Is breastfeeding obscene?

Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by ElectricFetus, Jun 23, 2009.

?

Is breastfeeding in public obscene?

  1. Yes

    5 vote(s)
    9.3%
  2. No

    49 vote(s)
    90.7%
  1. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    I don't know, I assumed why they hid it is because they don't want to see a naked breast, perhaps one that leaking milk even, no matter how well shirts and slings are designed to hid these things, do you disagree?
     
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  3. swarm Registered Senior Member

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    So is nice long hair.
     
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  5. swarm Registered Senior Member

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    Did you even bother reading the fallacy?

    Removing stigma is not necessarily a claim that breastfeeding is "good" or "right" and breastfeeding is actually natural and there is no more reason to stigmatize it than other forms of children eating in public.

    Now breastfeeding is definitely better for the mother (reduces incidence of breast cancer, for example) and the child (improves immune response, for example).

    Does that make it "good" and "right?"

    Do you even care about "good" or "right" or are you just taking a cheap shot?
     
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  7. swarm Registered Senior Member

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    We didn't hide it, but we did like a bit of privacy to make it more of a family thing.

    We don't hide changing either.
     
  8. swarm Registered Senior Member

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    4,207
    Breastfeeding, the Immune Response, and Long-term Health

    Breastfeeding provides unsurpassed natural nutrition to the newborn and infant. Human breast milk also contains numerous protective factors against infectious disease and may influence immune system development, as noted in previous studies of infant response to vaccination and thymus gland development. If immune system development is significantly improved with the introduction of components of breast milk, then prematurely discontinued breastfeeding may facilitate pathogenesis of many chronic diseases later in life (eg, autoimmune disorders). The authors summarize the reported effects of breastfeeding on the development of the suckling infant's immune system and discuss possible consequences to immunologic health when breastfeeding is discontinued prematurely.

    http://www.jaoa.org/cgi/content/full/106/4/203

    That said, bear in mind this is a highly emotionally charge topic and even professional sources may be biased. Personally I feel that humans are pretty resilient, especially in early life and I would expect kids to bounce back like they do for most any early set back. That's just my opinion though.

    Another interesting immune revelation is that "protecting" kids and adults from pathogens weakens their immune system and giving them vaccines strengthens their immune system. In other words, the more you use it short of catching a catastrophic disease, the stronger it gets.
     
  9. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    peeing is also natural, and thus there is no reason to stigmatize it more then other events of excretions from sexual organs. I also like when I'm being quoted out of Wikipedia.

    Peeing is also good for the person doing it, thus it is right?
     
  10. swarm Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,207
    Having been in settings where there was a lot of naked running about, it really isn't that titillating. Seeing nursing is even less titillating.

    Maybe pervs are easier to titillate, but I've got a pretty strong sex drive. If it was the least sexy I would have expected a bit more feedback from the south pole.

    No one has yet answered my question about whats wrong with obscene?
     
  11. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    really?

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    hair is adjustable, its is a social norm in some not all cultures for women to have long hair and men to not, its is not a secondary sexual characteristic.
     
  12. swarm Registered Senior Member

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    4,207
    So? As long as you clean up after yourself I don't care where you pee. In Germany you can pee where you like as long as your back is to the majority of people. I was using an ally one time and a fellow came up and joined me.

    Florence has urinals installed on the side walks that date back to Roman times and are perfectly functional.

    Get over your pee fixation already. Nobody cares.
     
  13. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    You never read my argument did you, if we can have these things allowed why not breastfeeding and vis versa? A lot of people have problems with the vis versa. I'm not advocating against public breastfeeding, I'm simply trying to reason why some find it offensive, and then you have to claim I have a urine fetish, fuck you.
     
  14. swarm Registered Senior Member

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    4,207
    Yes really. Just because some societies suppress it, doesn't mean it isn't a totally useless, counterproductive, peacock feather of a secondary sexual characteristic.

    In fact usually it is suppressed because it is a secondary sexual characteristic, hence the tradition in western nations that only young available women let their hair grow long and let it down, but married women and nuns must keep it up or cut it short.

    You don't get out a lot do you?

    Take a look at the women around you and see who has long loose hair and who doesn't.
     
  15. Bells Staff Member

    Messages:
    24,111
    You missed the point. Your argument could be reversed to the simple fact that if men are forced to pee in public toilets, then women should also be forced to breastfeed their children in toilets. You'd be happy for your child to be fed in a toilet?

    Because if you're going to have public urinals out in the great outdoors, then everywhere becomes a toilet.


    So you view your urine as being the same as breastmilk? I see. I take it when you have a child, you're going to attach it to your penis for it to drink from?

    While the breast can be considered a sexual organ, its primary function in women is to feed the offspring of the woman. Milk is not discharged from the breast as urine is "discharged" from your penis. I can assure you, when I breastfed my children, I could not stand or sit anywhere and have it come out in a stream and write my name in the snow or anywhere else with it, as you can with your urine. And unless you stick your penis into a suction machine to have the urine removed from your bladder, then no, you cannot compare the two in that regard either. Nor does anyone actually see, smell or come into contact with the breastmilk, with the exception of the baby who is sucking it into its mouth. When you pee, not only can it be seen if it is done in public, we can also smell it if you have eaten certain food, come into contact with it if you shake after you tiddle or drip or dribble onto the ground, as many many men do. Again, cannot compare and nothing in common. Nor is breastmilk considered bodily waste. Urine is.


    Hang on... You're saying breastfeeding/breastmilk and urine have many things in common, and you're calling me an idiot? Okay.

    /Pat on the head..

    Whatever you say.

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  16. swarm Registered Senior Member

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    Saying you have a "pee fixation" is acknowledging that is all you are talking about. It is not accusing you of any kind of fetish.

    But its ok with me either way. If you want to explore pee start a thread and knock yourself out.

    But if you already are for breast feeding, to go on and on and on about pee rights is at best obnoxious and off topic.

    Peeing and defecation at the table in a restaurant leaves a big stinking bio hazard. It is not comparable and your average 3 year old can figure this out.

    You need something at least remotely equivalent or people are going to wonder why you are fixating on that particular subject at every one else's expense.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2009
  17. Enmos Valued Senior Member

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    43,184
    3/34

    What's the discussion still about ?
     
  18. PsychoTropicPuppy Bittersweet life? Valued Senior Member

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    No clue. I guess there are still some people here who think that breastfeeding incites lustful feelings in people.

    Breastfeeding mums should use their breasts as weapons; "milk"pistols and shoot those perverted bastards. Joke.

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    Holy motherf*cking Hell. Breastfeeding is a danger to society! It puts each and everyone at risk to turn into a lusty wolf who jacks off to babies drinking their mum's milk. Oh nooooes.
     
  19. Bells Staff Member

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    24,111
    And apparently, women are meant to have lustful feelings when we see men pee and because it's so obscene, that is why it is not allowed in public. But breastfeeding, which it seems is the same as peeing and has just about everything in common with it, is just as obscene to some as peeing in public, but women are allowed to do it in public and men are not allowed to pee in public.

    Equal rights for men and women.. "if she can feed her kid in public.. then by god, I should be allowed to whip out my dick and piss in public as well.. because pissing and breastfeeding is exactly the same thing".. I think that is the current argument from the challenged few in this thread.
     
  20. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    I've been talking about much more then pee, should I accuse you of being blind?

    I've never argued for such a thing, strawman.

    it is very much equivalent. I stated comparable qualities, if you don't noticed those qualities it is you not I that has a problem.
     
  21. PsychoTropicPuppy Bittersweet life? Valued Senior Member

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    1,538
    Haha.

    I must say...I had to chuckle quite a bit at some posts in here. Especially at the arguments some brought up to support their theory that breastfeeding is, indeed, very obscene and absolutely comparable to peeing and shitting.
    I thought that if I'd go after their arguments then breastfeeding your baby in a restaurant is just as obscene and dirty as shitting on the floor of that very restaurant. Because obviously, breastfeeding reeks just as bad, and puts everybody's health at risk.

    Do this people have no decency? I must admit..before reading the posts in this very thread I've never thought of the possibility that breastfeeding could be considered as perverted, inciting lust, and compared to shitting and pissing. I've always considered breastfeeding as something "beautiful" because it somehow represents the bond between the baby and its mum. And certainly, I would have never thought that the bond between a baby and its mum is the same as guys peeing on walls and shitting in public places.
     
  22. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    18,523
    Or the present norm were women are forced to breast feed in some place private, though not necessarily a toilet.

    no just the immediate vicinity of the urinal, but if you really want to get technical everywhere is already a toilet considering how other organism has been shiting all over the place.

    I never said that, you continue to refuse to acknowledge general equivalents or the fundamental reason why some object to public breastfeeding: they don't want to see exposed breast just like they object to external urinals because they don't want to see exposed penises, and some people find extra offense to seeing fluids spurt from these organs, if you don't want to acknowledge that as the reasoning behind baning breastfeeding and want to throw strawman and red herrings at me well I can't stop you.

    The primary function of feeding babies is the nipple, not the breast. You obviously have not been listening to my women have breast argument, why other apes don't have breast, etc, read a link perhaps?

    http://news.softpedia.com/news/Why-Do-Women-Have-Breasts-46783.shtml

    Just one thing in common negates your whole argument, I have named several which you refuse to acknowledged.

    I states specific things they have in common, "not many" not vague but very specific things, I've been to Europe and yes they don't have as much of a stigma against peeing and shitting in public nor such a stigma against the display of breasts, my reasoning explains why.

    I'll accept this as your admission of defeat.
     
  23. PsychoTropicPuppy Bittersweet life? Valued Senior Member

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    1,538
    If they find it so obscene then why do they stare at the mum who's breastfeeding? Nobody is forcing them to look at her. Nobody. Plus, it's not very well-mannered to stare at others. To stress this out - staring at others - could be considered just as obscene.
    Peeing and shitting in public places, i.e. out of facilities that were made for those very actions, hasn't been banned just because of its obscenity, but because of the health hazards that are brought with it. Know how sh*tty it was to live in the city in medieval times and later on? Because it was horribly unhygienic because everybody threw their sh*t and piss out of the window into the streets and of course tons of people had to die because of the consequences of that. Nobody died of breastfeeding though. Nobody.

    Basically, your arguments are completely void.

    PS: I can assure you that every doc out there will confirm that urine and faeces in general have nothing in common with breast milk. Nothing.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2009

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