Human gods

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Xelasnave.1947, Apr 1, 2020.

  1. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Anyone interested in the various human gods that were present around the Mediterranean that were based on/in astrology?
    It seems there were many cults that constructed their god on astrology including christianity and I wonder if we can make a list and see how many used astrology to invent their particular god.
    Alex
     
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  3. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    The common features were...as the Sun had 12 constellations it travelled through over the year... the human god would have 12 followers, ...And the perception was the Sun died mid winter and then after three days started back North seemingly to rise from its "death" so to these human gods were somehow put to death and rose after three days to match how the activity of the Sun was perceived.. death on the cross seemed to be a parallel to the Sun appearing on the crux the Southern constellation. Even the account of the birth of Jesus seems astrology based..the "Three Kings" stars in Orion lining up with Sirius to mark where the Sun rose on 24th of December suggests an attempt to relate the Jesus myth with the Sun.
    And the relationship to "ages" like the fish being used in christianity representing an "age" but taken now to have a different implication.
    I wonder if anyone else has studied this aspect of early religious cults.
    Alex
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2020
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  5. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    This is a very short video for anyone interested in the astrology link.


    Alex
     
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  7. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Is there any basis for suggesting the ancients did not know where the Sun went at night?

    Perhaps at least that is the message I get from the following video but importantly this video gives an incite into why we find so many human gods seeking that link with the Sun.

    It's rather long and I am sorry about that but the first ten minutes will give one the picture if you don't wish to waste time viewing until the end.
    I hope my posting of these two videos is not seen as just posting without explanation but the first relates to the first two posts and the second to help understand the possible motivation in the inventors minds when creating the many human gods.



    Alex
     
  8. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    12 god pantheons seem to have been rather common
     
  9. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    I was born on the 12th of June. I have 12 followers. Could it be? Am I God?
     
  10. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    We can't really be too harsh with the Ancients, as obviously they did not have much to work with except the observations they made and the way they interpreted them, albeit mythical. It was an attempt to explain the universe around them...seeing gods in objects like the Sun and Moon, imagining groups of stars etc, affected one's life etc was all they were able to imagine, while lacking technology, experience and no shoulders of past giants to stand on.
    Things gradually improved and more realistic scenarios were theorised....sort of like the Newton phrase, standing on the shoulders of giants.
    Religion is akin to Astrology and is what we imagine when ignorance prevails

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    hilosophy is what we don't know: Science is what we know:
    I'm speaking generally of course, so I don't want any Philosophers jumping up and down, as they did when Lawrence Krauss was critical of philosophy. Although imo, he was simply illustrating its limitations.
    Science really came to the fore and stripped religion/Astrology of much of its fraudulent claims with the advent of Newton, Darwin and then a great almighty rush in the late 19th and 20th centuries with the likes of Curie, Rhuterford, Roentgen, Meitner, Bohr, Planck and of course Einstein and onto the liikes of Feynman. Probably the greatest trio of that lot and many more, would be Newton, Darwin and Einstein, yet two of those were religious and one even dabbled in Alchemy of sorts.....I say of sorts because the basis of changing one element to another is valid. And of course to their credit, the religiousity of Newton and Darwin, did not stop them from their great scientific discoveries, which in reality stripped much away from the religious/Astrological claims.

    Havn't watched your video yet Alex but will later today or tonight.
     
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  11. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I know I sound harse but my respect is much higher than I convey.
    I use that "Did not know where the Sun went at night" thing to bring scripture into context...

    I wonder if in the future some humans are travelling to the next star at ten fold the speed of light say similar.

    Excellent post I will risk a like...I mean if you like something you should be able to like it...it just worries me to be accused of having an agenda...I think I gave Jan a like once...because I liked what he said..or that he showed decent behaviour...

    Alex
     
  12. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Heck there is a list of thousands one more can't hurt...sure why not...first job declare a public holiday in your honor.
    Alex
     
  13. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    I need to be careful though...I think Jan loves me near as much as river!

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  14. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I can't support this...however I think the zodiac may of helped as a calendar in effect...oddly because of my astronomy interest the progression of the constellations figures in my life as it tells me without looking them up the objects to photograph next month...

    I believe the Eygiptian priests would observe Sirius rising and were able to predicted the floods would arrive two weeks later...their astronomy/ astrology was probably much more different then we can now understand.

    I have felt lost for the last four months because I can't follow the sky (smoke then rain..so much rain)...I got a glimpse the other night and it took me a while to reset my clock as it were.
    Alex
     
  15. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    Like any guy I'm always spouting out my philosophies or sayings like "People get what they really want and not what they say they want". If that was in the Book of Seattle 2nd chapter 1st verse and I had the title "God" after my name, I think it would carry much more weight!
     
  16. LaurieAG Registered Senior Member

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    If you search for 'Robert Graves the Greek Myths pdf' you will find an interesting 400+ page pdf file from www.24grammata.com that is a compilation of the various recorded details about the myths from ancient times. If you can get the paper version (2 volumes) you will also be able to read all of the footnotes which were omitted from the pdf.

    He talks about an earlier ancient Greek pantheon which only had 6 gods, mainly female dominated by Hera, and was based on the early matriarchal society where the 'king' was a prince from another state who came and married the 'queen', who wielded the true powers. In the new pantheon Hera was born from Zeus' thigh and the patriarchal form of society became dominant.

    He goes on to describe how the many cults of Hercules developed and changed the ancient Greek pantheon to a male dominated one with 12 members. He uses the marriage of Odysseus and Penelope in the 'Iliad' and 'Odyssey' as a reflection of the change of the pantheon as Penelope leaves her home state and goes to Ithaca to become Odysseus' Queen.

    He also associates the 12 labors of Hercules with the zodiac and describes the many different versions. It's an interesting read and much more interesting if you can read the footnotes.
     
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  17. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I am interested to find when the girls were taken out of the picture.
    I find religion and mythology so interesting but the more you learn, as with many things, you find there is more ..there is always more.
    Thank you sincerely for your input and I will follow up...I really need something to help manage my boredom.
    Alex
     
  18. cluelusshusbund + Public Dilemma + Valued Senior Member

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    No... i am all powerful all knowin God... the creator of all... an of course... everthang is exactly the way i want it to be

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  19. LaurieAG Registered Senior Member

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    You may also like to search for a pdf of Robert Graves The White Goddess: a historical grammar of poetic myth, as this goes into the change throughout Europe as recorded in the various mythologies. The story loses the plot towards the end, possibly through overthinking and a too open mind, but it is an interesting read none the less. His work might not be considered entirely acceptable in the post 1950's postmodern, female studies academic sphere as he argues that the change from matrilineal to patrilineal rule was due to the suppression of child sacrifice cults by the Heracles cults.
     
  20. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    I am the Lord thy God, the Sun doth shine out of my arse!!

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  21. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I was just now looking at my planetarium to find suitable objects to photograph with the rig that I have cobbled together and I notice that the Sun is very close to Uranus.
    Alex
     
  22. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    Paddoboy likes it that way.
     
  23. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 70 years old Valued Senior Member

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    If you zap me home from where I am I will let you know

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