Nuclear Winter

Discussion in 'Earth Science' started by jjhlk, May 31, 2002.

  1. jjhlk Guest

    Does anybody know how long it would take for the effects of nuclear winter to clear up?

    I just thought about that after watching Road Warrior... it must be quite a long time after the actual nuclear holocaust.
     
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  3. kmguru Staff Member

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    100 to 24,000 years
     
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  5. Edufer Tired warrior Registered Senior Member

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    Nobody knows for sure. Depends on what you call "nuclear winter", the number of warheads actually exploded. the amount of dust in the stratosphere, the smoke in the lower troposphere, and if these factors alter some climatic and meteorological variables as winds, rainfall, etc.

    I have read few years ago a report on what scientists said about this, and after some studies they performed, they found out that "nuclear winter" would not last too much, as previously thought when the nuclear neurosis was high.

    According to the "old neurotic" theory, when the fires began in Kuwait oil fields during the Gulf War in 1991, environmental groups claimed the fires would not be quenched for years, and the smoke clouds and the resulting "winter" in the Near East area would last for more than 5 years. We all saw what happened. The fires where extiguished in six months, and the clouds disappeared as soon as the fires were gone.

    So I guess that a rule of thumb would be: Take what environmentalists say, divide it by 100 and then substract another 50%. That would come close to the truth.
     
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  7. kmguru Staff Member

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    I wager $10 to your favorite charity that my answer is the correct one.....

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  8. Edufer Tired warrior Registered Senior Member

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    Kmguru, my favorite charity it's ME. I don't trust my money to "charities" when I can do it more easily myself. Especially when I don´t know the way how "charity" institutions use their money. This leads me to point out that Greenpeace has been deprived by the Canadian government of its "Charity" status it used to have. It seems Greenpeace were not using the tax-free money they collected for "charity". (Charities usually don't go to secret Swiss accounts).

    I didn't say you were wrong or right. I just said "it depends" on many factors. If you supply me with the numbers of warheads, dust and smoke, and climatic variables, I would examine them and be able to make a bet (or not). Until then, it remains an unknwon territory.
     
  9. Stryder Keeper of "good" ideas. Valued Senior Member

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    The doomists and Gloomists of the Kuwait Oil Fires pretty much placed that tone to the world, to prove a bunch of things. It wasn't the timespan that bothered them, but they did want people out there putting them fires out, and they wanted it shown as the atrocity it was.
    (Especially the oil companies that were losing money from their reserves being burnt.)

    As for how long a Nuclear Winter would last. I wouldn't worry about it, you wouldn't see the end of one. I doubt the whole world is going to spontaneously combust over Nuclear arms.

    In fact if you were to look at the pointless years of people spending money on armiments, you would realise that such weapons aren't worth the hastle not just because of the risk to populations. Especially when you look at the long term cost and effort that has to be taken to keep them maintained.

    Of course this topic is one that has risen I'm sure in the more political thread due to the conflict between India and Pakistan, but I shall leave that to that particular forum.
     
  10. kmguru Staff Member

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    Edufer: two things. First my comment was in jest and in no way meant to rebuff.

    Second: Dont get me started with the Charity business. Many years ago, I broke my arm in a motorcycle accident and needed some financial help in the medical operation. Not a single charity helped me out. So, I do not pay a dime to any charity. On top of that, later on, one of my business partner rented out a portion of his building to a major national charity organization. What I learned while I was in and out of the building can be made into a soap opera book.

    Most charities in US is done by private foundations who like to hide the money so that they dont have to pay estate tax and some income tax. Here is how it works. You earn a lot of money. There are expenses that you can not deduct from taxes. So if you funnel money to your own non-profit oraganization, you deduct that from your taxes. Most of your daily expenses can be paid by your own charity. Then you have to spend 10% on charity work. Out of that you can easily get your relatives involved to cut it down to say 5% of the charity income. That makes it a small tax overall. Now the charity spending tied to your friends charity foundation. So the money circulates among the tax cheaters.

    There is another setup. This one is designed to make money free and clear. You setup a charity org, be its president and get a salary - all from donations of other people. You hire fund raising companies to raise the money....you get the idea....
     
  11. Stryder Keeper of "good" ideas. Valued Senior Member

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    Actually Kmguru, I think my Aunt was something to do with a Charity... Now she's awaiting a £150,000 Bail.

    Luckily, I managed to retain "My" computers, which she didn't buy for me.
     
  12. Edufer Tired warrior Registered Senior Member

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    Yessir!

    Kmguru, I know you were joking. But I couldn't help my temper and tried to stick my iconoclastic knife in those "charitable" foundations that are set for tax evasion. But let us be fair: <b>not ALL charitable or humanistic foundations are bad</B>. My grandmother was the head of of the "Charitable Society" in Cordoba, Argentina, from 1920 to 1947, when she passed away. She invested fortunes (her own money) for doing charity among the poors, and I helped her (my brothers and cousins too) when we were kids. But she knew where the money went, and to whom it was given.

    Another point: here, in Argentina, Charities are not tax exempt (perhaps that's why there are not too many). However, one of the best and most notorious is the foundation set by Dr. Rene Favaloro, the cardiologist known all over the world, the doctor that developed and perfected open heart surgery, the artificial heart, and other things. He ws offered millions to keep working in the US, but he chose to help people here. People (poor people, of course) could have their heart surgeries at the Favaloro Foundation for FREE. Not a penny extra.

    Because the economic crisis was so severe, the Foundation (funded by Dr. Favaloro own money, and some humanitarian people), underwent a financial crisis last year. Dr. Favaloro asked for help to the government, some tax exceptions, as not charging Customs taxes for equipment or badly needed medical material, etc., so the Foundation wouldn't go bankrupt. The government said NO, and Dr. Favaloro commited suicide. The whole country went into rage against the government, but it was too late.

    The people joined forces then, and began to send money to the Foundation to keep it working. Even today, when everybody has his money <b>stolen by the banks and the financial system</b> (immobilized, frozen for 10 years) money keeps flowing to the Favaloro Foundation. But he's still dead. Stiff cold.

    So <B>not all the lions are so ferocious as they picture them</B>. But most of them are <b>really hideous</B>.
     
  13. Edufer Tired warrior Registered Senior Member

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    World Football Championship

    Stryderunknown, if you want to make a lot of money, just bet your fortune in Argentina-England game, next friday. I won't give you a hint, however. You must make your choice. It is an easy one...

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  14. kmguru Staff Member

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    3% to 5% Charities have their heart in the right place. Pushing that number to 10% - that leaves 90% looking for an angle.

    Later...
     

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