Good/bad SciFi concepts: Star Gate vs Star Trek

Discussion in 'SciFi & Fantasy' started by Dinosaur, May 15, 2014.

  1. Janus58 Valued Senior Member

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    What you have to realize about the transporter was that it a was, in a way, a "necessary evil" at the time the show was produced. They needed a way to get their protagonists to and fro from ship and planet, and didn't have the budget(at first) for making and filming a shuttle craft. (The shuttle craft wasn't introduced until its existence was integral to the plot of the episode.). As a plot device for getting to the meat of the story quickly it was perfect. One drawback in story terms was that now they had to keep coming up with reasons why our heroes couldn't just thumb their noses and beam back up to the ship every time they got in trouble.
     
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  3. Sarkus Hippomonstrosesquippedalo phobe Valued Senior Member

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    And of course it glosses over the whole philosophical question of whether or not, every time you got "transported" you actually died and a mere copy was created at the other end. Brings the whole "what are you?" question to the fore, which was rarely, if ever, touched on.
     
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  5. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    I think it was touched on all the time. There was one character (the doctor) who frequently and vociferously objected to using it for that very reason.
     
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  7. Sarkus Hippomonstrosesquippedalo phobe Valued Senior Member

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    He didn't like having his "molecules scrambled" (I think that's the term he tended to use), but the actual notion of the transporter possibly killing people and cloning them at the other end was rarely touched on.
    The cloning nature was touched on in episodes where duplicates were produced (the episode in OS where you get a Good Kirk and an Evil Kirk etc... and the episode in TNG where Ryker gets a duplicate when the transported beam rebounds when trying to beam out of a planet)... but the notion that it kills people each time? Don't recall any mention.
     
  8. youreyes amorphous ocean Valued Senior Member

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    Star Trek teleportation is based on quantum entanglement principles.

    Also the current work on directed ionization of air to project 3D images by Japanese scientist, is the dinosaur age of directed energy transfer, which will ultimately be utilized in teleportation devices.
     
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  9. krash661 [MK6] transitioning scifi to reality Valued Senior Member

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    katherine pulaski.
    tng,season two.
     
  10. Dinosaur Rational Skeptic Valued Senior Member

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    A remark from some historical person which turns out to be invalid does not provide proof for any statement, speculation, whatever.

    So Lord Kelvin thought manned flight was impossible & he was wrong. That does not imply that FTL travel or the Star Trek transporter will be possible.

    BTW: Data, not matter, has been teleported. Furthermore, the data transported is meager. This technology cannot be used for teleporting matter.

    Good SciFi has some consistency & plausibility. Bad SciFi does not. The Star Trek Transporter is bad Scifi because there is no equipment at the destination.

    As I said in a previous Post
    The Star Gate has a zilch probability of being invented, but is plausible Scifi.

    Note that the telportation of matter ala a StarGate-like technology would require an enormous amount of energy. In Physics there are no free lunches.
     
  11. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    So... the basic premise is that fictional technology is unrealistic?
     
  12. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Certainly he was wrong...and he said what he said only a decade before the first flight.
    Also it certainly does not imply that FTL is impossible. [or a reasonable facsimile thereof via spacetime manipulation]

    A journey of a thousand miles starts with a single foot step.
    Confucious:
    The Universe may have been the ultimate free lunch!
    https://www.astrosociety.org/publications/a-universe-from-nothing/
     
  13. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    Try walking across the Pacific Ocean...

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    I think the theory of relativity implies that FTL is impossible, doesn't it?
     
  14. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Yes most certainly.....I'm referring to the possibility, difficult in the extreme, but allowed by the laws of physics and GR, the manipulation of spacetime to create a perception of FTL travel, when in actual fact, it is a bubble of spacetime, moving through another larger bubble of spacetime, and taking the lucky ship for a FTL journey.
     
  15. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    The Alcubierre drive is an example....difficult, totally unknown at this stage, and prodigious amounts of energy required, but who knows?
     
  16. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    Well don't have anything better to work with currently, at least not until the next big paradigm shift in both technological capability and new scientific theories leading to a deeper understanding of physics.

    The trouble with paradigm shifts is that both the nature of the shift and their timing is less accurate to predict than a Magic 8-Ball.
     
  17. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    The thing is Daecon, we have more then one orginisation already working on the theoretical concepts necessary for realistic stellar travel within reasonable time frames.
    And these are reputable companies run by respectable reputable people...

    https://space-academy.grc.nasa.gov/y2011/tour-summaries/jet-propulsion-laboratory/

    http://100yss.org/mission/team
    Mae Carol Jemison (born October 17, 1956) is an American physician and NASAastronaut

    http://www.tauzero.aero/
    Marc G. Millis:
    AST / Propulsion Physics
    NASA John H. Glenn Research Center


    Nothing may come out of any of this. That's quite possible. But a pessimist has never lead the way, or discovered some previously unforseen scenario...That's always left to the more optimistic amongst us.
    Like I said, the people at these companies are not fools.
    enjoy the links!

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  18. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    Well Star Trek did predict the iPad, the mobile phone, and I'm sure a few other things too.

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  19. kmguru Staff Member

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    FTL...It is not possible via standard method of travel. But just like anything else in Life...if you take an object and pull in energy from the space itself (you may call vacuum energy or something like that), then you can go by light speed...at least that is how UFOs move.

    How can you do that? Using some short of EMF configuration, you have to create a force from the collected energy...you can not use internal energy to travel at the light speed. The catch is, while you are in transit, in a kind of hyper space scenario, the time stays the same on the ship. So, may be you could move at FTL to you. But I am not sure if the travel time at your home planet will change while you moved a light year and stopped there verses 10 light years.
     
  20. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    I'm not sure I fully understand.

    UFOs use vacuum energy as the basis for their faster than light travel?

    Which Sci-Fi series is that from?
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2015
  21. youreyes amorphous ocean Valued Senior Member

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    quantum computers are the key to this.
     
  22. kmguru Staff Member

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    Any Sic-Fi series that has items moving at very high velocity to reach four light years quickly...and not what we have...that is the only way...ask any UFO people....

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