Is a vegetarian diet good for the brain?

Discussion in 'Health & Fitness' started by psychostasis, Jul 21, 2016.

  1. psychostasis Registered Member


    In the future could scientists discover that all plant-based/vegetarian diets lacks certain important nutrients for an optimal 21st century's brain nutrition?

    ''As we examine our universe, nothing else in it even remotely approaches the complexity of the human brain''
    (Stephen Hawking. The Grand Design)

    With the contemporary technology is it possible to characterize the complete nutritional molecular composition of all meats in order to manufacture supplements containing all these nutrients for vegetarians?

    Toxicity of Meats and Milk:

    1. Dietary Protein, Growth Factors, and Cancer. Author: Colin T. Campbell. The American Journal of Clinical Nutrition.

    T. Colin Campbell, PhD, is the project director of the China-Oxford-Cornell Diet and Health Project (the China Study), a 20-year study of nutrition and health.

    2. Calcium and Milk: What’s Best for Your Bones and Health? Harvard University. The Nutrition Source.

    Ecology Nutrition:

    Food and Agriculture Organization Newsrom: Livestock a Major Threat to Environment. Remedies Urgently Needed. 29 November 2006, Rome.


    What Contemporary Studies of Fowl Mean for Science and Ethics. Carolynn L. Smith. Macquarie University.


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  3. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

    In the past, scientists already came up with that conclusion and recommended several dietary supplements that have been available for a while. As far as I know, 20th century vegetarians generally did very well on IQ tests, and were healthier than carnivores in several respects, notably cholesterol, weight and blood pressure. India out-reproduced Europe for 4000 years, and have fewer cases of heart or gastro-intestinal disease and more instances of remarkable longevity.
    I don't see how a 21st century brain will differ from the previous century's model, or why its nutritional requirements should be any different.
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  5. billvon Valued Senior Member

    They have already discovered that, and it is vitamin B12. But adequately replaced, there's no problem with "brain nutrition" as you put it.
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  7. psychostasis Registered Member

    Could you quote the study on IQ?

    With so many reliable studies (like those of Harvard, The Oxford Study, Giessen Raw Food Study, Dr. Campbell, Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn, Dean Ornish, Michael Greger, etc) on the toxicity of animal protein, why the controversy seems to never end?

    Deutsche Welle: Vegetarianism on the rise in Germany, but schools draw the line at veganism.

    A German court has ruled that veganism is too risky as a school meal option. With nearly 10 percent of its population going meatless, Germany has the highest rate of vegetarianism compared to its European neighbors.

    I found a site called Authority Nutrition an Evidence-based Approach, it claims there are some brain nutrients found only in meat, fish and eggs in optimal quantities and/or as a better bioavailability source: Vitamin D3, Carnosine (found strictly in animal tissues. This nutrient can reduce damage caused by elevated blood glucose and may have strong anti-aging effects), Creatine, Docosahexaenoic Acid (DHA).
  8. psychostasis Registered Member


    The American Journal of Clinical Nutrition: Population characteristics and biochemical markers according to the type of diet and vitamin consumption

    In this study, which included subjects who had adopted different types of diets, omnivorous control subjects had lower tHcy concentrations and better cobalamin status than did both the LV-LOV subjects and the vegans. The same tendency was found when comparing omnivores with LV-LOV subjects who took vitamins, but the differences were not statistically significant, except the difference for MMA.
  9. psychostasis Registered Member

    Any reliable studies found a causal link between organic fruits and cancer?
    What about organic tree nuts and allergies?
  10. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

    No; I based that on my immediate circle of very bright friends. But Germany vs the Trump campaign might give you an indication.

    Three reasons: The powerful beef industry, advertising - most notably of fast food - and the aggressive style of debate adopted by bacon-eaters.

    But if you were healthy to begin with, you don't need it. As for the aging -
  11. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

    We eat vegetarians.
  12. psychostasis Registered Member


    1. A sort of Moore's Law could exist within the human brain's endless evolutionary process. That endless increasing complexity may need nutrients from new specimens to continue? (i. e. insects)

    2. Do "smarter" animals really suffer more than "dumber" ones?
    When we are uncertain, even only slightly, about their ability to experience pain or to suffer, individual animals should be given the benefit of the doubt. There is a great deal of uncertainty about the phylogenetic distribution of pain and suffering.

    I noted they should also have included fish, for whom the evidence supporting sentience and consciousness is also compelling.

    Do "Smarter" Dogs Really Suffer More than "Dumber" Mice? Marc Bekoff. Psychology Today.
    Marc Bekoff, Phd. Former Professor of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology at the University of Colorado.

    Studies with captive fowl have revealed that they possess greater cognitive capacities than previously thought. We now know that fowl have sophisticated cognitive and communicative skills, which had hitherto been associated only with certain primates.

    What Contemporary Studies of Fowl Mean for Science and Ethics. Carolynn L. Smith, Phd. Department of Brain, Behaviour and Evolution. Macquarie University:

    3. If the vegetarian diet is the most rational diet, and if the whole Western World were vegetarians and permacultural. That would free women from their monotonous and intelligence-beclouding work in the kitchen?

    (A semi-raw vegetarian diet is a clean diet; less toxins are expelled through the skin, less laundry is needed, etc)

    Is there an ethical link between vegetarian diet and gender equality?
    Is gender equality an intrinsic ethical foundation in favor to vegetarianism?

  13. psychostasis Registered Member

    I forgot the dates:

    Do "Smarter" Dogs Really Suffer More than "Dumber" Mice? Marc Bekoff. Psychology Today. Posted Apr 7, 2013.
    The Chicken Challenge: What Contemporary Studies of Fowl Mean for Science and Ethics. Carolynn L. Smith. August 2012.
  14. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

    I can think of no reason to suppose that. During the evolutionary process, a large, highly adaptable and mobile omnivore will have tried every source of nourishment on the planet. Of course, we can invent new ones just for fun, but our biological needs are more than adequately met by what we've already despoiled.

    The smarter and animal does not necessarily have a more complex sensory apparatus, but it's likely to have more imagination and interpersonal relationships and therefore be able to experience more kinds of suffering. A mouse is afraid, because every larger animal it encounters is likely to be a predator: he expects to be killed. A dog may have experience of trusting humans, maybe even loving them, and therefore feel hope, disappointment and finally betrayal when a human turns on him.
    Watch. If it does what you would do in its place, it's feeling what you would feel in its place.
    I don't know how many western women are trapped in an intelligence-beclouding kitchen. There seems to be a fashionable interest in the culinary arts among the prosperous middle class and a lively interest in good eats among all classes. However, vegetarian cooking is not without its skills and challenges, so we're okay on that front.
    It would definitely be a boon to the environment.
    Our sweat doesn't stink as much, but we still get our clothes dirty - especially when working in the garden.
    Perhaps an indirect one... make that tenuous. Vegetarian men are generally more calm, mindful and considerate than carnivores, so maybe they also think about social justice and human rights and treating people with respect. Maybe they're more pleasant company for women? I don't know... I hope.

  15. psychostasis Registered Member

    Permaculture requires little physical effort, today there are permaculture stores that provide all fertilizers, seeds, etc.

    In any case, if there are no stores nearby, exercise warms the body, then less clothing is needed.

    The former vegetarian healers Sebastian Kneipp, Adolf Just, Louis Kuhne, recommend cold water baths to cool ''the inflammation'' of the abdomen, and consider that the skin is '' a third lung '' therefore recommend naked body must be in contact with cold air and sun because it nourishes skin, improves thermoregulation, and detox through the skin.
  16. psychostasis Registered Member

    Although speculative, the future of human brain nutrition is one of the topics that intrigues me the most. Could you recommend me some books, authors or articles on this?
    I know some speculative concepts such as the Quantum Nature of Consciousness of Roger Penrose, but what would be the opinions of the most eminent neuroscientists?

    Do you think that in year 2100 the global percentage of vegetarians would be higher?
  17. psychostasis Registered Member

    Why do you think the molecular characterization of the complete nutritional composition of all meats, milks, and eggs is not important?
  18. spidergoat Venued Serial Membership Valued Senior Member

    They are idiots.
  19. psychostasis Registered Member

    They were empiric healers. Sebastian Kneipp was a Bavarian priest and one of the forefathers of the naturopathic medicine movement, Adolf Just was a German Naturopath. He was the founder of the sanatorium Jungborn in Eckerta. I did a bad description of an Louis Kuhne's method consisting in a therapeutic cold bath in which cold water covers up to the height of the abdomen, which aim is to lower the temperature of the abdomen and genitals.

    The belief is that the unnatural diet, stress, lack of fresh air, etc; a lifestyle contrary to nature is what causes diseases.

    Have you heard about Naturopathy?
    It is too long to describe here.
    Natura Medicatrix, Rerum Natura, Only Nature Cures: water, sun, air, earth.
  20. spidergoat Venued Serial Membership Valued Senior Member

    In other words, quacks. Cooling the abdomen? The body regulates temperature, and unless you have a fever, there's no reason to do that. There's nothing empirical about it. The AMA was founded to combat this kind of dangerous and ignorant foolishness.
  21. psychostasis Registered Member

    Louis Kuhne created an establishment in Leipzig, Germany in 1883, where he cured thousands of various illnesses and diseases. See Louis Kuhne Wikipedia.

    Regarding vegetarianism it seems they were not so wrong.
  22. spidergoat Venued Serial Membership Valued Senior Member

    I agree that eating mostly vegetables is probably a good thing for modern people. But there's no such thing as the blanket label "toxins". Unless you mean mercury poisoning or something. It's just nonsense, not supported by scientific research. And also that was in 1901, about the same time as that other wackaloon, John Harvey Kellogg. It was a fad of the times. Not even doctors knew much about nutrition.

    Wikipedia got something right:

    In the context of quack and alternative medicine the term "toxin" is used to refer to any substance supposed to cause ill health. This could range anywhere from trace amounts of potentially dangerous pesticides to safe food ingredients such as table sugar or controversial food additives such as monosodium glutamate, splenda and aspartame.
  23. Jeeves Valued Senior Member

    To the former, I'm not up on the literature, but it shouldn't be hard to find.
    To the latter, It almost certainly would be much higher (or else moot, with the technology to make meat and eggs and milk without animals ) if civilization were to progress - if civilization were to survive. Given recent events, that's a very, very big "if".

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