Halo vs Star Wars

Hey Frieza, I see you're posting the same BS that you're infamous for on Factpile (although it would have been somewhat more prudent to not post under a separate user ID towards the end).

The small town bit isn’t particularly useful unless you can define the are of a small town. Although given your track record, your affinity for vague and unquantified statements should really come as to no surprise.

At its maximum size, the surface temp of the fireball is 7000 degrees Celsius (although this also assumes that a turbolaser behaves like a nuclear blast. Hint: It doesn’t), sufficient temperature for vaporization. For a nuclear detonation at peak scaling, the fireball radius in feet is equal to 145 times the yield in kt to 0.35. In other words, the formula is r=145*y^0.35 , where Y is KT and R is in feet.

Now here is how it gets tricky, how big is a small town? My hometown in Israel is classified as a village by local standards, but has a population of 20,000 and a surface area of 6.8 square miles. Thus the yield required to vaporize (not just blast) the area would be 151 MT (consistent with the lighter guns). But Exeter, Rhode Island, with its population of 6,000 (United States law states that anything smaller than 10,000 is classified as a “small” town – whereas large town have populations of 100,000’s) has a surface area of 57.71 square miles, requiring a yield of 3,735 MT (nearly 4 gigatons to vaporize). So depending on how big the town gives you different yields. And that’s taking a simplistic look at it by comparing temperatures. Specific heats enter into it so really you should figure out the energy applied over and area and scale it (which would actually make the blast larger than the 200 gigaton figure written in the ICS) according to the composition of the judicial area, which could raise the energy necessary for total vaporization of the surface area by over an order of magnitude.

Of course you could just simply be a borderline Creationist moron that assumes that each every turbolaser is built the same for the exact same purpose, whereas we know of dozens of variants designed for specific tasks (artillery, point-defence, heavy, anti-armour, bombardment etc.).

Baikal lake (the world's second most voluminous lake) has a water volume of 23,600km^3 which is 2.36*10^16kg. To vaporize 1kg of water from room temperature you would need 2.57MJ of energy pumped into the area rather quickly. Thus to vaporize the entire lake you'd need 6.10E22J. But this calculation assumes all the energy will be uniformly transferred to the water in the lake rather than being wasted on boiling the impact point beyond 100 degrees, heating the surrounding area, the atmosphere etc.

Baikal lake is 600km long,about 70km wide and 758m deep on average. So what percentage of energy will the lake receive? Let us calculate the percentage of energy lake will receive on the middle point between impact and the edge of the lake. That is the distance of 150km. At that point the surface of the hemisphere over which radiation expands will be 141,371km2. Crossectional area of the lake will be 70km width times 0.758km depth which is 53.06km2 or 106.12km2 total since shockwave will hit both sides of the lake. Thus the percentage of energy that will be received by that lake is 0.075%. Which means that in order to vaporize the lake the beam actually needs to be 8.10E25J. And that still doesn't account for the fact that even the energy that actually hits the water will not heat it up uniformly but be wasted on heating up the nearest patch of water beyond vaporization which will further increase the energy requirement.

1) You can’t see anything past the cloud because dense shrouds of pulverized debris generally don’t allow for a clear resolution of outlined imagery; either way we only see damage characteristic with the destruction of the upper portion of the bridge tower, which would once again be in line with secondary and heavy aesthetic damage. Nobody is saying that the bridge tower survived unharmed (quite the contrary, it was probably battered to an extreme severity), but what we are seeing is not characteristic of total obliteration.

2) The The Empire Strikes Back bridge tower asteroid was stopped cold, which means that the bridge tower’s superstructure was able to generate enough reaction force to deal with 100% of its momentum. Anyone who knows anything about physics knows that conservation of momentum doesn’t allow this to happen unless the bridge tower is capable of countering with momentum (otherwise the asteroid would continue to plow into the bridge itself).

The ISD’s bridge superstructure was damaged, but not destroyed by the impact. If it was completely destroyed, then why was its captain still standing seconds later recoiling from the presumably secondary effects of the impact? Just watch the scene again, a 70 meter diameter asteroid impacts the unshielded hull of the bridge tower, did you see the asteroid plunging deep into the ISD’s bridge tower, or did you see it completely pulverize on impact?

3) We see none of the bridge tower sheer away from the detonation (there would be a shit ton of metal accelerating outwards at hundreds of meters per second), we see none of it pulverize on impact and we see no sign of any kind that the bridge tower is taken apart or penetrated (which by token of conservation – would generate a far brighter blast just from the contact speed generated by metal upon metal with a massive debris cloud as a result – friction 101). Instead we see the bridge tower getting hit by a million ton (presumably nickel-iron) asteroid and as a result the impact pulverizes the asteroid as a million ton cloud.

This is just another case of you failing to understand basic conservation of momentum – again.

4) We see the Captain mere seconds after the impact, recoiling seconds after the asteroid impact itself. Nothing suggests a possible time lapse and if the bridge tower was really sheared apart as a result, the Captain would be doing far less than recoiling in horror, he would vaporized by the sudden depressurization and explosion.

5) If the bridge tower has been knocked clean off, the resultant reaction would have resulted in millions of tons of metal contacting at velocities of at least 1km/s, the sheer level of friction alone (never mind the fact that you’ve knocked off half of the electronics throughout the ship, thus exposing the surrounding environment to literal petawatts of power as a result – imagine a lightening storm in space) would have been far more visible than the pulverization of the asteroid in question, generating miniature flash fires brighter than a kiloton level explosion. The reason that we don’t see the tower in question is due to the fact that a million tons of rock have just pulverized against the hull, which has an obvious tendency to disperse violently when contacting against a metal more than seven thousand times the mechanical strength of titanium.

Kind of obvious really.

Still, considering that the ISD remained in axis without so much as a single degree of rotation (despite being impacted at her weakest axis) suggests that both the hull and the emergency thrusters altered the course with equivalent velocity of at least 1 km/s.



Maths is also your friend:

Rough Star Destroyer Bridge dimensions:

400*100*2*2=160,000
400*100*2*2=160,000
100*200*2*2=80,000

Times by two twice to represent both the canon depth of armour, and the number of sides:

160,000+160,000+80,000=400,000 M^3 of titanium
4506 KgM^-3
400,000*4506= 1,802,400,000 g
N=M/Mr=1,802,400,000/47.867
=37654333.88 Mol

Latent heat capacity(Ti)=25.06 J*Mol^-1*K^-1
Boiling point= 3,560 K
Enthalpy of fusion= 14,150 J*Mol^-1
Enthalpy of vaporisation= 425,000 J*Mol^-1

So call the temperature of the ships armour 0 Celsius (273 K):
37,654,333.88*3,287*25.06=3,101,671,074,316.8136 J

Also:
37,654,333.88*14,150=532,808,824,402 J
37,654,333.88*425,000=1,6003,091,899,000 J

Now:
22,824,569,853,970,376.251+759,923,913,961,601.939+4,423,789,386,862,625.191
=19,637,571,797,718.8136 J

TNT per gram= 4183 J

So 1.8 megatons is required to completely vaporize the bridge tower of the Star Destroyer in question, assuming a really high starting temperature for the armour of the ship and ignoring the rest of the ship’s mass. There is also the ten percent density calculation. This assumes 10% of the bridge towers volume is actually the bulkheads and armour itself and not the empty habitation compartments.

100*200*400*0.1=800,000
(800,000/400,000)*100=200% of the energy of the first calculation.
1.8*2.00=3.6 megatons

3.6 megatons required to violently detonate the Bridge Tower.

This is where problems start to arise:

A) There is no way that the construction material of the Star Destroyer bridge tower possesses a tensile strength anything similar to structural steel or titanium. Let’s take its cross-sectional area at the thickest point to be roughly 50,000 m^2. If the ship is 10% solid, this would mean there is roughly 5,5000 m^2 of metal which has to withstand a total of more than 1E18 N of force, for a resultant stress in excess of 1.8 TPa (nearly 7000 times the yield stress of structural steel). In fact, even if it were a solid block of metal, it would still have to be made out of a material which is 700 times stronger than structural steel in order to survive acceleration without permanent deformation.

B) Given nickel-iron composition (canonically referenced as being the case for the Hoth asteroid field) and roughly 7000 kg/m^3 density, this asteroid would have roughly 1.25 million tons mass, therefore its momentum would be 1.25E12 kg·m/s and its kinetic energy would be 6.25E14 J (roughly 150 kilotons).

If the tower was outright obliterated, the asteroid itself would simply be insufficient to cause the destruction itself, thus requiring internal detonations to even cause the outright destruction of the tower. Yet no only was the Captain reacting in terror moments later before his communications equipment was cut off, but we have seen a bridge tower survive a violent internal explosion from munitions damage and still remain relatively intact.

Notice the comparatively violent aftermath of an internal detonation of the Executor bridge in comparison the supposed destruction of the TESB Bridge Tower. Where were the quarter of a mile long spout of flames then?

Except all precluding events prior and after this depiction demonstrate that Stormtrooper armour is capable of surviving grenade-like detonations without cracking (penetration and scarring, but no cracking), Stormtroopers can be tossed aside by even larger and more physically veracious mammals than Ewoks into metal bulkheads and not show signs of material fatigue or distress; we even see Stormtroopers get knocked around by solid 30 lb rocks in the same scene, yet not show so much as a dent, scuff or a crack.

This is what those with the capacity for logical inference would refer to as an outlier, an event that stands within canon as an unexplainable oddity that no way contradicts every other event relative to the artifact in question. Although I wouldn’t quite say you were capable of grasping such concepts that others with functioning brain stems have mastered just yet.

- - -

Finally, EMP generating nuclear weapons in space are not some foreign uber futuristic technology, in fact they are quite common even today.

First off, the EMP you just described is High Altitude EMP (HEMP). This EMP can only be generated if there is a Terra strength magnetic field and a tenuous atmosphere present. A nuke going off in deep space will not generate HEMP. Please be aware, however, if a nuke over Iowa generates a HEMP event, the EMP will travel through the airless vacuum of space just fine and fry any spacecraft that are too close.

Secondly, EMP can also be generated in airless space by an e-Bomb, which uses chemical explosives and an armature. No magnetic field nor atmosphere required. This is called a Non-nuclear electromagnetic pulse (NNEMP). As with all EMPs, once generated they will travel through space and kill spacecraft.

Thirdly, there is System Generated EMP (SGEMP) to consider. HEMP is created when the gamma rays from the nuclear detonation produce Compton electrons in air molecules, and the electrons interact with a magnetic field to produce EMP. But with SGEMP, gamma rays penetrating the body of the spacecraft accelerated electrons, creating electromagnetic transients.

SGEMP impacts space system electronics in three ways. First, x-rays arriving at the spacecraft skin cause an accumulation of electrons there. The electron charge, which is not uniformly distributed on the skin, causes current to flow on the outside of the system. These currents can penetrate into the interior through various apertures, as well as into and through the solar cell power transmission system. Secondly, x-rays can also penetrate the skin to produce electrons on the interior walls of the various compartments. The resulting interior electron currents generate cavity electromagnetic fields that induce voltages on the associated electronics which produce spurious currents that can cause upset or burnout of these systems. Finally, x-rays can produce electrons that find their way directly into signal and power cables to cause extraneous cable currents. These currents are also propagated through the satellite wiring harness.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

Ok, I just found out about what was going on here at SB and cleared it up in the Halo vs Star Trek thread here; so what else has my little brother been up to?

*Heads off to look for this Factpile*

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

There also seems to be a genuine consensus around here that the insurmountable advantage represented by Hyperdrive travel should simply be senselessly ignored; when as anyone with even an ounce of common sense knows that the military with the fastest vessels can not only move about enemy territory at will, with no fear whatsoever of interception, but can cause more industrial, economic and civic damage, supply their navy and extend their logistical lines in a shorter period of time.

As any pilot knows, when you have a speed advantage you have the luxury of engaging the enemy only when you have the advantage, attacking and retreating at will when necessary.

Also a common misconception is the belief that hyperdrive cannot be initiated in gravity wells. This is actually untrue, although it is not at all recommended, it is possible to initiate a hyperjump in the gravity well of a planet. The Millenium Falcon actually went to hyperspace inside the atmosphere of a planet to escape Byss in the split-second before the planetary energy shield closed on them (Dark Empire), whilst Anakin's Charger c70 retrofit made a hyperspace jump from within Quell's upper atmosphere from within meters of their Venator's hangar. And whilst nowhere near as accurate as some FTL propulsion systems, Imperial and Republic warships have been seen performing close range tactical jumps within close proximity of other stellar vehicles. The Star Destroyer Emancipator leaped within less than a kilometer of the target Super Star Destroyer during the battle of Mon Calamari, Anakin performed a pinpoint jump with a Jedi ambassadorial shuttle within less than a few meters of a Recusant-class light destroyer during the first battle of Saleucami, whilst the crew of a Munificent-class star frigate performed a close range tactical leap several hundred meters directly above Yoda's transport during the mission to Rugosa.

There are also several noticeable feats in terms of speed from the films themselves.

The Phantom Menace: Darth Maul leaves Coruscant after sunset on Tatooine and arrives before dawn that same night. Based on the fact that Tatooine has a rotational period of 23 hours and orbits two stars, the twilight period between dusk and dawn could last up to anywhere between 9 to 11 hours.

With the Corellian run covering an area of up to 40,000 light years from Tatooine to Coruscant (plus 10,000 light years to cover the distance from the core), Darth Maul's Scimitar would have to exceed speeds of 30,000,000 to 50,000,000 times the speed of light on a comparatively measly class 3.0 engine; this does not even begin to cover the time it would take for him to navigate away from the hyperspace lane, land on Tatooine and deploy probe droids before intercepting and dueling Qui-Gon; and also assumes that he took no effort to gather any supplies or equipment before departing.
Consider these facts:
1) In Anakin Skywalker's home, while eating lunch, Qui-Gon Jinn and company discuss the Boonta Eve race, scheduled to take place the next day.
2) Back on Coruscant, Sidious dispatches Maul to go to Tatooine and track down the queen.
3) On tatooine, Qui-Gon and Anakin put in a full day of fixing his pod. In the evening, QGJ takes a blood sample from Anakin. It is clear in this scene that the night is well along.
4) At Dawn, Darth Maul's interceptor arrives on Tatooine, before the Boonta Eve race.

Attack of the Clones: Yoda travels to Kamino and then to Geonosis and arrives not long after the other Jedi who went directly to Geonosis, with an army of 200,000 Clones and a fleet of warships no less.

Therefore Yoda would first have to travel 30-40,000 light years to reach Kamino after Obi-Wan's transmission to the council (Geonosis night), then a further 5-10,000 light years to Geonosis with a 200,000 strong Clone trooper army in tow the following day. Even disregarding the time it would take to muster an army of that size into a state of combat readiness and get them on their ships, we’re still looking at hyperspace travel times measured in tens of millions of times the speed of light.

Revenge of the Sith: The Open Circle fleet travelled from the outer rim planet Tythe to Coruscant before the Separatist fleet had a chance to escape. Average distance from Coruscant to outer rim on a galactic scale is 20-30,000 light years, whilst the distance between Tythe and Coruscant is actually within the 35-40,000 light year scale.

Palpatine travels from Coruscant to Mustafar during the duel between Darth Vader and Ob-Wan, arriving just as Obi-Wan was leaving. Assuming that he used the hydian way hyperspace route, Palpatine would have to cover just over 50,000 light years (plus 10,000 light years to leave the core) to reach the mortally wounded Vader and render medical assistance before one of the many life threatening injuries (full body fourth degree burns, severed limbs etc.) he sustained during the duel claimed his life.

We know that Obi-Wan knows even as Anakin is burning that Palpatine has arrived (novelization). Obviously, Anakin could not have been sitting on the lava river bank for hours in any event, as he would've surely died without medical attention which Palpatine was there to provide. In the movie we see Palpatine's shuttle going in for landing after Obi-Wan takes Padme's skiff away.

At most, there can and should be a several minute lapse in between the two gantry in lava river scenes, providing for the amount of time it took the gantry to reach the lava fall, as well as the time it would take for Palpatine to reach his ship and depart.

Speed? Aw heck, let's make it an even hour, even though that's way too unreasonably high (Obi-Wan and Anakin were most assuredly not fighting on the floating gantry for an hour!).

500,000,000 times the speed of light for Palpatine's trip.

A New Hope: The Death Star arrives at Yavin the same day as Obi-Wan's death, requiring the tracking device planted on the Falcon to first locate the Rebel base; a journey of just under 30,000 light years (not bad for a 160km diameter slug with a class 3.0 engine).

Empire Strikes Back: "They could be on the other side of the galaxy by now." - Piett

A line that would most likely be mere hyperbole expressed by a haggard and somewhat fearful Imperial officer (who has to answer to Lord Vader of all people), but it certainly suggests the impending severity of allowing a sufficiently small period of time for a hyperdrive equipped vessel to flee from Imperial forces and cover enough to distance to render search efforts nearly useless.

Return of the Jedi: The Rebel fleet gathered from around the galaxy travels from their rally point at Sullust to Endor in the short time it takes the group to walk around to the Imperial base's back door (depending on how you view the time dilation of linear editing); a journey that would require them to cover over 20,000 light years.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

halo wins star wars sucks end of story

 

Star Wars wins halo sucks end of story

 

HAHAHAHA,DON'T MAKE ME LAUGH!
seriously,they won't.
neither the Covenant and neither the UNSC or the Flood could do that.
Maybe the Forerunner,they were a very advance civilization.But they've got
extinct.
but they are in the past,so technically "a long time ago".
imagining a war between the Empire and the Forerunner,i say it would be far
more devastating for the Forerunner that they'll war with Flood.
Most people tend to pit Forerunner against a less powerful civilization in Star Wars, but against the Empire ,they wouldn't stand a chance.End of story.

 

I don't know about the flood thing. Parasites are deadly and quite different than actually dealing with other humans or aliens. It's something internal you must deal with as the put your own forces against you at a massive scale. The Flood is Hell, and you have to exercise the Force and only the Force against the flames of fire, for even the great Forerunners (the gods) could not counter the flood with AI and AI * 10. It's terrible. The Dark SIde must be used.

 

If you read the book First Strike, then the Covenant would stand a chance against the empire. They have those ships that can "glass" a planet. They could just glass all of the planets that the empire control. So, technically, the Covenant would win.

 

The Covenant also have the Halo system, which could just annihilate all life in the universe. So I think I made my point when I said that Halo rules and Star Wars sucks.

Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

 

Flood could infect dead Stormtroopers so they would stand a slim chance but still stand a chance.

 

The Force would prevent a Flood incursion. A single spore could knock out an entire species but one Dark Lord of the Sith could stop a fleet of ships and as long as the battle is out in space (and not localized to a particular planet), I think the SW characters would own, but you can't underestimate one single flood spore.

 

The flood aren't spores they are parasites the size of a house cat and they travel in swarms of 5-100 of them at one time. Their "leader", if you will, is a Gravemind which could bring down any ship smaller than a star destroyer. Plus, once the flood infects someone, that person has full function of the weapon they were holding when they died, if they were holding one.

Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

 

If the Flood were to get onto a ship they could infect the entire crew in the ship so they,tecnically, could fight in space if they stay on the ship.

 

Yah but than again, it would kill everything in the covenant universe, not the star wars universe.

Sure you would kill 90% of the invasion fleet. But than what? You wont even have single celled bacteria to fight in your war.

 

Not if the crew were wearing real battle armor....

Besides the fact that its somewhat dificult to infect a battledroid, but lemme know how that turns out mkay?

 

The problem is that a little bb gun could kill a flood parasite. (which begs the question of how the covenant was dumb enough to let a single parasite cause this chain reaction in the first place).

Second, a stormtrooper has a full auto laser rifle. In a small corridor youd have your parasites running down the hall maybe wide enough for five of em, 10 stormtroopers could shoot down that hall indefinitely and all the parasite would be annihalated.

 

skull, glassing a planet is nothing to brag about.

Any ship with a low level laser could do it. Or low level plasma like the covenant.

Now if you want some serious destructive power than go no further than star trek, glassing a planet in seconds is so everyday to that level of weaponry it might as well be a joke.

Star trek has anti proton beams, that is literally the most powerful beam weapon you can have. End of story.

 

hey skullkid starwars would win because think about it all your ships what good will they do against a superstar destroyer and the rest of the star destroyers

 

your invincible fleet skullkid wouldn't do shit to a fleet of star destroyers and a superstar destroyer with that malandorian beskar armor, which is hard for lightsabers to penetrate was on at least one of them

 

The Flood can walk on walls and ceilings and their tentacles can pierce armor. Not to mention that they travel in groups of hundreds to thousands of them at once. Also that if a single Flood infected a Stormtrooper, the infected soldier would have full capabilities of the weapon they were holding when they died, if they were holding one. So that covers my point, jackass.