Is there any agency that regulates wasteful transactions?

Discussion in 'Business & Economics' started by entelecheia, Sep 20, 2012.

  1. entelecheia Registered Senior Member

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    281
    Exist any more wasteful business than shoe fetish? (wet & messy, burning, crushing, etc.)
    Is it not the most uneconomical hobby ever? Even more uneconomical than drug addiction and alcoholism? as they are often excluded from their families; they ��waste away themselves alone��.
    http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/Womens-Shoes-/3034/i.html?_nkw=trashed shoes
    If 100 women become regular trashed shoes buyers, they might impoverish themselves in a medium term, even if they are also sellers.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eb7dHXSEss8

    It is possible to calculate its economic & sanitation impact, summing its four main factors:

    -wetting & messing, burning, etc., of new shoes or weareable
    -trashed shoes can�t be used outdoors; a long term waste
    -trashed shoes have an extremely low useful life
    -potential bacterial transmission

    The two secondary factors:

    -continual costs of cobbling
    -time spent on the web

    To prevent religious censorship blame it to��licentiousness�� ��sodom and gomorrah��, as it did with AIDS, Columbine Shooting, Dee Snider's trial, etc., the economic�sanitary phenomenon should be studied in depth.

    I guess, stricter rules for shoe burning, cutting, etc, could be enough to start; and also some kind of pre-sell bacteriological scan.


    I would like to know your opinions
     
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  3. Rhaedas Valued Senior Member

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    Why are you concerned about it? How has it harmed you?
     
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  5. entelecheia Registered Senior Member

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    Im worry on the worldwide economical crisis. This is a serious thing. The situation could turn into third world starvation and more violence from the Arab world.,nuclear menace of Korea. It is a delicate balance which have been conquered.
    I can't believe that economists of Harvard and Stanford were not expecting that.
     
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  7. Rhaedas Valued Senior Member

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    Because of people buying used shoes? Yes, that's the root cause.

    If you're trying to say that people not spending money wisely is a problem, then yes, I'd agree that's a part of it. But you want the government to regulate what people purchase? There's so many things wrong with that idea I'm not sure where to begin.
     
  8. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    Prior post was deleted as spam - had two links to commercial shoe sale web site. Poster, entelecheia, was not yet banned but soon will be if persist in pushing the limits.

    Forum B&E is for economic discussion or questions, but asking for advice on how to control cheating employees in his hotel in another B&E thread was also pushing the limits, certainly of B&E but perhaps not in a forum more about psychology.

    This is your final warning - shape up or you will be shipped out.
     
  9. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    An agency to control wasteful transactions?

    That's the Fed, isn't it?
     
  10. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    23,198
    Your post belongs in the JOKES & FUNNY STORIES thread. In a limited area, we do have an agency controlling "wasteful transaction," - the FDA prevents the transactions snake oil salesmen once made.

    Not the Fed nor the SEC, nor anyone else is stopping JP Morgan or the banks and rating agencies they pay, etc. from selling AAA rated trances of toxic trash, while they themselves are taking short positions on the very things they are promoting to the public as good investments.

    The US is now government "Of the rich, for their corporations, and by their lobbyists" and with the PACs now allowed to even openly spend unlimited funds to help their candidates get elected by a nation of ill-educated sheep so now it can only be changed by following the example of the French people about 225 years ago but less violently, I hope*, with internet organization of massive strikes, much larger 99% movements, etc.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

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    POWER TO THE PEOPLE! (NOT THE RICH ONLY)
    Ultimately it is always the people who stop abuses, including "wasteful transaction" that make a few richer.
    Before that happens, like with the French, the sheep must not be able to feed their lambs. - With 1 in 7 on food stamps and 1 in 3 collecting some form of Federal financial aid, US is slowly moving to that point.

    * This hope is probably ill -founded in a nation with approximately one hand gun for every adult, male or female. Many of them unregistered. For a couple of weeks I had an unregistered German Luggar in nearly new condition, with both clips having same the stamped number as the gun, one in the unscratched holster. I got it, unwanted, for $50 from friend who unexpectedly had to leave for home country the next day. I fired it a couple of times, cleaned it, and sold it for only ~$150, still with no records, certainly none showing I had ever owned it.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 15, 2012
  11. Carcano Valued Senior Member

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    6,865
    I dont think I'll be staying at entelecheia's hotel of horrors any time soon...:bugeye:

    The problem is not wasteful transactions...it's wasteful production.

    However, waste can be turned into benefits through the miracle of a targeted consumption tax.
     
  12. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    No, but some that promote it so well I suspect they get operational advise from Brazilian politician crooks who over fund projects to get kick backs:

     
  13. elte Valued Senior Member

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    This video is pretty plain and matter-of-fact yet explains how competition in itself tends to be wasteful, or at least counterproductive. The most relevant part begins after 14:20 minutes:seconds.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqgYJu8Bwus
     
  14. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    I watched 10 minutes starting at 14:20. One very clear example (not in those 10 minutes) is two party Congress. Generally the outs work hard to be destructive of the progress cooperation could achieve. - I expect that the "fiscal cliff" will mainly be kicked down the road (said so in post months ago) or at least many parts eliminated and others greatly weakened in their effect, BUT it is possible that political competition will focus efforts on trying to make sure the other party gets most of the blame as US slides down into deep depression.

    Certainly social structures, which were built during 1000s of years of scarcity, do instill a competitive approach to every aspect of life; however, this is not proof that competition was not Darwinian selected into the genes as speaker believes. In fact in the eons of scarcity it seems that it would be - humanoid who out ran another did not get eaten by the tiger or on the positive side, the better tree climber got the remaining high-up apple. None the less man is not controlled by his instincts etc. alone, but can over rule them when reason tells him to. Also man is definitely a "social animal" but this mainly means his group competes with others. Certainly advanced countries, like France & Germany, are both better off now cooperating; like inside the Eruo Zone instead of having their third major destructive war in 100 years, but old views only die with the death of their holders, so that Union still is not complete, with each nation wanting an advantage over the other.

    The speaker, may well realize that he is dreaming of the communistic ideal - hoping for the rise of the "new soviet man" who would not compete with others but work for the common good, giving to all according to their needs and taking from all according to their abilities, etc. I don´t know of any utopian group that has survived 100 years and most don´t make a decade, before competitive strife breaks them up (often over sex relationships or assigned jobs instead of money). Again the fundamental problem is how we educate the next generation so they can restrain the destructive aspects of innate competitive drives for the advantages of all.

    Scandinavian countries (at least Norway which I know about) have done this, (despite any innate competitive drive) so it is possible. One big factor IMHO is that the 1st grade teacher of a group is their 2nd, then 3d, etc. teacher too until they graduate. (No passing a problem child to next grade.) All the community knows who is responsible for their child´s formal education. - She waste no time learning which students are lacking and which are gifted in specific areas. Thus, first day of 3d grade she may have Jon (already at 5th grade level in math) separately helping / teaching Sissel, who is still not doing long division, Etc. I.e. the class is a cooperative group working together with the teacher to make sure ALL are well educated. This continues into their later political society. - Quality health care is for ALL, don´t throw trash out of the car window, take care of the less able as you would like them to do for you if conditions were reversed, etc. US is too egotistical to learn better ways from others, even when falling far behind other schools systems in almost all universal tests of achievement, especially in math and sciences. Unfortunately the US is more based on this principle:
    "I got mine - if you don´t, its your fault, but here are some crumbs from my table so you don´t embarrass me by starving to death in the street." AND more than half the voters have no understanding of economics, so gladly vote for "more benefits now and send bill to their children" politicians. Etc.

    SUMMARY: US takes pride in the strong competitive structure of its society - when shame is more appropriate.

    BTW, Norwegians pay high taxes but gets good value for them (health & education mainly) from its good government:

    GDP / person: Norway* (position 8 from the top) = $54.200 & US (position 11) = $49,000

    Gini index (highest rank is more equality of wealth & Sweden is best ranked of all 136 evaluated at 136)
    Norway and Denmark are nearly as good at ranks 132 & 133 but US with rank 42 is nearly the worst of major countries (tiny kingdoms, Arab nations, etc. with great concentration of wealth are closer to rank #1, the worst inequality, but US is gaining on them. - In a more recent data (full year 2011) US climbed even higher, and faster than ever before as the rich got richer and the middle class shrunk and got poorer.

    Federal debt to GDP ratios: Norway at 57.7% and US at 67.7%.
    AFAIK, Norway has little local government debt, but US certainly has a lot with some cities already in bankruptcy and several states nearly so.

    Data from subsections at: https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/rankorderguide.html

    * Most of the oil income is held in a trust making investments for future generations for when the oil is gone, and is not part of current per capita income.
    AFAIK, Norway is the ONLY oil exporter to not rob wealth from its future citizens for current consumption. Amazing what educating well ALL the population can do.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 28, 2012
  15. elte Valued Senior Member

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    Billy, I agree almost 100% with you. Even on the competitive nature not being in our genes, which I'm glad that you pointed out as being unsupported by evidence, since I have never been much good as a writer and often can't spend enough time to actually say something that people can read and understand. I think the video's content generally gets better and better all the way to the end, so it would be good to see the rest if you have some spare time.

    It seems you remember well my love of the main communist ethical principle, "from each according to his ability, to each according to his need." I understand this as best for the best possible society in the long run, and it defies the DNA by willpower, and it works only as long as everyone deeply understands that it is a true ideal.
     
  16. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

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    I agree with this and add: It only works in societies, like those of Sacndinavia, which educate well all their voters. When that is not done, as is the case in the US, you get a majority of voters who vote for the politicians who promise: "more benefits now and send bill to future generations" so debt grows ever larger and eventually the currency becomes nearly worthless.

    I was fortunate to get free of cost (full needs scholarship at Cornell and paid instructor positions at JHU while getting my Ph.D.) an educational opportunity second to none. A special, experimental, 5-year program that meet ALL the requirements of both the liberal arts degree and the Engineering College degrees too. (Cornell discontinued it as it was too tough for most. About half my class transferred out to easier 4-Year programs like Electrical and Chemical Engineering.)

    I was very poor: worked for my meals, baby sat, repaired lab equipment, and had many brief jobs, but still one year did not have bus fare home to West Virginia for Thanksgiving. Thus I have personally based empathy for the less well off in society. I believe those in the US, like me, who were very well educated have a duty to try to make the US more like a Scandinavian country. Hence I took one summer off from my Ph.D. efforts to become the operational leader of the civil rights movement in Baltimore, which after two prior summers with the "moral persuasion" approach had achieved very little. I, with help of many, especially rich girls with cars from Goucher College, made great (on good weather Sunday ~$25,000) loss of business for Restaurants. Near end of that summer, the Restaurant Association turned 180 degrees and joined us (The "Civic Interest Group") to ask the MD legislature to make race-based discrimination illegal in all of Maryland, which they very promptly did.

    I always, when post related, point out that local funding of schools in at the heart of US´s poor educational achievement performance compared to ALL other advanced nations and why US is not able to compete with most of them. I.e. poor neighborhoods can not afford good schools or good teachers. Richer neighborhoods pay better, have safer working conditions, and more resources like books in the library, computers, etc. so the poor areas get the unfit teachers. The Rich like it this way - good supply of cheap maids and other labor for cutting their grass, washing their cars, etc. Most of the US well off, with some notable exceptions, usually only the billionaires, and a majority of Republicans are guided by the principle I stated in last post:
    "I got mine - if you don´t, its your fault, but here are some crumbs from my table so you don´t embarrass me by starving to death in the street."
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 28, 2012
  17. elte Valued Senior Member

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    I really like what you've done and how you've done it.

    I've not come from a family that is known for having any fame or fortune, and ancestry has a big impact on descendent's' path in life. The United States does offer an environment conducive to trying to obtain those things, but I'm glad that I chose not to go after them.

    I could add a little more to the notion behind that quote and I don't think you will mind. A lucky lot in life is often seen as an accomplishment. That view is strange to me and I don't desire to play the lottery, even. It would be like trying to take more than I need, for one thing.
     
  18. Carcano Valued Senior Member

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    Does this mean that no one will be allowed to own what they 'desire'...as opposed to what they 'need'?

    Do you want the government to force you and others to work according to whatever the government decides your abilities are?

    What if the government decides that you are a highly skilled pastry chef...but you prefer gardening?
     
  19. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    22,910
    The agency approach to resource allocation didn't work so well for the Soviet Union, China and their client states. The fact is for all it's flaws capitalism constrained by a bit of socialism and a healthy dose of a well informed democracy is the best resource allocation method known to man.
     
  20. elte Valued Senior Member

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    Aw no, it should be voluntary. But the system ought to be set up where people know why they don't want to be greedy, and then it gets set up so they don't have to act greedily. We have a long way to go to get to a system like that, but without education of the people first in what should and could be, it is very unlikely that anything even sort of close to utopia could be achieved.
     
  21. Carcano Valued Senior Member

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    What defines 'greedy'?

    I dont 'need' ice cream...but I like it.

    Is my desire for ice cream a form of greed?

    Do you want the government to force citizens to understand why they dont want to be greedy?

    Shoud the government imprison or execute people who dont accept your definition of 'education'?
     
  22. elte Valued Senior Member

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    1,345
    One way of looking at it is desiring to take more than one needs, especially to try to get pleaure from it, even though one knows there are people without enough.


    I don't want that but sometimes it looks necessary like with slavery and it's aftermath. Even in that case, peaceful means would have been better if it could have been figured out.

    I don't see why you asked that in light of my earlier comments. No one should be physically punished just for for having differing opinions.
     
  23. Carcano Valued Senior Member

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    Well you cant have it both ways. You either force people to accept your opinions, or you apply them only to your own life and let others live as they choose.

    Look at your dining room table. Most of its cost went into aesthetics rather than the strict functionality of holding cups and saucers.

    For a table strictly serving one's 'need' it would be nothing more than a plywood rectangle with four square legs...thats it.

    Should the government start evicting people from beautiful homes and tear them down to make way for pre-fab shelters?
     

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