Heaven is real, says neurosurgeon

Discussion in 'General Science & Technology' started by arauca, Oct 10, 2012.

  1. gmilam Valued Senior Member

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    2,689
    We don't have a choice in the matter. We all come from the same stuff and we all return to the same stuff.
     
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  3. origin Trump is the best argument against a democracy. Valued Senior Member

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    Sorry if this has already been said but I am not going to read all the page here.

    Why are the NDE experiences never about how bad death is - you know like hell. I don't recall a NDE where the person came back and said "well the afterlife is certainly going to suck!" As a matter of fact it seems everyone says it just swell and I doubt that they are all Lutherans or something. So I guess we all get to go to heaven - great I suppose. You know I bet that is really going to piss off the fundies. Hopefully the fundies have a little heaven where only they are so that they can feel good about themselves.

    There is not even any advice offered from the returnies of the NDE to indicate there is a special behavior to get to heaven; like you all need to believe in Allah or you need to believe in Jesus or you need to help the poor or you need to sacrafice a chicken on alternate Tuesdays.

    All the NDE experiences are just peachy. Well that is a relief, we can do pretty much whatever we please!
     
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  5. Trooper Secular Sanity Valued Senior Member

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    No, they're out there. Just Google "near death experiences of hell". Good trip vs. bad, I suppose.

    [video=youtube;B9bHee6Idt0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9bHee6Idt0[/video]
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2012
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  7. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    You are already the joke if you think that you think with something other than your brain. I can disprove that with a baseball bat.
     
  8. origin Trump is the best argument against a democracy. Valued Senior Member

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    Well that's great! Now we can know what the right religion is to get to heaven. All we have to do is research the NDEs and see which is the right one. Ha ha got you on that one God you can't trick us into guessing the wrong religion and going to heck.

    I sure hope the right religion is not a real restrictive one!
     
  9. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

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    15,058
    ??

    How do you know that??


    It appears the above is just your belief, nothing more.
     
  10. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

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    I categorically oppose the idea of taking people's experiences that they had when ill, dreaming, on drugs or in other forms of trauma, as somehow grounds to believe in heaven, hell, God, angels, or any such thing that is typically considered as "spiritual."

    A spirituality based in any way on dreaming, drugs, disease and distress is a sick spirituality.

    I would use the experiences due to dreaming, drugs, disease and distress neither as evidence for, nor against spirituality.

    If a spirituality is to be legitimate, it has to be arrived at by means that seem reasonable, actionable.
    And if a criticism of spirituality is to be legitimate, it has to be arrived at by means that seem reasonable, actionable.



    It represents no such thing.

    If all is one, then there can also be no cooperation, no acceptance, and no love, since, if all is one, there are no individuals who could cooperate, accept eachother, or love eachother.
     
  11. seagypsy Banned Banned

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    1,153
    Bi-wynning!

    Why are you so closed minded to the faith and beliefs of others? You seem to project the idea that anyone who does not believe as you is somehow substandard less intelligent human than you. While at the same time you can never really divulge what you believe. Do you think you are more deserving of the awesome wisdom that you hold and that no other human is worthy of knowing what you know? You seem to think you are the authority on what is spiritual and what is not. Are you god? Are you omnipotent? I don't think so. So how dare you make any claims of what spirituality actually is. Do you have empirical evidence to support your claims of what spirituality is? Do you have proof that these people cannot have a spiritual experience while on drugs?
     
  12. Gravage Registered Senior Member

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    1,241
    True, that's statistics, but the reason why I don't believe in statistics when it comes to testing something for example, is because it doesn't count all the factors, it could or it couldn't be, when something it's too foggy, than it cannot be considered serious method for proving disproving something. In this case you're playing with apples and oranges.
     
  13. seagypsy Banned Banned

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    1,153
    Well generally, I have seen you reject any evidence presented as invalid if it presents any reasonable argument against your claims. And the only evidence you are left with repeating is that it is what you say it is because you say so, of course you disguise it as something else every time and rework the words when you are called on it. As far as I am concerned you are no longer worthy of discussion. My evidence for that is because I believe it is true. The same evidence you give for the existence of life after death. Hey if the evidence of belief is valid for the afterlife then it is valid to prove your insignificance as well.
     
  14. Gravage Registered Senior Member

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    Again wrong, just a while an russian solved a 100 year old problem in mathematics, they offered him million dollars and teaching on prestige faculties, and he refused them all and told them leave me alone.
    http://theoriginalwinger.com/2010-0...100-year-old-problem-then-turns-down-1m-prize
    http://techland.time.com/2011/05/03...ld-problem-then-refuses-million-dollar-prize/

    I'm talking about these kinds of people. Sylvia Brown and John Edward are nothing like these people. Sylvia and John want to be popular on TV and other medias, while those people with genuine unusual abilities are running away from them. Again you're mixing apples and oranges, thinking that you're right, but you're not, you can't accept that people want privacy and modesty, leave me alone.
    If you're good in something your product sells itself without marketing and advertisements.
    And people come to you without presenting yourself in media.
     
  15. Neverfly Banned Banned

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    3,576
    He was psychic?
    We know mathematicians exist. That's all fine and all but where are the psychics?
     
  16. Gravage Registered Senior Member

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    The only evidence you represent is that you 100% reject the possibility of alternatives working, which is close-minded. I'll rather trust to my experience than laboratory tests, which use statistical holes (and let's be honest they don't prove anything, you can easily say people in these experiments are frauds) I have more than enough experience to tell that science is not always right when it comes to alternatives treating, but alternative alone cannot solve the problem, this is why I keep saying first classic medicine, and when nothing is left go to try alternatives in every possible way.
     
  17. Neverfly Banned Banned

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    Goofy stuff. So, you say, try the regular medicine, but if it doesn't work, try homeopathy. Your open mind needs a good screen door to keep the bugs out.
     
  18. Gravage Registered Senior Member

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    Again my point here was that there are undiscovered geniuses in science as well (and don't want to be discovered), and don't want money and fame, as well as there are people with genuine abilities who are in the same way undiscovered and don't want to be discovered at all.
    Just leave me to live my life.
     
  19. Gravage Registered Senior Member

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    And give me one reason why I shouldn't try homeopathy (or anything else) after nothing from classic medicine helps, you obviously want to die, if classic medicine doesn't help you have nothing to lose.
    I don't understand such thinking.
    You cannot trust science every single word it says, because this is multi-billion worth business, not science anymore. Scientists test what they want to test and that's it. You as the individual has the final word, not science.
     
  20. seagypsy Banned Banned

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    You trust your experience and we will trust ours. Is that fair? It seems you want us to trust YOUR experience. Sorry that isn't going to happen. I have more than enough experience to know that perceptions are not everything. And that the human mind is fuckign amazing and can entertain itself in a myriad of ways. But I don't expect you to understand that. I don't want you to. I want you to go on living with whatever beliefs give you hope and sense of purpose so that you can be a functional human being.

    But if you put your ideas out here as fact, we will tell you what we think of your ideas just as you are free to tell us what you think of ours. If you don't like being laughed at, stay quiet. We all run the risk of ridicule when we post here. If you can't take it. Piss off.
     
  21. Neverfly Banned Banned

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    3,576
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWE1tH93G9U

    Homeopathy costs money, troop. Why burn it? Even if dying, you can find a more productive use for it.
     
  22. Gravage Registered Senior Member

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    No, you don't trust your experience, you're too skeptical to try everything, just because you found out a fraud in this it doesn't mean it's all fraud, I've been cheated by several people, until I actually heard about this one reiki master, and of course I thought he was a fraud like everyone else (based on previous experience), but than I was soon proven completely wrong., you obviously blindly trust science as someone believes in God, try everything in life most of those people try to regain their health, yes there are many frauds in alternatives, but who says they are all frauds?
    Try everything across the entire globe.
    You take science as religion, and not trying new stuff, you should go away, you can't handle that you might be wrong after all.
     
  23. Gravage Registered Senior Member

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    Cern costs 10 billion dollars, you tell me what's better for me.
    I was giving an example, but you there are other alternatives which don't require any kind or any quantity of money, and believe it or not, they work.
     

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