GOP Tax Bill

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Kittamaru, Dec 2, 2017.

  1. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

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    13,803
    Whee, while this debate rages, the GOP has moved one step closer to blowing a hole in our nation's finances the size of Texas to give their corporate owners even larger paydays

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-42205181

    Kiss your insurance goodbye - no doubt costs will skyrocket once people who don't think they need it ding doing ditch, leaving the sick and elderly to fend for themselves.

    No doubt that, as the debt rapidly increases, we will see social welfare programs head to the guillotine.

    I wonder how much longer it will be before they start curtailing the freedoms and rights of groups they dislike...

    I think I need to seriously consider a change in venue... Perhaps Iceland...
     
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  3. birch Valued Senior Member

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    this is telling. the core of conservative voters are based on the 'made in america' ideal, bringing jobs back to america. this is because the vast majority of the working poor to middle-class that are less educated benefit from factory and unionized labor which pay well, especially industry such as automakers.

    how does this benefit americans? does cutting corporate tax create more jobs?
     
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  5. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

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    That's their claim - that this will create more jobs, more economic growth, and result in higher wages for all...

    Historically, all its done is send even more money to the highest corporate earners, and often off-shore accounts.
     
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  7. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

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    Overall, the legislation would cut the corporate tax rate from 35 to 20 percent, which all along has been the GOP’s priority all along. Republicans say this dramatic reduction will unleash the economy and raise wages by making big businesses more internationally competitive ― claims that are dubious according to corporate executives themselves, who say they will throw the money at shareholders instead of workers.

    In addition to reducing corporate and individual tax rates across the board, the bill would simplify the tax code by getting rid of most deductions, which businesses and individuals use to reduce the amount of their income subject to taxation.


    Because Congress over the years has added write-offs in order to encourage and subsidize certain endeavors ― such as homeownership and higher education ― the mass elimination of these tax preferences could have wide-ranging effects that are incidental to the overall Republican goal of encouraging business investment.


    https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/senate-passes-tax-bill_us_5a21da79e4b0a02abe91412e

    Yay? Are we great yet...? Even corporate executives are saying they won't pass their savings to their workers.
     
  8. birch Valued Senior Member

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    5,077
    that's what i thought, so why do the majority of the conservatives vote like this? mind you, they are not all uneducated so that is not always the reason and those who do vote aren't all rich or well off either. conservatives are some of the most conniving and craftiest people.

    it seems the only reason for their voting choices must be just based on some sort of rallying around racism and some type of tradition. is there any other reason? i don't see it.

    and also, true to stereotype, on other conservative sites, they are backing moore, without a concern to his ethics or demonizing his accusers.

    i truly do not understand a mindframe where these people have children and they do not care. i guess just putting on appearances and tradition is more important to them. or they assume haughtily those who live 'right' won't be in any situation to be victims. or might is right and they are part of the might, so they don't think their children will or can be victims. especially if it's conservatives who would be the perpetrators most of the time, they would pick a liberal first? is that why? their own won't be picking on their own?
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2017
  9. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

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    I dunno birch. It makes no sense to me... I work with three people that support these snakes - they all think that Obama was practically the anti-Christ and that everything he did was terrible, even the things they personally benefitted from. I can't wrap my mind around it - to actively work against your own best interests, and those of your neighbors, it makes no logical sense. Then again, that might be my problem - I'm trying to look at illogical people logically.
     
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  10. Bells Staff Member

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    22,669
    Why are you changing the subject, yet again?

    Why don't you put it into a new thread for the GOP tax bill?
     
  11. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

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    13,803
    I guess the bigger question in all of this (given that the GOP has total control of the government right now) is... are these the kinds of people we can trust to make fair and even laws to protect victims?

    For example:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/news/comments/7h18kr/us_senate_passes_sweeping_tax_overhaul_bill/


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    If I were to submit an application for, say, a passport, and I crossed out entire pages and wrote items in the margins, it would, no doubt, be rejected.

    Of course, then there's the fact that some of the hand-written stuff is damn near illegible...
    https://twitter.com/SenatorTester/status/936748480000921600?s=09

    Oh, and the fact that, when Democrats asked for more time to be able to actually read the final copy that was being voted on... they were told to pound sand.

    I dunno about the rest of you, but I don't think we can trust these assholes to make good calls when it comes to protecting people from sexual assault...

    Why is all this important?

    Simple:
    http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/20/politics/white-house-reversal-roy-moore-alabama-senate/index.html

    and
    The GOP is not only willing, but happy, to put such dangerously predatory people in positions of power if it furthers their agenda. Given that we know that a large portion of voters are willing to go along with such bullshit... how is anyone expected to resist? Take the high road? How - I think we've seen the effect of Democrats "taking the high road" and trying to "compromise" for the last eight years... it resulted in very little getting done to an acceptable level.

    Simply put, it's a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario. If they "take the high road" and hold to "moral obligations" and "good standards", Dems will continue to lose to folks who have no moral compass and are willing to use ever dirty trick in the book to win. If they don't, and use underhanded or morally questionable tactics to try and win, they will still lose because, as 2016 showed, enough Democratic voters are unwilling to compromise their morals to support such a group.

    Either way, Republicans win, and Citizens lose... and that means an even longer wait for anything to be done about the rampant sexual harassment crisis facing this country.

    This... seems oddly appropriate here.
     
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  12. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

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    13,803
    A few other provisions in this "tax" bill:

    https://twitter.com/TitusNation/status/936736961145876485
    Hm... seems that John Steinbeck had it right...

    And the great owners, who must lose their land in an upheaval, the great owners with access to history, with eyes to read history and to know the great fact: when property accumulates in too few hands it is taken away. And that companion fact: when a majority of the people are hungry and cold they will take by force what they need. And the little screaming fact that sounds through all history: repression works only to strengthen and knit the repressed. The great owners ignored the three cries of history. The land fell into fewer hands, the number of the dispossessed increased, and every effort of the great owners was directed at repression. The money was spent for arms, for gas to protect the great holdings, and spies were sent to catch the murmuring of revolt so that it might be stamped out. The changing economy was ignored, plans for the change ignored; and only means to destroy revolt were considered, while the causes of revolt went on.
     
  13. Bells Staff Member

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    22,669
    Mod Note

    The GOP tax bill.. Posts moved for being off topic into a thread dedicated to the Tax Bill.
     
  14. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    22,882
    It's a middle class screw job, pure and simple. Republicans are paying off their donors.
     
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  15. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    26,561
    Like the blogger said, it's not a tax bill - it's a bust-out.
    A bust-out of the US economy.
    https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/24/bain-capital-tony-soprano_n_1542249.html

    Interestingly enough, the AIG bankruptcy in the middle of the 2007 crash in the US may have been a bust-out:
    https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2008/11/aig-looting-continues.html
    http://skepticaltexascpa.blogspot.com/2008/11/bust-outs-and-paulson-mob.html
    That would make it an example, a preliminary run of what's coming.




    Note: War can play the role of the arson in the Goodfellas clip.
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2017
  16. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    18,477
    So are there any conservatives left on this forum to counter with how this will be the greatest tax cut ever and how it stimulate growth and pay for its self and how the money trickle down from the rich to the poor, etc, etc and other excretions of semen from their mouths?
     
  17. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    13,953
    Because their leaders lie to them, and they believe them. The alternative would be to admit they were wrong, and many people are incapable of that.
     
  18. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    18,477
    Well yeah lots of them, but also lots of the others a like "well as long as they are against baby killing I will vote for them no matter what"

    I miss Billy T.
     
  19. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    26,561
  20. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    26,561
    The new and slightly more complicated rules for business income deductions provide major tax savings to the 13 members of the House committee that wrote the bill, and even larger ones for Trump and his family:
    From a blog that has been reliable in these matters:
    http://yastreblyansky.blogspot.com/2017/12/just-passing-through.html#more
    The blog suggests, with evidence, that some of this extra benefit was written in to get the lone outstanding Republican Senate vote: Bob Corker's.

    If it works, every Republican Senator will vote for this abomination. Every single one.

    Donald Trump is not the problem.

    EDITED to fix LaTeX formatting issue - Kittamaru
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2017
  21. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    13,953
    Good graphic of this from CEPR:

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  22. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    For the love of god! Please you bastard if you are up there, when the revolution comes make sure Bob Corker is put up against the wall HARD, castrated and skinned alive, and only after much begging for the sweet release of death is he shot.
     
  23. Kittamaru Never cruel nor cowardly... Staff Member

    Messages:
    13,803
    Seems like the tax bill is a sure thing now - Collins is going "yes" on the promise that McConnell will hold true to the three things he promised her (though they won't come to pass until later... betcha she gets burned) and Corker is a yes based on the above...

    wheee we're all fucked
     

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