How did Noah fit all those animals on the ark?

Please note, this is not indication of a flood, but rather of movement of the tectonic plates. The world is been absorbed into the earth near Australia and pushed out on the opposite direction. Those fossils are there because that area could easly have been underwater a billion of so years ago under an ocean.

 

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Michoacan (Mexico):

When the flood waters began to rise, a man named Tezpi entered into a great vessel, taking with him his wife and children and diverse seeds and animals. When the waters abated, the man sent out a vulture, but the bird found plenty of corpses to eat and didn't return. Other birds also flew away and didn't return. Finally, he sent out a hummingbird, which returned with a green bough in its beak. [Gaster, p. 122]

Source - http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/flood-myths.html
http://library.thinkquest.org/C005854/text/mythfarworld_f.htm#AZT

 

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Hey wiz4rd, do you teach geology, that was amazing?

 

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It just occurred to me that you were referring to the biblical flood account versus other flood myths rather than the bible in general. I'll have to go back and look at your original post on "most detailed," but I was answering with the assumption that you were saying that all biblical accounts were the most detailed available on any subject the bible's many authors wrote of.

I hope that clarifies my responses to you.

But to answer your question above, I agree. The biblical account of the flood is far more detailed that the earlier accounts. Indeed, as you line up the accounts in order of date (the earliest being, I believe, the Deluge), they progress steadily in an evolution of added detail and embellishment.

We know that the Gilgamesh epic is probably the source for the Noachian flood myth because of particular details. But we see a steady progression from The Deluge, to the Atrahasis, to the various renditions of Gilgamesh -for which there are several known versions (Babylonian, Akkadian,...). We know that the myth is originally Sumerian because of the writing itself and the details mentioned in the earliest written versions, so it probably existed as an oral tale long before the final, written version of the Noachian myth.

 

Details in Noah's account predate the others.

 

It was still written after the Spanish began converting the locals. This is exactly the type of acculturation and embellishment/creation of myth I was talking about.

 

Which ones? And what is the supporting data to demonstrate this?

 

I could find no record of someone call Tezpi/Tapi (i notice your story is changing) in that link you gave me.

No real source or info yet. The above link is a rehash of the fraudulent information. No sources, no citations.. etc

 

The bible is a book of spirtuality so it's primary focus is spiritual. It just so happens that it touches on certain issues. I've have found it truthful in those issues but yes I meant just the biblical account of the flood. On other issues of history the bible relates a passing refrence to nations and people...very rarely is it directly relating individuals unless they impact Israel the Hebrews or of the many other than the 40 people that wrote the bible.

Indeed it does!

This is not uncommon when we hear things there tends to be added embelishments. The grape vine effect.

I realize that you lean toward this understanding. But "know" is a potent word indeed. The evidence is circumstantial. A forgive me...but I'm likely to take the bibles account as singularly true, untill proven otherwise.

Why? Like I said before the bible refrences History we know Jesus refrenced Noah and there was no semblance of mythical or story like aspect to his warning not to be like those during Noah's Day who didn't take note.

Also considering all those Flood tales...consider just for a moment that none of those people ever questioned whether the flood had occured. Yet they did endlessly speculate on when the next one occured.

The resulting centuries were marked by an increased intrest in astral phenomenon. Several bible writers were known for there study of the stars and were highly sought in ancient times. Those ancient people seemed to be able to discern that disaster was synonomous with heavenly omens and this continued well into the 13th and 14th century. The bible chronicles these people's attitude and behavior.

There are so many accounts...more than 200 I belive exactly 270 global in all. This establishes history if nothing else. That this event did occur. Few things are globally accepted. Science acknowledges them but this one is refuted. I ask why as history...the telling of the past says otherwise?

That's more than likely that written forms of the bible proceed the tail of Gilgamesh but this like I said is circumstantial. It doesn't establish origin but writing date. We have 270 similar accounts, who wrote they're version first out of an epic that occured everywhere is like comparing these accounts to scientific paper in which different scientist stumble upon the same conclusion and it's a mere matter of who publishes there version first.

But it's not that simple. The Flood was an event that occured everywhere and affected every thing not an isolated event that can be followed and traced along a path almost with ferensic like detail.

If (from your perspective) the bible account is true...writings of these events would have taken much time to proceed as civilization rebounds plants and tools used for writing became available. Some made due...the bible writters waited...and those accounts as a result verbal or otherwise were recorded for prosperity.

 

Of course. That's the conclusion you've already arrived at without the need of supporting data.

Like someone once told me, "know" is such a potent word. How do you "know" this? I'm interested in how you know without citing biblical mythology to prove itself, by the way.

Floods happen. I don't see what the problem is. Volcanoes happen. Tornados happen. Typhoons happen. Earthquakes, Tsunamis, etc.... all which get blamed on supernatural events by aboriginals the world over. The most pervasive natural disaster known to man is flooding, which plagues us even today. I'm not surprised the superstitious think it to be magical

You've mistyped. I think you meant events rather than event. Plural rather than singular.

There was no single flood event that affected the entire globe. Period. It isn't a claim that is supported in either cultural mythology (assuming that myths have bases in fact) nor in the geologic record. If you have evidence that exists outside of biblical mythology, I'm sure we're all interested and you have a Nobel prize destined your way.

 

There's tons of evidence for it, for those without head in hole.

 

IAC, this would imply that the land vertebrates Noah took on the boat (cats, elephants, horses, alligators, gorillas, etc.) all evolved within their species in a matter of only 15,000 to 20,000 years.

If Noah took just tigers on the boat for the cat species, those tigers would have had to evolve into things like cheetahs, cougars, pumas, domesticated cats, etc. in a matter of only thousands of years when really evolution takes millions upon millions of years.

If your theory was right, we would still be seeing interspecies evolution today, yet there is no sign of it.

 

Sure. Just cite one or two of the most convincing sets of data for us that we might discuss it here. In this forum. A discussion forum. Your failure to cite one or two of the most convincing data sets will be taken as conceding the point.

 

I'm unsure that I get what you're saying. You deny that a cat can evolve into a dog, (example), while happy to state that a cat can change into a tiger, (seemingly very quickly)? What exactly allows a cat to turn into a tiger but not a dog?

According to who and what data? I mean are you trying to convince me that these ancient people could somehow see the entire planet? While crossing the English Channel there came a moment when all I could see was water, (admittedly my eyesight isn't great). The world at that moment, from my perspective, was entirely flooded. Of course I know better than that. The question is.. did they? If you say yes you'd have to support it with something.

 

Yeah, this is the main point. My pet cat's species could not evolve into lions and tigers in a matter of 20,000 years. That is like one second in the scope of millions of years. Dinos didn't evolve in 20,000 years. They evolved in millions of years. Slight difference.

 

You're cat (if not fixed) can provide the sperm to combine with a tiger's egg to cause a "crossbreed," that's the point.

 

Yes but according to you there was no tiger to put the sperm into. Just one species of cat Noah brought with him.

 

It was a cat which is not now seen, as the pair(s)' progeny dispersed in isolated breeding groups into new and variable ecologic niches, thus the many "species" of cats are merely "naturally selected" offspring of the Ark cats.

 

Good rationalization.

 

It's born out with that the "species" of cats are interfertile, right?