Iraq Falls Apart

Discussion in 'World Events' started by Yazata, Jun 11, 2014.

  1. zgmc Registered Senior Member

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    So whats your point? There are going to be a few bad cops out there. Most of them are trying to do the right thing, and not get killed in the process. Do you have any suggestions on how to put an end to incidents like those in your post?
     
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  3. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    Unfortunately we seem to be missing the greater agenda ISIS is working to in this discussion. It has very little to do with Iraq per see. It has all to do with their desire to set up a state/nation of extreme fundamentalism in the name of their God. This is not a war in Iraq but a war with a global agenda.
    and one not to be underestimated IMO. Chemical, biological weapons use appear to be a distinct possibility IMO [they are way too confident in displaying their excessive brutality]
    Iraq sectarian instability only provided a platform.

    Notes: No new cases of MERS coming out of Saudi Arabia since early 07/2014 - and no vaccine announced.
    Annual pilgrimage to MECCA Hajj 2-7 October 2014
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2014
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  5. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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  7. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    If only someone had predicted that all this would go to hell. Someone on the site, maybe. Ah well.
     
  8. youreyes amorphous ocean Valued Senior Member

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    "few" bad cops kind of went over the limit and became "many" bad cops. Enough incidents of tasers killing people, police over using their force, killing pets, and getting away with it clean. That's USA for you there.
     
  9. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    It appears that the USA has managed with limited air strikes to allow the evacuation of the Yazidis and start to change the image the world has of USA military interventions.
    I feel many a world government and people are looking at the Obama administration policy shift in action with intense interest.

    From here in Australia the recent limited and contained air action has proved successful and congratulations and thanks to the USA and it's people are in order. IMO

    Send the bill to the UN ( simply for accounting purposes

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    )
    perhaps the new principle of USA Foreign Policy should read :

    "Think smart and don't fart" [chuckle]
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2014
  10. youreyes amorphous ocean Valued Senior Member

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    Oh please US ****ed up Iraq and now with few airstrikes they will make up for their bad image? Maybe if they pay tabloids the lies, than yes.
     
  11. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    Do not make the mistake of ignoring the petrodollar treaties.
     
  12. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    LOL, here is one small problem, you cannot substantiate any of your beliefs and accusations. The US has empowered the Shia majority in Iraq which favors long standing American for Iran and alienates long standing American Arab allies in the Gulf who sit on the world's largest oil reserve.
     
  13. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    A brain is a terrible thing to waste.
     
  14. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    Have the Yazidis indeed been evacuated? I found some strange source that said thousands had been, but I don't have any further confirmation and other papers only indicate that the US and UK probably won't attempt such an evacuation.
     
  15. youreyes amorphous ocean Valued Senior Member

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    please elaborate. (only sculptor)
     
  16. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    It started when Nixon took us off of the gold standard, then made a deal with Saudi Arabia wherein they would only trade oil in U.S.dollars, and we would provide them with weapons, and protect them. This was to strengthen the US dollar by turning it into a needed commodity for buying oil. Within a few years most of opec signed on. The main beneficiaries were the USA and British banks. And, of course the opec treaty members.
    So, we traded the lives of generations of us soldiers for the free spending of congress and our fiat currency.

    That is/was a delicate balance, and seems to be unwinding expensively, slowly and painfully.
     
  17. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    And I don't suppose you would have any evidence to back this up? When did Nixon make this deal? Where is this agreement. And an ill written Wikipedia article isn't evidence.

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    I don't suppose you heard of the 1973 Oil Embargo where Arab states fixed the price of oil to gold. The truth is you have no clue. Oil was priced in dollars long before Nixon. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_o...il_against_gold.2C_1973_re-pricing_adjustment

    I suggest you look up Bretton Woods Agreement. The reason Nixon took the US off the gold standards and withdrew from Bretton Woods was because of a balance of trade problem and the De Gaulle's penchant to exchange dollars for gold. None of this has anything to do with petrodollars. The truth is that oil has been priced in dollars since the discovery of oil in the Arab states and reinforced with Bretton Woods, except for a very brief period in which it was tied to gold during the 1973 Oil Embargo.
     
  18. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    "1973"
    funny you should mention that, as that is when Kissinger made the deal with Saudi Arabia.

    Fortunately, I had bought a triumph gt6 that spring. It got and gets 27-29mpg. Darned lucky timing. Not a bad ride for a british pos.
     
  19. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Well good, now perhaps you can name the agreement? Then again maybe not.

    I had a Spitfire

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  20. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    The news I am getting suggests that :
    • The very limited airstrikes [relatively incidental] managed to allow an escape corridor to be opened by the Kurds. The airstrikes were sufficient to drive the ISIS in to cover and not be so exposed.
    • That when USA special forces finally made it in to assess the situation regarding a military "covered" evacuation of the mountain they found that the numbers of remaining refugees were much less than expected and that their condition was considerably better than thought earlier (due to effective humanitarian aid delivery). The remaining refugee's eventual escape being almost certain in the near future without "on the ground " USA military involvement .
    • That most refugees had managed to escape immediately after local ISIS dived for cover and changed tactics from Conventional to Guerrilla.

    Generally with out qualification my guess is that about 30-50,000 refugees were saved from almost certain death by this almost trivial military action by the USA in the form of airstrikes. So successful that the need for further and more complex action has been avoided.
    I also get the feeling that the Yazidi situation may have been significantly conflated initially and the numbers reported (150,000+) on the mountain were far less than actual.

    (Not to underestimate the Hysteria coming out of Iraq and hysterical global reactions to deliberately promoted social media propaganda by ISIS )

    *Based only on the info available via the worlds press etc
     
  21. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    Hysteria:
    Recent TV program commentary by a Supreme Court Judge, here discusses the Australian Jihad-ist man who allowed his 7 year old son to shock the world with the image of him holding a severed head up for the photographer, states that the man has a long history of mental health problems, diagnosed Paranoid Schizophrenic and multiple convictions for some petty and some serious crime here in Australia.

    http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2014/s4067434.htm
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/australiaandthepacific/australia/11036230/Australian-jihadist-who-posted-decapitated-head-image-is-paranoid-schizophrenic.html

    The world, including most governments, I believe, is still in shock from seeing this image on social media (viral) and one has to wonder how many ISIS militants are also severely challenged with diagnosed clinical mental health problems beyond the Islamic zealotry beliefs they seem to hold.

    Iraq itself:
    Given the massive trauma inflicted on people in Iraq over extended time, it is not surprising IMO that many will exhibit severe mental disturbance and manifest serious psychotic symptoms, where radicalization is a common outcome.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2014
  22. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    The United States-Saudi Arabian Joint Commission on Economic Cooperation
     
  23. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    That is a commission. It isn't the agreement your referenced.

    "The United States-Saudi Arabian Joint Commission on Economic Cooperation, established on the heels of the Arab oil embargo and price increases, fosters closer political ties between the two countries through economic cooperation; assists Saudi industrialization and development while recycling petrodollars; and facilitates the flow to Saudi Arabia of American goods, services, and technology. The Commission has a system of parallel command in which the United States Secretary of the Treasury and the Saudi Minister of Finance and Economy serve as co-chairmen and the U.S. Assistant Secretary of Treasury for International Affairs and the Saudi Deputy of Finance serve as coordinators.

    U.S. technical assistance is funded almost entirely from the Saudi Arabian Trust Account in the U.S. Treasury. The U.S. Treasury presently views the Commission's function as one of providing technical assistance and advice to the Saudis. The Commission's current programs emphasize the development of Saudi infrastructure through technology transfer. It is essentially a reactive rather than initiating organization, but this is harmonious with Saudi desires at the present stage of the country's development. The Commission has 16 formalized projects in various stages of completion and several projects in the negotiation stage. U.S. commercial interest could be appropriately served if the Office of Saudi Arabian Affairs and Representation made information available which would fully appraise the U.S. business community of the opportunities available from Commission activities. Such information should help the U.S. business involvement."
    http://www.gao.gov/products/ID-79-7

    There is nothing in that commission which commits Saudi's to denominating their oil contracts in dollars and there is nothing in that commission about selling weapons.
     

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