Most British scientists: Richard Dawkins' work misrepresents science

Discussion in 'General Science & Technology' started by paddoboy, Nov 7, 2016.

  1. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    See post 833
    Snakes have intelligence...of a sort...so does a goldfish, So?
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2016
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  3. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    It's Taipan by the way, not Tia-pan.
    And its poison drop for drop is the most deadly of all land snakes, nothing to do with how many times it strikes.
     
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  5. river Valued Senior Member

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    The snakes have the ability to increase their venom . through evolution .

    Now that takes intelligence . more , it takes awareness of the lack of potency of their venom .

    Now where did that intelligence come from ?
     
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  7. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    http://necsi.edu/projects/evolution/evolution/5parts/evolution_5parts.html

    How Does Evolution Occur?


    Darwin's Theory of Natural Selection has been divided into five parts to explain clearly how evolution happens in nature.

    1. Organisms produce more offspring than actually survive.
    Organisms can die from many causes: disease, starvation, and being eaten, among other things. The environment can't support every organism that is born. Many die before they are able to reproduce. One hundred (100) beetles can produce 6.1 x 1028(61 with 27 zeros after it) offspring in only 82 weeks (less than two years). Each beetle weighs 10 mg, and if they all survive, their total weight after 82 weeks would be 6.1 x 1021 (61 with 20 zeros after it) metric tons, equal to the weight of the entire earth. Obviously, their environment can't support all of these beetles, and many of them die.

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    Bear and fish both struggle to survive. This bear, by catching the fish, is succeeding in the struggle and surviving. The fish did not survive, however, but left more fit fish behind.

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    The fish eggs at left are only a small fraction of those laid by a single fish. If all of the fish hatched and each of them laid as many eggs, which all hatched as well, there would be too many fish for the fishes' environment to support. [2]

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    2. Every organism must struggle to survive.
    One reason that not all organisms survive is that there are not enough resources, things that they need, to go around. Organisms must struggle to get what they need to survive, competing against other organisms that want the same things they do. They also have to struggle to get away from predators and to overcome disease. For example, a fox struggling to catch a rabbit, which struggles to escape. As explained in part one, not all of them make it.
    3. There is variation within a species.
    Not all of the individuals in a species are exactly the same. There are variations, differences, among members of a species. If you look at the spots on several different ladybugs, or the stripes on zebras, you will notice that they don't all have the same number or arrangement of spots or of stripes. In addition to these easily visible variations, there are differences in skill and behavior, such as differences in how fast the zebras can run. If organisms were all the same, none would be better suited than any other, and selection could not occur.

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    4. Some variations allow members of a species to survive and reproduce better than others.
    If an organism has a trait that helps it survive or reproduce, it is more likely to survive and be able to reproduce. A faster cheetah is more likely to catch a gazelle and survive, and a faster gazelle is more likely to escape the cheetah and survive. A showier flower is more likely to be noticed by a bee, which enables it to reproduce. A thornier cactus is more likely than other cactuses to be left alone by animals, rather than be eaten and die.

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    5. Organisms that survive and reproduce pass their traits to their offspring, and the helpful traits gradually appear in more and more of the population.
    Most of an organism's traits are passed on to its offspring. If more of the organisms with the helpful trait survive, then in the following generations, more and more of the population have that trait. If there are some faster cheetahs and some slower cheetahs, the faster cheetahs will be better able to catch food and survive. With more of the slower ones dying before they can reproduce, and more of the faster ones surviving and reproducing, over generations the population on the whole will gradually become made up of faster cheetahs.

    Here is an example demonstrating each of these points, told as the story of a population of brown hares in a polar region becoming white hares:

    1. There are hares living in a cold, snowy, polar region. All of the hares are brown* and many of them are killed and eaten by other animals each year, so more are born than survive.

    2. These hares are competing for life and struggling to survive, partly by trying to avoid predators, to "not be the one who gets eaten."

    3. Each hare is a little bit different from other hares, but one time a few hares are born albino, white, because of a mutation in the genes.

    4. This variation in color helps the albino hares to survive. Against the white snow, predators have a harder time seeing them, so more of the albino hares are able to survive and therefore to reproduce.

    5. In the next generation there are more white hares, because the white hair gene is passed on. In this generation, too, more white hares survive and reproduce. They pass the albino trait on to their offspring, who also survive and reproduce more than do the brown hares. Gradually, there are more and more white hares in the population, until the entire population is made of white hares.



    * You might ask: What were brown hares doing in a polar region? The brown color in an Arctic region was caused by one of two things, both of which are major causes of change and the arising of new species. One possibility was that a group of hares migrated from a warmer region and became isolated, the other is that the region where the hares lived became colder.
     
  8. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Evolution.
     
  9. river Valued Senior Member

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    Wrong .

    Watch a program on
    Love Nature by a man who catches venomous snakes all over the world .

    I know pad .

    Venom is something very different .
     
  10. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Correct but I think they can be very aggressive and do continue to strike.
    I recall reading about some poor chap who was attacked saying it just kept coming.
    Got him more than once but somehow he survived.
    If the kangaroos don't get you the snakes will, or the spiders will or the crocks, or the box jelly fish, maybe the blue ringed octopus or the sharks otherwise there is nothing to worry about except the wild dogs.
    Alex
     
  11. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    No It's right, and obviously you don't know, sorry......
    http://snake-facts.weebly.com/inland-taipan.html


    http://ipfactly.com/inland-taipan/

    http://reptilepark.com.au/animals/reptiles/snakes/venomous/fierce-snake/

    https://www.australiazoo.com.au/our-animals/reptiles/venomous-snakes/taipan


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inland_taipan
    The inland taipan is the most venomous snake in the world; based on the median lethal dose value in mice, its venom, drop for drop, is by far the most toxic of any snake much more so than even sea snakes[9][10][11] – and it has the most toxic venom of any reptile when tested on human heartcell
     
  12. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Certainly they strike multiple times, but the venom is drop for drop the deadliest of any snake, and still plenty to cause death even with one bite.
     
  13. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    I came across a red bellied black snake on a coastal walk near Palm beach a few years ago....He remained cool, calm and collected, rolled up sunning himself, and I walked by and let it be.

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  14. river Valued Senior Member

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    Regardless pad . whatever.

    The point is WHY did the venom increase in potency increase in the first place .

    Intelligence and awareness.
     
  15. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inland_taipan
    "It is estimated that one bite possesses enough lethality to kill at least 100 full grown men,[16]and, depending on the nature of the bite, it has the potential to kill someone in as little as 30 to 45 minutes if left untreated".
     
  16. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Heck yeh.
    Alex
     
  17. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Ahh, c'mon riv, don't cop out on us now!

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    No, evolution.
     
  18. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Ever heard of a bloke named Jack Cairns Alex?
    He was a rigger where I worked in my younger days and he and his brother ran a snake show exhibition at La-Perouse not to far from my abode, both became the most well known snake handlers in Australia and were quote at times by Steve Irwin of crocodile hunter fame.
    After each 45 minute show at their snake pit, they would take up a collection from the gathered crowd and after put all the money into a snake bag along with a couple of Brown snakes!
    Over 25 years of snake showing, they did not once have any incident of having money disappear!

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  19. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    No they don't.

    Humpty Dumpty method
    Agree Mr Poe?
    Indubitable Mr Humpty. Case closed.
     
  20. river Valued Senior Member

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    Now my point is the evolution of the venom was because of the intelligence and awareness of the snake , which means that an intelligence was in the snakes in the first place . ID .

    ID in my thinking of ID . No god , just a being in whose mind we are all in , the Universe.
     
  21. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    It evolved simply because of the old addage of "survival of the fittest" and everything to do with my post and link at....844
     
  22. river Valued Senior Member

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    It is more than the fittest pad . survival of the fittest is more than braun.
     
  23. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    OK.

    What happens to those who find their need?

    What happens to those who do not find their need?

    Would those who don't find be in the same basket as those who never start looking?

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    Poe (Humpty out doing Christmas shopping)
     

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