New Category suggestion. Climate change.

Discussion in 'Site Feedback' started by Quantum Quack, Oct 16, 2018.

  1. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    It is sort of ironic that the famous story of Noah's Ark may have been a prediction about the future and not referring to a pseudo historical event....

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    Hee hee a Netflix cliche' apocalyptic scenario!
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2018
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  3. Gawdzilla Sama Valued Senior Member

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    One use for such a forum would be sharing information about climate change, sharing links to current information and reporting inaccurate ideas about the events we need to know and understand. It would attract denialists, of course, but informed opinion countering their claims would be helpful, I think.
     
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  5. geordief Valued Senior Member

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    I would be more into just the sharing of information and maybe ideas for getting the message through. I think there should be a strong bias in favour of the current scientific consensus allied with a "err on the side of caution" ethic.

    On this proposed subforum MMGW deniers should just be treated (and strictly moderated) as vital time wasters.
     
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  7. Gawdzilla Sama Valued Senior Member

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    If we had the discipline to address the issue instead of the denier we could contribute to the body of evidence available here.
     
  8. geordief Valued Senior Member

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    1,349
    yes a bit harsh to treat deniers as time wasters but in the same way as disruptive pupils have to be dealt with in a special way threads should not be derailed by people who may appear to be arguing for argument's sake.

    The time for fundamental debate seems to have passed by and the time for delayed action is probably upon us.

    One early (?) consequence I fear is climate change caused regional conflict and the consequential mass migrations we are all so fond of.
     
  9. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    4,507
    There is the larger philosophical question of whether that should even be attempted.
    We've extinguished many thousands of other species - why not ourselves?

    Ten years. The optimists say 30 - but only if drastic action is taken now. That's out of the question, with the rise, world-wide of right-wing parties that call "conservative", yet oppose all forms of conservation. Ontario had some fairly progressive policies, until a fathead came to power and bulldozed them all - at immense financial cost to the province. It's last call in the tavern: they intend to eat it all, drink it all, burn it all before the end.
    There is a rearguard action to protect some efforts, but it's unlikely to succeed https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/01/epa...alition-over-vehicle-emissions-standards.html
    Not en masse. Individually, if you have the means.
    Which, of course, guarantees that the survivors will be the wealthy and their retinue. I know which side I'm betting on to prevail.
     
  10. Gawdzilla Sama Valued Senior Member

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    3,864
    I've been in combat and the philosophical question as to whether I deserved to live more than the other guy never came up.
     
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  11. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    22,482
    Personally I tend to believe that the IPCC report has under stated the gravity of the issue, and also suggested time frames that are overly optimistic.
    A form of politically correct distortion due to the need to remain credible in the eyes of the masses.
    There are many indications that would strongly suggest that the situation is accelerating rapidly and major human/environmental catastrophe is only a few years away.
    For me one key observation is that the evening temperatures are not cooling as they would have in the past. Heat is being retained and present though out the night, significantly. Retained because the atmosphere is preventing heat dissipation. To me this is direct evidence of CO2, water vapor, green housing.
    The fact that it is noticeable is the concerning thing.
    The key data sets that various Meteorological services need to look at is minimum overnight temperatures or to put it other ways the heat dissipation rates of cities and regions.
    So far our local national BOM has failed to indicate that they are..
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2018
  12. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    6,794
    explain the "concern"
    in relation to known paleo-climates
     
  13. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    22,482
    Don't care about ancient history or who is to blame etc...
    Bottom line is we are beyond that...
    The night time temperature is not cooling as it typically would.
    I live in a temperate region, Spring is what it is, cool to warm, with cool nights. The temperature is noticeably not dropping at the normal rate of a night time.
    It doesn't matter any more as to who or what is responsible for global warming. Too late for that.
    We are heading in to what will most likely be another record hot summer here, pushing top temps to around the 40's C and beyond. We may even see a 48 or even a 50 C.
    But it isn't the top temperature that is most concerning as I am attempting to point out. It is the inability to release heat when the sun goes down that is becoming more and more evident.
    Example of problem:
    Day time temperatures of above 38 C are common enough during summer here but try sleeping when the night time minimum is as much as 38 deg C. with high humidity. ( prediction)
    Last year there was one night when the 3 am temp was 34 deg C. Impossible! In 60 years I never experienced such a night in Temperate Melbourne.
    Last night the temperature again failed to reduce like it normally would ( even when considering normal variations) and we are not currently in heat wave conditions. ( which would be by far, a worse situation as heat accumulates the situation will become life threatening to any one with out air-conditioning or power to run it)
    so.....
    The fact that the green house effect is noticeable now is quite disturbing and to me, highly indicative of a rapidly deterioration in atmospheric dynamics. (Melbourne, Australia)

    ====
    And the fact that this thread has turned into a climate change thread is also indicative of the demand for a specific category at sciforums.com to be created to allow others to share their climate change experiences and research etc.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2018
  14. RainbowSingularity Valued Senior Member

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    4,757
    i typed out a massive reply(half was mostly ranting) then deleted it after some consideration.
    this thread is in site feedback, so unles its going to be moved... or what-ever... i thought,
    it is probably not a good place to bulk out the thread when its supposed to be about the idea of adding a subforum rather than the actual topic.

    on the off chance it gets trolled then locked etc or thrown to the cesspool because of trolling and off topic.

    5 cents worth, keep the change

    those who dont need a climate are welcome to put their hand up
     
  15. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,482
    Abstraction:
    so you are sitting at home , it's 3 am in the morning and the temperature makes sleep impossible as it has for the last few days.... and you wish to talk about paleo-climates?
    As you move into hyper-thermic state with symptoms of heat stroke and serious sleep deprivation, you might find out something interesting...( sardonic humor)

    Seriously though: Who cares about paleo-climates when they verge on psychosis due to the lack of any sleep?
     
  16. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,482
    actually yes. I shall restrain my obvious anger and despair and not post about climate change here and wait to see what the board suggest about the threads OP.
     
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  17. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    4,507
    Increasing frequency and severity of hurricanes and blizzards. Rapid permafrost, ice-cap and glacier loss.
    Droughts and floods in places that had not experienced them. This one is because the the pattern of air-flow has altered and become erratic, because of the above.
    Gulf Stream slowing down; ocean water temperatures changing with too much heat at the equator and too much melting ice at the poles.
    Hotter summers, more rain, less rain, longer but milder winter, forest fires, drying lakes...
    Ay-yup.
     
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  18. RainbowSingularity Valued Senior Member

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    4,757
    seriousely ...
    around 4am to 6am is the coldest time of the day
    you should target your REM sleep for that time.
    everything else takes a back seat
     
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  19. RainbowSingularity Valued Senior Member

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    4,757
    asia and all those highly poulated places with loose volcanic dirt hill sides.
    japan was the most outstanding example after the earth quake.
    sodden hillsides that have never had soo much rain. doesnt take much to move it.
    all those highly populated places have massive surface weight built on loose dirt.
    it will all slide like a water slide the moment it gets enough rain, and asia and semi tropical places are going to get an awful lot more rain.
    i expect the USA flood plains that have been highly populated with urban developments will be a huge issue.

    the irony of ther usa getting flooding and hurricanes is that the USA is the centre of the world for climate change deniers.
    all be them a minority in power over the majority.
     
  20. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    6,794
    Now, therein lies the problem.
    It seems that most attempts to have a balanced scientific discussion run aground on that simple little phrase.
    A phrase that usually claims that anyone who tries to look behind the curtain is branded heretic.

    Is it possible to investigate the science when people have already made up their minds?
    or
    Would such an attempt just follow the usual course?
     
  21. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    6,794
    A study of the past may lead to a better understanding of the present and enhance predictability of the future.
    Who cares?
    Perhaps, we all should.
     
  22. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    And for the drivers of industrial expansion and the world's biggest energy hogs. Coincidence?
    The scientists have been having balanced discussions for a century now. Whenever they've reported their interim findings and made a prediction - usually way too conservative, because they were afraid of being branded alarmist - they've been branded alarmist, and very little of the information was ever conveyed to the general public. This matter has been at emergency point for three decades, and only this year have I heard regular mention of it on the news broadcasts. Previously, it's been presented on weekend news-magazine shows or panel discussions (read: six people yelling over one another), as a controversial topic. Never, on popular media, as a serious, organized presentation of facts and figures, maps and charts. The general public is tragically uninformed.
    What curtain? The climate scientists have been begging and pleading to be heard. They're blogging, writing articles, making petitions, with increasing numbers of signatories, to governments and exhaustive reports to NASA, to emergency planning agencies and the UN. Time after time, they're shut down.
     
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  23. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

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    4,507
    Go ahead. It's all out there, readily available.
    Look, when an avalanche is barrelling down the mountain at you, it's a bit late to start debating. You'd better have made up your mind by then.
     

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