Israel, Palestine and the Arab/Israel Conflict

"Regrettable". Right. A soldier shooting a civilian girl, despite there being no bomb, is "regrettable". How touching.

And the forced takeover of Palestinian land by Israeli forces for "a fence to defend against terrorism", defended politically by vehement accusations of the world being on the side of the terrorists when anyone gingerly dares to point out that the land wasn't theirs to begin with, is also something that would be described by your intriguingly liberal interpretation of "regrettable".

What are you, some right-wing Christian who hasn't got a clue?

 

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* she was in a closed military zone (i.e. she was not supposed nor expected to be there)

That’s not the point, you missed it again. It’s a habit with you isn’t it.

* soldiers suspected her to be carrying a bomb (tactics used before by terrorists)

I have never heard a 7 year old girl carrying a bomb, mind showing us?

* they shot her, and verified the kill

Not only did they kill her, they went over her body and shot her repeatedly, and that even made the soldiers there feel sick to their stomach. What was it 20 bullets in a defenseless little girl.

* then they came up close enough to see a) it was a little girl, b) she had no bomb

Shocking isn’t it.

the soldier followed proper procedures, though the death of the little girl is obviously regrettable, and not the intended result

The soldier like much of the IDF is sadistic.

So oth how is it being part of the Hamas wing of Israeli politics?

 

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More love from Israel:

Yes the state of Israel who signs on to treaties only to ignore them, and what is the end reslt more terrorism against Israeli’s. I really don’t see why all of Israel cannot be as Oth said closed military zone? If he can justify the death of an innocent child in the circumstance then I can easily justify the death of Israeli children because all of Israel is a war zone, thus no laws right oth? I guess using oth’s logic no death in the region is ever wrong. Live with it..

P.S: I am going to pre-empt this one:

Oth would say "Amnesty international is a anti-semitic organization"

No...truth is "anti-semitic", what a sad statement when people think that hating a language means hating a non-existent race.

 

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She was in a close militart zone

Settlers are in Palestinian land, so its ok to shoot them down is it?

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Well of course if we were to use Oth's logic, settlers are fair game. They are illegally settled on Pal land, and Pals have a right to do whatever they want to them. And since all of Israel, and Palestine is a war zone, there is no distinction on life. So you cannot have it both ways.

 

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Anti-semitic

Enough with the brainless utterings of how people "misuse" the word anti-semitic.

It is clearly defined below, regardless of what 'semitic' means.

People must be truly mentally challenged to need this repeated to them and still not comprehend. Snap out of the Proud_Muslim mindset and read what people say.

 

Enough with the brainless utterings of how people "misuse" the word anti-semitic. It is clearly defined below, regardless of what 'semitic' means.


No it doesn’t actually that is also factually incorrect, firstly Herzl stated that Anti-Semitism should not be confused with religious persecution. So all Jewish persecution prior to Herzl was not Anti-Semitism, A-S is used to connotate that the Jewish people are a racial grouping of people (which is factually incorrect). What do we call those “Jews” who are atheist? According to that definition it cannot be Anti-Semitic, and since most of Israel is atheist…I think you get the point. Our friend oth is an atheist as well, thus what is he? Nothing but a Russian.

 

Hamas considers all of the Holy Land to be Palestine, so Israelis are living in Palestinian land, so it's ok for Hamas to kill them using Oth's logic.

 

It sure is.

 

they had pre-teen attackers before
many times

i can name 3 off hand
1) a 7-8 year old "palestinian" boy tried to stab an Israeli boy the same age
2) 3 pre-teens tried to infiltrate a Jewish community in Yesha with knives and guns though were killed by security forces while trying
3) the 10-yr old carrying a bomb-vest in his bag (unknowingly apparently) to transfer to a waiting party

this "palestinian land" crap - it's not "palestinian land", it's Israeli land.

the IDF's own Chief of Staff reviewed this case, and he found it was satisfactory that no procedures have been violated.
IDF is the same army who prosecutes soldiers for looting and having trigger-happy fingers.

who cares about the media wave of bullshit ... most of what you think you know was already preditermined in your head before you even read anything.
i can totally see the soldier standing there over the dead girl's body, probably with a smirk, saying something like "fuck you" and emptying a whole clip, pausing for a second in the middle
pretty disgusting. probably the same image you have in your head.
but it's simply not what happened

 

There were camers filming the first demos!
They were filming demonstrations when people thaught it was safe to demonstrate.
They are now filming the daily dead, Childeren, women, old men.
The fact that you have no idea these demo's existed and that there are camera's filming the u.s. war crimes is simply proving my point.

L.O.L. So tell me O defender of... Norway, was it? What if the EvilMuslimboogeymen started carpet bomming Oslo, and then killing of dear ones and then continued to take away any hope of freedom in the foreseeable future??

Can you say then that "violence begets violence"? Is it not the NOBLE thing to defend your small family and other loved ones? And what would you trust your own small means, or the benevolence of your agressor.

That's no a problem being concequent shouldn't be that difficult.

:m:

 

"I take it that you must be an American marine then....to have witnessed this."

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And no, nothing of the like. There was not resistance. No one was willing to fight. The first unarmed demo was shot at. The second unarmed demo was shot at.

:m:

 

Any actual links are appreciated

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After they removed Saddam when did they carpet bomb? Who did they carpet bomb? If they did was there anything that triggered that response or did they just need to get rid of some bomb surplus? Again back it up if you can please, thanks. As regards freedom Al Sistani told his followers that they should thank the americans for freeing them and then ask "when are you leaving?" and the shias are the majority in Iraq.

I know this is part of the doctrine of your faith but history in other places has shown that there are other better means of dealing with an enemy that has a decided edge over you in firepower. Were they going around killing people at random before? To pick up a gun and start shooting does beg return fire are you so blind that you cannot see this, for gods sake Bruce look around.

I am consequent, there are better ways to solve most crisis than to pick up a gun and start shooting. Some times it may be neccasary but not often.

What would be inconsistent would be if I said "killing this person was wrong, but it is fine if you kill that person"

 

So Path when WOULD violence be an appropiate response? Defending your family? or how about your Homeland? or how about defending your nation against invasion? would those be appropiate times?

 

Sure if someone is attacking your family etc but that was not what we had in iraq was it? The violence is getting worse and more people are getting killed as this intensifies.

 

I think that with 13 years of sanctions....the stealing of Iraqi oil........the killings of 10-15k innocent civilians......all over 9-11 which no Iraqi had anything to do with......I think that is Exactly what we have in Iraq.

 

Yeah they are really working on making life better aren't they? Come to think of it why don't you tell me who has killed more of your fellow muslims in Iraq in the last 5 months the freedom fighters supposedly protecting thier homes or US occupation forces?

Here is some freedom fighting from this weekend

more freedom fighters from earlier


http://news.bbc.co.uk/cbbcnews/hi/world/newsid_3194000/3194449.stm

Attacking iraqis undoubtedly on thier way out to attack and oppress someone's home and kidnap thier children.


http://ap.washingtontimes.com/dynamic/stories/I/IRAQ?SITE=DCTMS&SECTION=HOME

you know the story there are endless amounts of bombings and iraqis bearing the brunt of it including all those children a few weeks ago. By the way why are the freedom fighters bombing sewage treatment plants and other infrastructure targets that mostly benefit thier own fellow iraqis? Are these really examples of people defending themselves and thier country? But hey if the quran prescribes violence as the best solution to your problem who am I to disagree right.

 

Cheap Shots and unecessary sarcasm Path

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but thats ok....oh yea and Im sure that the US has killed more Iraqi's than anyone else there has. I dont know who is bombing Sewage Plants and why they are but untill those totals match the 10-20k dead from bombings and the 1million from sanctions then your case is weak...you see you cant tell me who is doing the car bombs in Iraq....could be the US to keep the country unstable to justify there presence.....could be Israeli's.......could be Iranians......I somehow doubt it's your ordinary Iraqi who NEEDS these things to survive. I never said that everyone their is fighting as freedom fighters but I do say that I would bet that most of them are. Their are "bad apples" in every bunch(just like in the US military) Why bring Islam into this? This is an occupation topic not a religous one right? does every argument have to fall back into violence in the Koran with you? Since there are no car bombings goin on in the UK or the US right now means that your hate-speech about muslim violence is nothing but parinioa and has no fondation....please remember Path that terrorism isnt something that only happens to YOU the West has supported and directly given plenty of it themselves....since you wanna bring the Koran up though:


2.11] And when it is said to them, Do not make mischief in the land, they say: We are but peace-makers.
[2.12] Now surely they themselves are the mischief makers, but they do not perceive.


Sounds like the West to me

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i can name 3 off hand
1) a 7-8 year old "palestinian" boy tried to stab an Israeli boy the same age
2) 3 pre-teens tried to infiltrate a Jewish community in Yesha with knives and guns though were killed by security forces while trying
3) the 10-yr old carrying a bomb-vest in his bag (unknowingly apparently) to transfer to a waiting party

Merely telling us means nothing, showing means everything.

this "palestinian land" crap - it's not "palestinian land", it's Israeli land.

LOL! Oh no, in no way is it Israeli land because no on recognizes it as such. Is the Kuril Islands Japanese, even though the Russians own it but the Japanese claim it? Sorry but the green line of 1948 clearly denoted where Israel’s borders would be, her illegal annexation of land in 1967 was just that illegal, and thus not Israeli.


i can totally see the soldier standing there over the dead girl's body, probably with a smirk, saying something like "fuck you" and emptying a whole clip, pausing for a second in the middle
pretty disgusting. probably the same image you have in your head.
but it's simply not what happened

How do we know, the soldiers that were there were disgusted at the actions of the soldier. It was on the CBC, I don’t have time to look for it. Obviously he took much enjoyment in shooting up a girl 20 times! Why did he shoot her 20 times at close range? That’s Masochism if anything else; please oth the IDF is not mother Teresa incarnate.