Let's not... I am wondering whether I blocked the right person. You haven't apologized the other day for intentionally distorting what I said in my thread and calling me all names under the sun. When you learn how to conduct a real talk on something, I will be back to talk. May take a few years for you to grow up.
Trapped You would have done better to just let my last post drop off the new post list, instead you draw attention to the fact that you have been owned, caught in an easily documented LIE. You're not interested in finding the real explanation to your woo, you spend your time obfuscating and ignoring the facts so they won't interfere with your preconceived answers(hint: ALIENS!). From a contemporary source... "In this case, however, the evidence is overwhelming that the Phoenix Lights were indeed a hoax." Yet you are still trying to promote it as an actual Alien Spacecraft(triangular, if my memory serves). That makes you a fraud(not a pejorative, a fact). Yes, you claimed a huge triangular UFO was seen by hundreds, when it was actually 4 road flares on helium balloons launched at one minute intervals and drifting in the light breeze, changing positions as the winds at varying heights separated them, then burning out one by one. The quality of the "evidence" you are presenting as fact is several levels below serious and more closely approaches farce, and passes into fraud with knowing repetition. And you are aware that few phones had cameras in 2008, aren't you? And GoPro video cameras were not yet available either. On the video one guy is heard worrying about running out of tape, he was using a CAMCORDER. You saw few people jogging with a record player on their belt for the same reason, but it's different now. Almost every phone has a high quality camera, dashcams are universal in Russia and soon will be nearly standard equipment everywhere. And guess what, UFO reports are becoming scarce, 15 second meteor falls are videoed from numerous vantage points, accidents that used to have to be figured out after the fact are now commonly seen as they occurred in real time, often from several angles. Your Aliens are running out of gaps to even POSSIBLY exist in(something they have in common with vampires, unicorns, fairies and other supernatural entities of the human imagination), there is STILL no valid evidence of their existence or presence. GrumpyPlease Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
You obviously don't have the first clue about the official reports then of the Phoenix lights then? The official air force explanation is out by about half an hour. It also neglects that the whole of those in Phoenix who saw the actual craft.
Now, either the whole of Phoenix don't know how to tell the time, or they just imagined seeing a giant UFO crossing their town in your opinion?
Trapped Let's go back over the facts revealed TWO DAYS LATER by the local TV station. 1. A man who wished to remain anonymous(for obvious reasons)wished to damp down the chaos he caused by releasing 4 helium balloons with road flares attached so he confesses to the local TV station reporter. 2. A neighbor(identified by name)the reporter talked to gave eye witness testimony of watching the lawsuit averse perpetrator(he actually broke no laws)launch 4 balloons at one minute intervals with lit road flares(red ones)attached, which then rose into the night air above Phoenix, drifted downwind and then burned out. 3. The track of the alleged UFO followed the slight breeze blowing over Phoenix that night. 4. the lights were seen to alter their configuration from a triangle to a square before fading as the flares burned out, one at a time at near one minute intervals(same timing as their launch). 5. The nearby airport received no radar signature of the event(balloons and paper don't reflect radar much). See, the number of people who witness a hoax do not make the hoax any less of a hoax. Numbers of people reporting UFOs(or even who those people are, whether they saw something is not in question)has nothing to do with proving any Alien Spacecraft are visiting Earth. UFOs must be assumed NOT to be Alien Spacecraft unless and until POSITIVE evidence of(not hearsay, not "I saw something I don't understand, therefore ALIENS!")Alien Spacecraft actually being a real possibility has been found, it is actually the least likely explanation of any we would consider "serious"(it's just barely possible, enough not to say it is impossible, but a serious waste of time if your looking for reality). GrumpyPlease Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Really, Trapped? A 30 minute timing discrepancy in an otherwise completely plausible conventional explanation is all it takes for you to assume it must be aliens? Trapped, you have the concept of logical proof just completely ass-backwards. You need the conventional explanation 100% proven before you will accept that it wasn't aliens and any imperfection to you makes it must be aliens. This and that other video you posted really make the depths of your delusion crystal clear.
30 minutes is important, Stanton Friedman has said it himself. He has said, the time lapse given half an hour is important; he's even suggested it was a mistake when constructing the ''flare'' explanation.
What people are not understanding, is that we have multiple witnesses that say there was a mile-long, structured craft which passed overhead. This was what the majority of the sightings consisted of. That isn't flare activity. The flare explanation was just used to cover up what the residents of Phoenix claimed they actually saw. The governor of Phoenix at the time, later admitting seeing the huge craft. He was an air force pilot, so he knew all kinds of aerial craft. He said this one, 'matched nothing we had,' and calling the event 'out of this world.'
Yes. They saw four flares a mile apart. So let's see if I understand you. The man who confessed to this prank was put up to it by either a shadowy super-secret government organization or the space aliens themselves? Sounds like he wanted to believe as strongly as you do.
You have to believe what you see... and among the population, there was a clear agreement about there being an unidentified flying triangular shaped craft about a mile long. That's quite a jump from just flares.
Trapped Humans are predisposed to see pattern when none was there. It's safer to see a tiger that is not there than it is to not recognize the pattern. Those people saw only four flares on balloons in a suitable configuration, their mind supplied the pattern of a spacecraft. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Looking up into a semi-dark night(cities have huge light pollution, even on clear nights few stars can be seen when near them)at relatively bright points of light moving in formation with the wind, near hovering overhead, the mind connects the dots for you and suddenly you see(vaguely and with great uncertainty)the spacecraft that just is not there, just like the face is non-existent in the above picture. GrumpyPlease Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Excellent example! Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! That's precisely what Trapped and his followers see - something completely nonexistant.
In these circumstances, these men didn't have a choice to make up what they saw. It needed to be consistent with all the other testimony. The Washington flap happened, some here just need to deal with this fact of history.
Trapped Yes, they could only possibly see 4 lights in the sky, that's all that was there. Their minds filled in the details and convinced them they were seeing something else. It does not matter how many people were convinced that night that they had seen an Alien Spacecraft, it doesn't change the fact that there were only 4 road flares hanging from 4 helium filled balloons drifting with the wind. The flares were real, so they actually saw a real UFO(which remained unidentified for two days). What they did not really see was anything but 4 flares on helium balloons. So even this "real" UFO event is not evidence for Alien Spacecraft. ALL UFO sightings are similar, NONE have EVER been shown to be alien spacecraft, period. There's no question. The event happened and lots of reliable witnesses actually saw it. But it is safe(IE I have zero concern that I will be wrong on that)to conclude that the event was NOT caused by an alien spacecraft. Since Blue Book the American military does not even waste time considering that possibility(there is no office in the military solely set up to handle alien spacecraft sightings anymore, there's not one for vampire sightings either FOR THE SAME REASON, they're BS).The Phoenix event happened as well, and you need to incorporate the fact that a Terrestrial explanation was revealed only two days later, easily explaining the whole event, with an eyewitness to those facts. Yet you are still trying to claim that what was seen was a miles wide alien spacecraft. Yet you are saying that the number and quality of the people fooled by their own minds into seeing that non-existent alien spacecraft in the unconnected drifting of balloon borne flares somehow makes the alien spacecraft more real. Yet you are the one who thinks an out of focus video of mortar flares is evidence of alien spacecraft. In fact, you seem to twist anything you can into "evidence" of alien spacecraft, ignoring or hand-waving away inconvenient facts yet you have zero valid, repeatable, scientific evidence that alien spacecraft even exist. Religions do this with their gods, it makes no more sense there, either. Yes, and one of the best known effects is the "formation" fallacy. If a modern person sees a formation of lights moving together in a dark sky, his brain will automatically assume they are connected by physical mass. That is what it has been trained by experience(IE seeing aircraft marker lights on the wings and tail)to do. Once a pattern has been inferred the brain will start trying to produce detail in order to confirm or invalidate that assumption. If detail is not forthcoming, it will remain convinced that the initial assumption is valid, if detail is forthcoming it often invalidates the original assumption and suddenly you see the leaves and branches as well as the face you now know to be an illusion(as in the above picture). In a light polluted environment only the very bright flares were visible, they moved together in first a triangle and then a square, the formation was seen("aircraft")and no further detail could be discerned(in this case because there were no further details, only 4 lights)so the brain supplied what the brain assumed such an aircraft would look like to the consciousness(in a vague and uncertain way), given the formation of lights applied to what the brain knew of actual aircraft. So, even experienced and reliable eyewitnesses actually did "see" an alien spacecraft, their brain showed it to them to match the pattern of lights they physically saw. But the spacecraft they saw existed only in their own minds, what they really saw was 4 road flares hanging from helium balloons drifting over a city on the light breeze. Another aspect of this is pattern seeking. A hunter out trying to score is on a hair trigger to recognize a deer or pig in the brush, he also is predisposed to recognize the pattern meaning wolf, bear or lion. In this state he will see many false alarms, his brain will evaluate each one for validity and then he will see the illusion and move on, until he sees one his brain can not invalidate no matter how much he stares. That's the ones that may provide prey. A side effect of this is that you are primed to see what you want to see. Religious people see god or angels, etc., you are primed to see Aliens. This tendency is one of the reasons we rely on the scientific method, repeatability and valid evidence, not eye witness testimony which is so vulnerable to interpretation, by the brain and by the psyche. If you ever get high quality video(like is available for the Russian meteor), let us know, that could be evidence if it is clear enough. GrumpyPlease Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Which it was. It was consistent with seeing flares. Some people, like you, want to believe that it was an alien spaceship. So you believe it, and you disregard the facts that show that to be untrue. (Or call it a massive government conspiracy.)
I forget what the woman's name was, but she held a chair on the council which directly dealt with the influx of phone callers reporting a mysterious giant triangle UFO that passed over head of them. In fact, the council woman said, that out of about 400 complaints she dealt with, which didn't include other constituents added, only one report claimed it was caused by air planes. She continued to say, she was shocked to find out this was the only testimony the news reporters used, neglecting about 400+ other people claiming it was something else. You are saying I am disregarding the facts, rather you are. You'd let us believe all these people where somehow mistaken and what they saw was flares. You're just as bad as those trying to cover up the subject. You know fine well that isn't what people reported seeing.
Think about it this way as well, what are the statistics that over 400 people that this council woman saw, that they had all mistaken flares for a real giant triangle UFO? The chances are very very low. These are the facts of the case.
Trapped The statistic is that 100% of those reporting seeing a spacecraft were mistaken, and that every single one of them was fooled by the illusion. The statistic is that every single person who reported seeing a UFO was provisionally correct, it was (or at least appeared to be)a UFO. Those few who reported moving lights overhead were absolutely, factually and scientifically accurate, it is a fact that there were 4 moving lights in the sky overhead. Illusionists make good money taking advantage of this trait of the human psyche, audiences carefully positioned to only see what the performer wishes them to see and predisposed to seeing amazing feats of magic get exactly what they want. As long as they don't(or can't)look under and behind the stage the illusion continues. In many ways the helium balloon/flare trick is right up there with anything a professional illusionist could do. He fooled masses of people into actually seeing a spacecraft, utilizing a quirk in our brain that gave us a survival advantage but left us open to being deceived by our own mind, when all they really saw was 4 drifting flares. You see, our mind does see a tiger in the weeds, even when that tiger moments later resolves into a chance configuration of bent grasses. That initial shock shows you that your brain has already decided the tiger is real and it shows it to you, you actually see it. It is only by the next process(continued focused attention to the pattern followed by invalidation)that you STOP seeing the tiger and see the bent grass that formed the illusion. I have no doubt that many people in Phoenix had nearly religious reactions, as they were stuck in the shock for many minutes as there could be no invalidation, the lights were the only thing they saw, no further information required to construct a spacecraft and no invalidating information available to destroy the illusion. But it was an illusion, if the guy knew the effect it would have he's a genius, if by accident...well, it explains his need to confess, this was making national news. It was brilliant, either way. GrumpyPlease Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
