Discussion in 'World Events' started by mike47, Nov 25, 2009.
And the new policy is?
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Win what exactly? Whats the end point? When they are all lolling around in McD's in shorts and tank tops, worrying about a recession?
Well there's that and the "colonial outpost, resource well, slavery to the USA thing." Once that's in order, sure, I guess they can have McDonald's and worry about recessions.
Then the goal is not to win, its to appropriate.
It's whatever you say it is SAM. I'm not debating the point with you because (a) I know that there's no chance that you could even recognize a truth that contrasted with your POV and (b) I'm so tired of the subject that all I can muster is a tongue-in-cheek jab at your various hyperbolic claims.
I think its sad that the people of Afghaistan are nothing more than hyperbole.
They are your claims SAM, I've just condensed them down to something less wordy and, perhaps, a bit more bellicose.
I have two family members there as we type, so I obviously care a great deal about the place. I'm just ignoring your one-sided and blatantly deceptive statements in lieu of sources I respect and trust.
What is there to trust? This war will not make anything better for Afghanistan, there is little consolation from a continuation of being subject to more weapons they cannot defend their children from.
For Razia, the outcome of the war is already home to roost. Its already her past, present and future. If they kill her now, it will be a blessing and a release.This war or the one in Iraq is not about the people, you don't kill people you care about to make their lives more tolerable, its not even about the American people who stand to get nothing more than more people who look at America with lifelong hate and bitterness and desires for retribution. Its certainly not making things easier for us in the subcontinent since we've had more war exercises in the last two years than in the ten before that. All that Obama is doing is escalating the rhetoric and tensions and with the rampant Islamophobia pouring out of Europe, there is a sensation of pressure rising. I have cousins there and we hear what is happening in the cities and markets, the general feeling that everything will go to hell in a heartbeat.
Remember....the first time in history a president in the US left the same secretary of defence........:shrug::shrug:. Gates was brought by steel hands in politics and the same hands kept him working with Obama .
People, really. Life is so simple sometimes. The wars are not crazy, they are just immoral. They are basicly RESOURCE wars, Iraq is about oil and keeping the petrodollar the dominant world currency, not to mention removing a threat to Israel, and Afghanistan is about a natural gas pipeline.
What is so difficult about this to understand???
You are required to show credible proof on those. The Iraq one I'll grant you is directly related to Oil; I've yet to see anything approaching truth regarding your claims about Afghanistan.
Or, he was just doing a damned good job in a time that required stability.
Thank you for playing. The first one is common sense. Taliban, AQ and other BS, we bombed them into oblivion and seriously, an occupation is probably the worst thing for trying to make them disappear. Let's say you are an average Afghan and you don't like the Taliban, but you definiately don't like foreigners and occupiers.
The 2nd one was the Texas meeting between Taliban leaders and oilexecutives in the summer of 2001. They were told they either accept the offer for the gas pipeline and profit from it or they will be taken over...
There is simply no logical answer why the US would try to stay and nationbuild Afghanistan.
Oh yeah, 3rd, you might want to look up on the map how the US forts line up compared with the proposed pipeline. They are strangely overlapping...
But to return the favour: Could you please prove why we are staying using facts and logic?
Syz, just because YOU'VE come to a conclusion doesn't mean that it's logical. Again, you can either post something other than your own meanderings, or you can expect your post to be moderated. This isn't a thread for speculation. It requires substance. HELL, I'd even settle for something resembling substance on your part. Surely, you must have links to pages where some investigator has stumbled upon this glaringly obvious fact?
I mean, I guess the 9/11 attack and subsequent fear of a terrorist breeding ground wasn't enough for the US to begin nation-building. It isn't pride that keeps it going (a la Vietnam). It's some unproven fact which you label as "logical."
Sorry, it doesn't pass the smell test.
I would say Afghanistan is more likely a case of "fight them over there so we don't have to fight them over here"
And I don't mean the Afghanis, but those guys who would be unemployed and flipping burgers in the US. War is currently the only industry in the US still having high employment
source: John Nagl on the Rachel Maddow show.
Surprisingly, I agree--somewhat--on that point. Not on the Afghanistan part, but on the point that the USA can not politically cut the military because of what it's pumping back into the economy. My little brother is receiving a commission in the Airforce for lack of work in his collegiate field (and a great commission at that). Right now the ranks of the military are flooded with over-qualified citizens who cannot otherwise find civilian jobs.
Recruiters have commented on how easy it is right now to fill the ranks.
Was it really that hard to google "afghanistan gas pipeline"?
For extra credit:
P.S.: I like the fact that I am held to a higher standard than the US government. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
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The US government isn't posting on this website, so stop bringing up non-sequiturs. You are posting here. If you have a problem with the standards the US government is held to, become a citizen and write your congressman. Or do nothing. I don't care. But don't fool yourself into believing that poor standards outside the forum alleviate you from having to follow standards here.
So, you've posted a link that shows that the project is non-existent.
Excellent. Even IF the project weren't scuttled, you've yet to demonstrate that such a project is the motivating factor for the US governments stubborn involvement in Afghanistan.
In other words, just because one thing happens while the USA is there would not necessarily mean that it was the REASON for being there. You, however, are required to demonstrate the connection if you care to make the claim.
Separate names with a comma.