Misogyny, Guns, Rape and Culture..

Oh, duh, I forgot. We can drink like a man but we can’t take a punch like a man, is that it?

You’re the one telling them to lie back and take it like a woman. Well, because, you know—some of them just want sex. Wouldn't want to break a nail, right?

“Risk reduction is shitty but necessary…We should work to make women freer and safer on campus, not more aware of the steps they must take to stay out of danger. But we can’t discount it—the threat of rape is part of our lived reality, and risk reduction does help to keep one safe.”

That’s true, and it’s true for more than just sexual violence. Admitting that risk reduction, you know, reduces risk ought not to be a controversial, brave step. But it is, and that’s a terrible thing. Addressing some systemic issues that rape-culture activists often point to is absolutely a worthy endeavor, but in the meantime, working to give people the tools they need to protect themselves isn’t a concession to the patriarchy or a betrayal of the cause. It’s a moral duty we should not be scared off of. RAINN should be commended for making that important point. Let’s hope people heard it.

Americas largest rape prevention group-dodges victim blaming bullet

 

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I do believe this is a specific accusation that you should be able to support.

Do so.

 

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Only eight percent of rapes are committed by armed attackers. He’s already shown that he’s willing to use physical force. He says don’t move or I’ll kill you. Do you believe him? Do you take it like a woman? Do you let him tie you up, force you into a car?

There are no guarantees, no sure-fire rules in combat, but based on the research, nobody should be telling a potential victim to not fight back if it looks like the rapist gets off on it. If he’s getting off on hurting you, then he’s going to hurt you.

Why not get rid of rape prevention altogether? We shouldn't have to be responsible for ourselves, right? Men should protect us, risk their lives for us, am I right?

No. We don’t want heroes. We want you to stop hanging out with predators. If possible, don’t do business with them. We want you to stop ignoring blatant misogyny. Stop laughing at their jokes. We want you to stop dismembering us. Realize that we are more than the sum of our parts.

Like I said, risk reduction reduces risk. That’s reality, Tiassa.

You’re a man. Would you care to drop your defensive stance just long enough to enlighten us?

 

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In your own words... enlighten us.

How, exactly, do you identify the potential rapist? The potential predator? How do you know, before meeting the person, if they might drug you or pull a gun on you or even knock you unconscious? How do you know that someone walking towards you on the sidewalk isn't going to stab you and run off with your purse?

 

They may brag about it. They may tell you that they plan on getting a girl drunk. You might witness it. They've may have already done it and gotten away with it. It happens a lot, Kitt.

What...do you want to play stupid and not help out?

Oh, right. I forgot, sorry.

 

You are so naive it is almost painful...

If everyone who had intent to rape/molest/mug/murder or otherwise commit crimes was as blatantly stupid as the ones that make it onto "Worlds Dumbest Criminals" lists... then we wouldn't have an issue.

The simple fact is... you don't know. You can never be sure if that man in a suit and tie walking towards you on the sidewalk has intentions of pushing you into that allyway and raping you... likewise, you cannot tell by looking at them that scruffy, tattoo'ed biker who looks to be completely out of it is simply tired because he just spent the last 10 hours standing a protective vigil at the house of an eight year old girl who is testifying against her uncle who raped her.

Yes... that happens. http://bacaworld.org/

Big, mean, tough bikers, going to little kids houses and standing guard at night to make sure they can sleep safely... to ensure their family is safe from repercussion.

So, I ask again Trooper; how do you tell? How can you be sure?
Obviously you have a way, or else you wouldn't say half of what you've been spouting here...

Or, are you simply bigoted and judge everyone you look at simply by what you see and THINK you know?

EDIT - for what it's worth, the members of BACA are, quite simply, amazingly dedicated and wonderful people who wear two very different masks. On the one, they are tough and scary and big and strong and often just having them there is enough to deter an abuser from even coming to the premise at all; should the offender try to make a scene out of things, they quickly learn just how big and mean a bunch of angry bikers CAN be. On the other, they are warm and compassionate and understanding men and women who make these kids feel SAFE, often for the first time in months or even years... taking time out of their lives to often do nothing more than BE there and BE nearby to make sure the ones hurting the child cannot come back and do it again.

 

Well, given that some, as we both know, would argue that rape really is about getting laid, and since you invoked the male equivalent of nymphomania, what is the role of satyriasis in any of this?

Oh, and ...

... how, exactly, does one "take it like a woman"?

 

Err!

I said that I want to you to put social pressure on your male counterparts, Kitt.

 

Oh, so, the idea that men are subject to biological forces out of their control plays no role in any of this. Is that what you're saying?

 

Shocking. Who is making such an argument?

 

No, it's a straightforward question: Is satyriasis relevant to the rape phenomenon?

And another: If so, how is it relevant?

You raised the issue, so, you know, whatcha think?

 

Once again you confuse "self defense" and women's behavior modification with rape prevention in general. This socially inculcated thinking disorder, endemic in American society among many others, makes actual prevention of sexual assault in its common forms more difficult, and leads directly to victim blaming as a common response to actual reported assault. Victim blaming in a society, among the other unfortunate consequences of such rape prevention methods, does abet rape in that society.

As pointed out to you already, for example, rape prevention by Saudi methods - modifying women's behavior in ways recognizably similar to those you recommend - does reinforce the oppression of women, including abetting rape if opportunity presents itself to a rapist. Some rape prevention methods are like that. The question is whether yours are. It's not a rhetorical question.

This is getting kind of bizarre, this willful refusal to deal with other people's actual posts. What's the point of that? Do you think anyone here is persuadable via such rhetorical behavior?

Only when convenient for the owners. They could be persons or non-persons, either - there was no conflict with slavery in declaring them persons if that designation better suited the needs of the owner (punishment for crime, say).

Notice that the category "things" is opposed to "persons", while both the thing and the person are property. There is no conflict between slavery and personhood - it just depends on how somebody wants to set up the laws.

But the whole thing is moot, because you have your analogy inverted in the first place - the woman corresponds to the slave, obviously and directly, since her right of bodily integrity and self defense is being abrogated in the interests of other people.

 

And where I could, I have, and where I can, I will continue to do so.

I am a male. Unlike many males I know, I am not afraid to show my emotions; when a song comes on the radio I like, I sing it. If something makes me think of my late grandfather, I tear up.

I'm more feminine than most guys I know... and I'm okay with that, for the simple fact that most guys I know... are guys, not men. And I am glad not to count myself among them.

 

Well, it seems to work wonders for Bells and Tiassa.

I, too, think that the sexual dimension is painfully obvious.

Nope.

Say it, Bells. Risk reduction is ineffective. Self-defense is ineffective. Responsible drinking is ineffective. None of this will reduce your chance of getting raped.

Now, prove it.

You’re an attorney that has prosecuted tons of rape cases, but you didn't know the first thing about the insanity defense. That’s odd, isn't it? You've attended self-defense classes, but claim that it somehow inhibits your behavior, when it gives me more confidence and freedom. You even actively lecture about rape and sexual assault.

Well…goddamn, Bells, can’t you pull a medical degree out of your hat? You tell me, does alcohol affect men and women differently? Is binge drinking harmless? Of course, we can drink, but everyone needs to know how to drink responsibly.

There is a distinction between prevention that restricts women’s freedom from those that enhance it.

 

It's not working for you.

Which several people have been trying to get you to acknowledge for some time now. Which side of that distinction does focusing on modifying women's behavior, even blaming them for failing to prepare, fall?

 

It's not working for you, either.

That was in response to survival. And uh, well, ya, when your dead your dead. EPIC FAIL!

 

No, you have not remembered accurately: It wasn't death you labeled as failure, but not meeting your criteria for being prepared in case of sexual assault.

Here's more from you:

You have been directed at least a half dozen times now to the basic problem you have of confusing rape prevention and women's behavior modification. You persist in confusing them. Why do you do that?

Perhaps this is key:

The contention here is that your recommendations restrict women's freedom, with only marginal gain in rape prevention. Specifics have been presented, and simple arguments as yet unrefuted (unaddressed) by you support that contention. But there is a gap: The gap here is that you seem to be aware of no other possibilities for preventing rape. Seriously: the notion that rape should or even can be prevented by modifying men's behavior rather than women's, for example, or by modifying the terms in which men and women deal with each other, seems literally unthinkable for you. It's "changing the world", which cannot happen. Is that the case?

If so, a consideration of one of the most serious rape arenas currently eroding US civilization might enlighten: the US military.

 

Do you have time to read this? Do you disagree with it?

https://rainn.org/news-room/rainn-u...-force-to-overhaul-colleges-treatment-of-rape

I'm taking a vacation.

Toodles.