Mercury - Venus - Earth space drag?

Discussion in 'Pseudoscience' started by nebel, Sep 29, 2015.

  1. nebel Valued Senior Member

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    Earth orbits in the Zero Velocity Zone of the Sun, because of her galactic velocity, not just a one -sided affair like a planet to planet coupling such as Venus/Mars, or Planet/Moon links, ---like Earth/The Moon, Pluto/ Charon. Check it out in Pseudo Science, the "Jupiter velocities cancel?" thread.
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2018
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  3. NotEinstein Valued Senior Member

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    So... not only are you ignoring what James R said to you, you are advertising your own thread in pseudo here in the science sections? What a pathetic cry for attention.
     
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  5. origin In a democracy you deserve the leaders you elect. Valued Senior Member

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    Thanks for reminding us you still have a pseudoscience thread in the science section! I will ask the mods to move it for you.
     
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  7. nebel Valued Senior Member

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    And I thought this little filler would prompt you to tackle these new numbers, their possible implication, and you two do some original, N.Einstein [pseudo] science stuff.
    And the winning numbers are:
    Sun's orbital velocity in galaxy:~ 220 km/s dived by Orbital velocity of the Sun:~ 2km/s = ratio of 110:1; multiplied by diameter of the Sun~ 1 391016 km = ~ 150 000 000 km, 1 AU, the semi major axis of the Earth, the No 1 planet we know for sure to have life.
    It might not be all space drag, but the velocities in the Milky Way, and in the Sun are thus related to the Goldilocks orbit of the Earth, No,1.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2018
  8. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Moderator notice: Thread has been moved to Pseudoscience.

    The numerical relationships relating orbital velocities of planets to various rotational speeds are, like Bode's law, most likely coincidental. Some of the other relationships and resonances mentioned in this thread have explanations that are already well understood by scientists.

    While the numerical relationships pointed out here might seem remarkable or interesting at first glance, nebel has not yet pointed to any important consequences of the observed relationships. In other words, there doesn't seem to be anything in any of this that warrants much further investigation. Moreover, no reason why this should be investigated further has been suggested.

    Essentially, the thread is focussed on trying to find numerical coincidences in reams of astronomical data. In that sense, it reminds me of things like the bible code (which tries to extract messages from a numerical analysis of the bible).

    Because the thread is trying to read significance into coincidence, on balance it is currently better suited to Pseudoscience than our science forums.
     
  9. Dr_Toad It's green! Valued Senior Member

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    Thank you!
     
  10. nebel Valued Senior Member

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    There are at least 5 doublings of orbit distances in the Bode sequence! calling that coincidental is shutting down the need for further research. Even the 3 body problem teaches otherwise. imho

    The very fact of putting these data out here invites further investigation, replication, elaboration by others. It was also suggested, that the propensity of matter to find these Zero Velocity Zones, and remain there for a long time, seems to make them in a way akin to the results of the Lagrangian mechanism. Even the challenge to show these finds mentioned in prior art would be subject of acceptable research, a student assignment.
    The second consequence of the matching velocities is of course internal, the differences in orbital speeds between the mass in general and the retro moving region noon equator region, in the the no drag, zero velocity zone.

    It might remind you of that but it is not, nothing secret about this, it is merely putting order and ratios into already existing data, It is much more like Johan Kepler extracting his laws from the massive data that Tycho Brahe left him . Organizing data is not Pseudo science imho.

    You took it upon yourself to pronounce the Bode sequence, with 5 doublings of orbit spacings, (with research going on) and the 8 Zero Velocity Zones identified so far in the galactic/solar system, (with research barely started) all as co-incidental.
    With odds like that, we will never have a winner.
    I believe, like the theories delving into the Bode " law ", This thread, but more to the point that one that followed, the more general holistic " --Velocity cancel--" postings belong, by definition in the Alternative Theories because
    Coincidences have the persistent habit to ultimately turn out not be coincidences at all. time will tell.

    Surely you can do better than that ?
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2018
  11. origin In a democracy you deserve the leaders you elect. Valued Senior Member

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    I was going to say that it is too bad you won't listen to James R. or anyone else. Really though it doesn't matter, if it makes you happy to pursue your numerology stuff, go for it, but don't expect anyone with an education to engage in the discussion after they see there is no getting through to you.
     
  12. nebel Valued Senior Member

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    fair enough, Behind the numbers of course is reality, and not all of them have been analyzed. Even numbers that have no embodiments in nature are serious stuff. so, just ignore me.
     
  13. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    On Bode's law, by the way: the discovery of many exoplanet systems has pretty much done away with any significance to Bode's law, since those other systems tend not to obey the "law".
     
  14. nebel Valued Senior Member

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    I am not aware of any exoplanet system that comes close to our simple: "double the distance to the next one out " Bode situation. Trappist 1 has resonances, as Bode of course (5 octaves), but a link would be appreciated.
    If we find more situations like that, it must have a common cause, not be a co-incident. If we are unique, then what?
    P.S. I offer an alternate theory for the cause: the thread: " Planets orbit like their stars vibrate" originally published ~ 1980.
    On the elusive "space drag" of the OP. The unintended followup thread "canceled Jupiter velocities" showed that the backward space movement of Venus' nightside --(that is the theme of this thread), --had to reach to Mars, not Earth, to make it ! --now, the latest:
    The Star SiriusA, brightest in the night sky, has the "space drag", cancelled velocities, internally, it rotates faster than it orbits by a little, like Saturn.
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2018
  15. Dr_Toad It's green! Valued Senior Member

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    You seem to be unaware of many things. Too bad, because the world is wide and wonderful when your eyes are open.
     
  16. nebel Valued Senior Member

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    like? ---- lets have links!
    please show me any Bode - type spacing in exo planet systems,
     
  17. Dr_Toad It's green! Valued Senior Member

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    It's up to you to prove your point. Not up to any of your fascinated readers to disprove it...
     
  18. nebel Valued Senior Member

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    If you cared, you would read the proofs presented more carefully, and that way learn something new. There actually is a space drag. Please Google Rotational frame dragging, Einstein. and
    It just so happen that these two threads, Space drag and Cancelled velocities turned out to be related, and overlap in the Venus to Mars situation. Where the projected rotational velocities touch in the same direction, retrograde, just below Mars.
    Re: my conversations with James R:--- see exchange above ( and some are private) I value the input of all and deal with them. Often if they end, it is because my point has been proven, beyond further refutation efforts.
    Nothing stops a dispute faster than the presence of somebody that knows what she is talking about. and
    Yes it is up to you to disprove it, if you think the point is wrong, or badly made.
     
  19. Dr_Toad It's green! Valued Senior Member

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    If you cared to not be a fool....
     
  20. nebel Valued Senior Member

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    you have said nothing of substance.
     
  21. origin In a democracy you deserve the leaders you elect. Valued Senior Member

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    You owe me a new Irony Meter, that comment just caused mine explode.
     
  22. nebel Valued Senior Member

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    Iron and meter are the only terms that could be remotely construed to have any alternative pseudo science meaning, not being off topic.
    glad I helped you get rid of that thing, it had a permanent biased flaw.
    There is no Bode - type sequence in any of the exo planets so far, and rotations really result in retrograde OV regions.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2018

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