MPACUK founder sends funds to David Irving

Discussion in 'World Events' started by GeoffP, Nov 20, 2006.

  1. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    Birds of a feather do what together?

    Well, that much is true, anyway.

    'The Jews'. Not 'the Israelis'. And what 'truths' is Irving meant to be exposing that Buhkari believes so strongly in? Hmm.

    Ghost, of course, tells me that MPACUK is a tolerant, moderate, kind-hearted organization. I wonder how that last bit qualifies as tolerant or moderate. Well, I'm sure he has some excuse handy. And if this is what Buhkari is saying in English, I wonder what his comments in Arabic might be like?

    At the expense of everyone else, apparently. Now, MPACUK did stop that march, and Buhkari says that he was only on Irvings' side before he knew the man was anti-semitic. But it seems a bit unlikely, especially in light of his letter to Irving, that that was true. Ghost, of course, tells me that the MCB and MPACUK are great organizations full of fine fellows - and I suppose when it's the other guy you're hating, that might appear to be true.

    Ghost?

     
  2. Ghost_007 Registered Senior Member

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    http://www.mpacuk.org/content/view/3028/35/

    _____________

    Game, set and match. :)
     
  3. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    LMAO

    And this explains why he used the phrase "the Jews" as opposed to say, "the evil right-wingers" or "the Zionists" or "the Israelis" or...well, just about anything else. No, what he said was "expose certain falsehoods perpetrated by the Jews". Hmm. Now why would he use that phrase, this independent, completely isolated individual...who would shortly afterwards go on to found MPACUK?

    Which is why Buhkari used the phrase "expose certain falsehoods perpetrated by the Jews"?

    In which Buhkari uses the phrase "expose certain falsehoods perpetrated by the Jews".

    Which is, again, why Mr. Buhkari used the phrase "expose certain falsehoods perpetrated by the Jews".

    Good if they really follow islam, bad otherwise; yes, we know, we know. I wonder if I should investigate MPACUK's statement on the Holocaust Memorial Day, and see what precisely they said.

    And concluded that it was ok to write "expose certain falsehoods perpetrated by the Jews" in a letter to him.

    Well, that happens equally to Nazis and religious fascists, it's true. So sad! *sniff*

    Which is why Buhkari repudiated him long before this letter ever surfaced in the public - eh? What's that you say? Buhkari didn't damn Irving before the letter was found, and before he exhorted islamic websites to send him cash? How odd. And how odd that an islamic interest is found in a Holocaust denier in the first place.

    Strange congruences these times bring.

    And will MPACUK also oppose Buhkari? See, I remember, he wrote this letter to Irving the Holocaust denier, and he used the phrase "expose certain falsehoods perpetrated by the Jews".

    Now why, I wonder, did he phrase it that way?
    _____________

    Yes.

    To me. :)

    Ghost, I've missed you. ;)
     
  4. Zakariya04 and it was Valued Senior Member

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    Dear Geoff,

    i hope all is going well with you.

    Really you should be enlightened by Ghost, that he is not being influenced by any radical elemnts and that he still looks for mderation in situations or i n things people have said. rather than saying yes this guy has a point yes the holocaust never happened etc...It appears to me that you are trying to draw extremism from everything any muslim says.....

    I dont know much about this story so please forgive me for showing ignorance but if Bukhari did send money to irwin knowing he was a supporter of holocuast denying but later denied that he knew irwin was a holocaust denier then surely Bukhari is at least undertsanding that it was a bad position to take, that is if he did know david irwin was a holocaust denier in the first place.

    i hope this makes sense to you, please ask me to elaborate if you wish...

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~
    take care
    zak
     
  5. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    Rather than saying "yes this guy has a point the Holocaust never happened"?

    Dear me. Now why would I call that extremist? And how am I 'trying to draw extremism from this statement'? The statement is swimming in it.

    If Buhkari knew - and from his phrase, above, it is abundantly clear that he did - it was more than a bad position to take. It was the overt support of a monster. Yet Ghost is afraid to look too deeply at his heroes in the MCB, in MPACUK. And these, he claims, are the moderates.
     
  6. Zakariya04 and it was Valued Senior Member

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    hey geoff thank you for this.

    but ghost never said this geoff thats the point
    But ghost never said the guys has a point

    Please name some "moderates"

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Take care
    zak
     
  7. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    Ghost accepts prima facie MPACUK's "explanation". Ergo, he doesn't think Buhkari was wrong.

    I've asked Ghost to name moderates before, but they always seem a little more immoderate on inspection.

    Geoff
     
  8. Zakariya04 and it was Valued Senior Member

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    Good Morning Geoff

    i hope you are well.

    How are they less moderate on closer expection??? what you go back a few years to find out what they did or said in their past? Or what? people can change you know...
    But anyway geoff i was asking you to name a few moderates? As you are bound to know a few being a knowledgable guy on nthese issues.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    take care
    zak
     
  9. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    Good morning Zak,

    It's an open question as to whether people can change. It is said that you can't get a leopard to change his spots.

    And I rather thought it was up to you to present some moderates, but I'd mention Ayaan Ali Hirsi, from the Netherlands (which, I note, she had to flee to avoid being killed by less moderate residents), Walid Shoebat, Tawfik Hamid (who both perhaps illustrate your point that people change at the same time he indicts radical islam's generality), Dr Ataullah Siddiqui might be one (though I know of him only remotely), Nonie Darwish, Salim Mansur and our own dear Sam and yourself, of course.

    So are you now stipulating to the fact that Buhkari is not a moderate, and therefore that MPACUK springs from a poisoned seed? This is the question that needs answering, Zak. That and why Ghost continues to support him, and them.

    Best,

    Geoff
     
  10. Zakariya04 and it was Valued Senior Member

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    hi geoff,

    thank you for your response.

    i dont actually know much about this guy....

    About moderates changing their spots... what do you think of old yusuf islam/cat stevens. this one has changed quite a bit, used to be a rock star converted to a muslim, became really quite hardcore/ radical extreme - whatever you want to call it (like most converts do initailly) and then chilled out again and is has now record another commercial music album!!!

    I heard an interview with him the other day on radio 2 and the presenter asked him about the time a couple of years ago his plane got diverted cause he was on it -do you remember that? Anyway he was laughing about it calling ti a mistake and an accident etc.. And said that the security people were quite pleased as they had the guy who broke out the song "Peace Train"

    i would be interetsed to hear if and/or what abuse he gets from the less moderate muslims abiout his new album... i have only heard half of one tune, seems quite nice, i may buy it a some point?

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~

    take care
    zak
     
  11. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    Why would commercialism mean Stevens would be less muslim? Is oil profiteering not muslim either? Anyway, Stevens is back to his previous "riff".

    Yes; the foreign policy was to blame, not the bombers, or the people that financed them. Sure, sure, Cat. BTW, I limewired some tracks from your new album, and they sucked.

    Not to mention his first screed: "The Qur’an makes it clear; if someone defames the Prophet, then he must die". Leopards, like Cat, don't really change their spots.

    Know what? "Peace Train" sucks too.

    Geoff
     
  12. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    72,822
    Nomenclature is everything.

    If he had called it "Bomb the infidels" it would have sold like hot cakes.:D
     
  13. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah: gives a whole new meaning to the expression "holy roller".

    Geoff
     
  14. Zakariya04 and it was Valued Senior Member

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    Hey geoff

    thank you for this.

    btw the second link doesnot work.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~
    zak
     
  15. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    Hm. Seems to be an old one. Ah well.

    In any event, we can agree I think that MPACUK is not so innocent and moderate as it pretends, much to Ghost's consternation.

    Geoff
     
  16. Zakariya04 and it was Valued Senior Member

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    Good morning Geoff

    hows it going

    No commercialism is ok for muslims i appreciate that you know this. all i was saying is i am looking out for any rebutal he gets from the hypocrite muslims thats all




    It seems odd this, what i read of the firrst link is that Yusuf blames the 9-11 and islamohobia for him not getting supprot and funds for his islammic centre, but surely private funds would only be coming from private idividuals anyway and no doubt Muslims as non muslims whatevers going on in the world wont contribute to it...

    Or have i missed the point?

    And with cat changing his spots... Are you saying that he once made shit music (in your opinon of course as a some of his tunes were pretty big in the 60's/70's) and has gone full circle and is backing making shit music?? so therefore he never changed his spots?

    or again have i missed the point?

    To be honest geoff i will have to look MPACUK up as i dont know to much about them...

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    take care
    zak
     
  17. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    No, by "not changing his spots" I obviously meant "once a hater, always a hater".

    Geoff
     
  18. Zakariya04 and it was Valued Senior Member

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    6,045
    ghey goeff

    Yusuf iSlam was cat stevens he must ahve changed his spots to do that...

    please can you provide the links saying he is full of hate.

    all i see is the first link where he blames 9-11, whichas i explained does not make sense.. why we he blame 9-11 its not like non muslims would fund his islamic centre anyway.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~
    take acre
    zak
     
  19. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    "ghey Geoff"? Please, don't make me "pwn" you.

    As for the evidence that he is a hater, Zak: it is said "you can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make him drink".

    Particularly not if he is already full of something else.

    Geoff
     
  20. infoterror Registered Senior Member

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    377
    Hater? This word means nothing. Everyone hates something. Even Israel hates some things. Are they haters?

    False dichotomy, -5 points.
     

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