LENR (Low Energy Nuclear Reactions).

Discussion in 'General Science & Technology' started by Yetanothersock, Jan 20, 2014.

  1. Captain Kremmen All aboard, me Hearties! Valued Senior Member

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    Jumping to conclusions?
    No. The Crow is still frozen.

    I'm not sure.
    It would depend on how much Industrial Heat have paid for the rights to Rossi's work.
    If it's a small sum, then it's a high odds bet with little outlay.
    If it isn't a small amount, then they will have good reasons to invest.

    Added later.
    I believe it to be speculation, but it isn't a low cost punt.
    According to this article Industrial Heat have raised 11.6 Million,
    which is not a fantastic sum, but not chickenfeed either.
    Darden has spoken positively recently about the company.

    I would guess that Rossi has made a deal based on a percentage of future profits.

    http://www.bizjournals.com/triangle...nvestor-darden-still-bullish-on.html?page=all
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2014
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  3. Yazata Valued Senior Member

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    What bothers me about all of this never-ending 'LENR' hysteria on Sciforums is that it's always an argument from authority. We never see the technical details being released to the scientific community and the results being replicated. And we never see the things appearing on the market and indisputably working. Instead it's always a strangely vague and cryptic endorsement from somebody or something supposedly so credible that everyone else should just put their skepticism aside and believe.

    NASA! Some European university! Now it's some venture capitalist.

    My own opinion of venture capitalists is that sometimes they are great judges of a new companys' prospects. And sometimes they aren't. Here in Silicon Valley where I live, there are no end of entrepeneurs whose start-ups have no chance in hell of succeeding, while their founders live very well indeed on funding they've obtained from VCs. When the funding dries up (earnings? what's that?) the entrepeneur either has already paid himself enough to retire, or starts up another new company with a cool new concept, and looks for another VC to fund it. It's a way of life in Santa Clara County.

    In other words, funding something in hopes that it will someday succeed should never become a substitute for its actually succeeding.

    If this 'LENR' thing ever works commercially (I personally believe that has an extremely low probability) then this Darden guy will look like a genius. It it doesn't, he won't. (Apparently Rossi's already made his millions off of it, so he's looking good either way.)

    The point is, we won't really know that it works (whether commercially or just scientifically, in principle) until the day comes when it objectively and unambiguously does.

    Until then it's just another appeal to faith.
     
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  5. Dr_Toad It's green! Valued Senior Member

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    Isn't that just what a con-man does?
     
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  7. krash661 [MK6] transitioning scifi to reality Valued Senior Member

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    want to buy a bridge ?
     
  8. Captain Kremmen All aboard, me Hearties! Valued Senior Member

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    Not if it's an e-bridge.
     
  9. Alexis Registered Member

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    If you like live, open science... then order in the popcorn and take a peek:

    Constructive criticism is welcomed and encouraged.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2014
  10. Russ_Watters Not a Trump supporter... Valued Senior Member

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    Hey, look - this thread's back! And still no cold fusion!

    Why am I so excited! This is boring! And makes me feel dumb just for contributing to this nonsense!
     
  11. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    No Alexis, I won't "order in the popcorn". On principle, I do not waste my time on YouTube videos without a very good explanation first of why I should. This is because YouTube is well known to be full of shite. A YouTube video is worth zero in a scientific discussion.
     
  12. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Didn't watch the whole six hours. But for a quick summary:
    Scientists put a device together, fed a lot of electricity into it and it got hot. This doesn't seem very popcorn-worthy.
     
  13. Alexis Registered Member

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    18
    Good summary billvon.
    exchemist, please accept my apologies... it was a quick post... i am also adverse to YouTube videos.

    Briefly, the YouTube link was for a live attempted replication of 'Rossi's E-cat', and as stated by billvon "it got hot"... with no excess heat!
    The group of individuals involved in this and other similar experiments are collectively known as the 'Martin Fleischmann Memorial Project', they have a website here: http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/en/
    and a facebook page here:
    https://www.facebook.com/MartinFleischmannMemorialProject

    They perform live open science... anyone can watch, comment, suggest or ridicule... they are non-profit and have the requisite nerdy humour... and have no massive ego's to protect.
    If, like me, you are long in the tooth, and remember getting your hands dirty... then a steady supply of popcorn should be ordered, just kick back and enjoy!
    Just to reiterate ... MFMP have yet to demonstrate 'excess heat'.
     
  14. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    OK, Alexis thanks for clarifying. I applaud the openness of these people, certainly. But I still suspect that the whole LENR business is, as has often been suggested, an example of "zombie science". In other words it is a social phenomenon, arising out the way science is done in society and the various elements of allegiance, psychology etc that inevitably arise from that, rather than a truly valid subject of study.

    P.S. I don't like popcorn much - too much like eating loft insulation.

    Happy New Year.
     
  15. Russ_Watters Not a Trump supporter... Valued Senior Member

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    On the contrary, that sounds exactly like how popcorn is made to me!

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