.

People have the misconception that frivilous entertainment should be part of that living. And usually those who have that opinion are the ones who complain the loudest.

Baron Max

 

Who cares if you can't get hired into a job that can't afford your level of incompetence?

Who cares if you aren't willing to work more than one job to survive.

Nature is biased toward the surviving doer.

 

Sometimes Nature also favours, the milkman-backdoor man, that really cool rastaman, the guy with a big dick, the girl with the big tits, the MILF rumoured to have a tight snatch and yes even Diogenes of Sinlope the world's greatest bum EVAR, got to donate semen into Phryne, the best Courtesan in Corinth...Just because she thought he was so witty.

So in short, even joe blow clerk has something to add to the world.

 

Joe Blow clerk has a job.

The beginning whine was 'no satisfying job could be had due to outside inconveniences'.

Similar to wondering why mommy isn't seemingly interested in helping one find a teet to suckle, because she suspects a future deficiency of contributive productivity.

 

What can he add that a gazillion others can't add in like manner? And if that's true, then that just shows conclusively that Joe Blow ain't very valuable to the society as he or you seem to think! Remember those lessons in "Supply and Demand"? They're valid for people, too.

Baron Max

 

All I'm saying is, it's another pair of dice added to life's big crapshoot. Frankly some people(yes here on this forum as well) just plain think their shit don't stink. Guess what in the grand scheme of the universe(for effect think oh say 1000 light years aways) we are ALL pretty fucking small. For instance from where i'm sitting you are as big a waste of skin as he. At least he is not half the hating racist(thus destructive) as you are. He at least wants to add value(breed with a female lol).

Conversely from another perspective we are all significant. Not everything fits so nicely in elitest heirarchy's of power, intelligence or what the fuck ever.

 

Boy, ain't that the fuckin' truth!!

No, we aren't! And I think that's one of the major problems in the world today ....people thinking that they really do mean something to others. They don't! People are killing other people because they think that they're more important than the victims. We have people robbing others simply because they think their needs are greater than the victims. We've lost sight of the importance of society and it's members, as well as family.

We ain't important ....any more than one drop of water is important to the ociean of the world.

Baron Max

 

Employment based world must be either abolished or reformed. Until 95% of the population depends on a paycheck, it's a nation of slaves putting their brains on the shelf and sticking their tongues in the arses. Only when a worker will have a independed of employers means of survival, some (not all) people will dare to be themselves. It's unbelievable, but from what I know, it was AMERICAN dream 150-200 years ago - to have a plot of land/business and be able to say FUCK OFF to anybody. Today's dream is to a get a good paying job and retire not quite used up.

One must to work to live, not to live to work. In addition to the independent means of survival, people should be able to change their careers easily, educational racket should be no more; the less rewarding a job (brainwise), the less say one has in his job, the MORE should one be rewarded financially. Earthlings must either to awake the creative power of the lowest street bum, or to extinct. Modern workplace kills brain, spirit and human dignity. It's dead end.

 

And whose fault is it when you're always frustrated after playing with yourself?

If you can't preform meritoriously, the gene pool doesn't need you.

 

Have you had an interview with a gene pool recently or it's just your insinuations? No matter how one does perform, most "performers" will be thrown out as soon as their cost/benefit ratio will demand it. BTW, what's a deal about playing with yourself, was your hand performance not up to expectations tonight? Try different porn site, I wouldn't suggest you a woman since no woman can do, what the right hairy hand can.

 

In view of he 100% failure rate of utopian societies, for at least 250 years, I have never joined one. (There was a very small one not far from where I lived just starting up in a large farm house and lead by a Lutheran minister I knew and liked. My first marriage was on its last legs so I considered it briefly.)

Anyway to come your post, if your suggestion had been followed, then a few might have lasted more than 10 years. I think these cooperatives need their own currency units CUs and to use "Dutch auctions" to reassign all the essential jobs each month.

For example: "Who wants to clean bathrooms? Will anyone do that for 15 CUs this month? No takers, then if 16CU? Still no takers? 17CUs? - OK Jane, that job is yours. Now, watering and weeding the south lot, anyone willing at 15 CUs?... etc. ... Because of the inflation in CUs, the outgoing book keeper informs that dinners will be 9CUs for entire month, the coming month, eaten or not, and lunches will be ... To purchase externals, the cooperative will pay 1CU for 7 dollars .... The morality committee again reprimands Sally for the way she has been earning extra CUs illegally so this month’s fine is 10 CUs or expulsion, her choice. ..... "

 

Oh well, if humanity has reached its climax and relying on the fear of hunger, cold, fear, joblessness, poverty, old age, homelessness, sickness are the only stimuli humans can respond, seems everything is pointless, let's screw this planet faster and extinct. Maybe, some intelligent bacterial lifeform will be more successful.

However, there is no cosmic law saying that job with more say, more cleanenness and overall (nonfinancial) satisfaction should also pay more, way more. It's all cultural indoctrination. I don't call to live in communes and make funny money. I just call for the leveling of the fields. The worker's lack of the means of survival tilts the table heavily towards employers, who can persist much longer. Only if a worker will have a minimum survival means guaranteed(like a spot of nontaxable land and a hut, etc.) the wage world can resemble justice and will let people to squeeze a slave little bit out. Today, one is prettry much ILLEGAL everywhere in states, if he's got no money/job, a pennyless is an outlaw even on the so called "public" lands. That's famous liberating freedom, which keeps slaves reliably in check.

 

Again with historical perspective, that position is much like the pre civil war south used when north was critical of their ownership of slaves - I.e. worker in northern factories often had worse conditions.

I not exactly sure what your suggesting. If you want all to hold a small plot, farm it for their food etc you are calling for something that requires more than half the worlds population be eliminated and those the are within the "Earth's carrying capacity" have an extremely improvised life - say standard of Bangladesh. Those huge agro industries are why getting food now require such a small fraction of your awake time, instead of most of it.

BTW, you replied before I finished my post. See last (new to you) sentence about "Sally." PS - Sally stayed, yet did not pay as several of her customers chipped in to pay the fine. -While just joking around, I did want to at least hint to the social problems that more often than economic ones killed most prior utopias.

 

I was not writing about conditions, if you have $30k in your account, you will shop around for conditions. If you have $10 in your account, the conditions are among the last items on your list of worries. If all current job seekers could afford to look around for conditions then employers will stuff their greed in the arse and will be forced to improve. This + dominance of the small (one man/family/...)businesses instead of the corporate giants will make employment world better.

First, there is nothing more productive yieldwise than an educated garderner with modest financial means. No agrobusiness with all its machinery, chemistry and barbarism stands near. But the myth about the "big feeder" without which we all gonna die persists. Agrobusiness, just expell "excess" humans out of land, destroys local communities, culture and nature, send people packing to urban slums, brings instead of them machinery, chemicals and "industrial" approach. As a result, the hormone/chemical crap we eat is temporally cheaper. Excess rural folks do productive and creative jobs in McDs, landscaping and trucking (to bring all those Mexican vegies).... etc. As a result of such mega movement of people, machinery and effort, the people on top get more dough. That's about it. It's suicidal, it's stupid, but those who counts get more dought in their pockets, and that's what counts.

 

And what that extra saved time is being spent on. Lemme count the main timeexpenditures, - sittinng in the front of TV 3-6 hrs per day on the average (or in front of a PC/game console), recuperating after a degrading, meaningless job, gulping Prosac. Spending 1-5 hrs in traffic each day, eating out in the joints with probably the most disgustingly tasteless food on Earth, etc. That sounds like things worthy to kill land/communities/culture/nature/land for. The people displaced by big Agro not necessarily are engaged in the activities improving "quality of life". Frequently, they are employed by the industries destroying that quality. But as long as profit is generated it's OK, it's "wealth", the thing Bangladeshi lack.

But let's go back, I'm not calling (or rather dreaming) about resettling everybody to farms. I was just talking about the missing leverage which turns wage dependent units in de facto slaves, as much free as a soviet peasant. Having a spot of "impossible-for-the-state-to-take-back" land would be one possible crutch, not the only one.

Many millions of people would choose working land instead of serving burgers, doing meaningless office jobs, scooping pet's shit, sucking boss's arse provided it will feed their families. Then why unsustainable agro insanity would keep on going on? Lemme guess, cause 1% of people own most of the land.

 

I doubt this. I do not have current data on land prices in the NW / Mid West US, but bet more than 90% of these "wage slave" already have sufficient funds to do what you are suggesting, but they chose not to.

All could save enough to do so at least in Montana or Canada and there are much cheaper places still. - I bought 130 acre cattle farm with two small houses on it here in Brazil 15 years ago for only $20,000 US dollars. The pasture was run down - only supported about 15 steers, but during the 10 years I held it, with less than $2000 in plow service and grass seed, I had 50 steers on it. I sold it for about $40,000 and half was "paid under the table" so no tax on profit. This was the buyer's suggestion. - He had money that he could not justify where it came from and did not want the official price to be even that high, but I refused to let the records show a loss. (In Brazil's tax forms you must annually list your main assets. - if they increase more than your income, you have problems.)