God and defining perfection

Discussion in 'The Cesspool' started by Tnerb, Mar 11, 2009.

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  1. Tnerb Banned Banned

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    Nice. I'll probably comment soon.
     
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  3. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

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    This is how it usually is in conditioned life, yes.


    Mind you, I don't think that nature is imperfect per se, or that God is imperfect or that God's perfection cannot be unambiguously defined.
     
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  5. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

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    Many humans are like that. Not necessarily when it comes to eating chocolate in great amounts at once, but in many things.
    'Doing the same thing over and over again, while expecting a different result' - that is a popular definition of insanity.
    For example, to keep within the phenomenal range of food intake: A person, when tired, may drink coffee; it gives her a quick buzz, followed by a low and tiredness worse than the one she had before. Obviously, the coffe didn't really help against the tiredness.
    Yet millions of people behave like that every day.
     
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  7. Tnerb Banned Banned

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    To be quite honest, I had started this thread with the intent that it is only a discussion of perfection, not god and perfection (the title was later changed to God and perfection as, for some reason, as the thread progressed the only thing which occured is references to God, which were not mentioned by the opening post....).

    But without doubt God is required to be discussed if we intend or plan to start some sort of discussion of perfection from a scale of higher sorts. Clearly perfection by itself is not perfection without considering the implications?

    What do I mean by this? Perfection is...... perfection as I have defined it is a state of imperfection. Take a writing. Is there a bit of writing which is perfect. Is there a smile which is perfect. Is there a book which is perfect. Is there a glove which is perfect. Is there a color which is perfect. Is there a love which is perfect. Is there a picture of tea that is perfect. Is there a wine that is perfect. A video game that is perfect?

    Surely something is perfect and my opinion is that perfection must be so that it is subject to the qualities and qualities mostly alone of the person or individual who is experiencing said perfection.....

    If this is the case, which I believe it is, then perfection is simply something a person holds as a belief, a belief in what is right or wrong, a belief in that which is good or bad, or simply an effort to present. If such is the case which it is by all means then perfection cannot possibly be the most superior of gifts, but the weakest of gifts IMO...
     
  8. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

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    It's a matter of clear definitions:

    'Superman has the ability to fly anytime except when exposed to kryptonite.'
    'Superman is invulnerable to everything except kryptonite.'
    'Superman never breaks the laws except when breaking the law is more moral than not breaking it.'

    We are not talking about the ability to fly no matter what, but about Superman's ability to fly.
    We are not talking about invulnerability as such, but about Superman's invulnerability.
    We are not talking about always adhering to the law as such, but about Superman's way of adhering to the law.


    Here is another definition:
    'God is the one who is the most rich, most powerful, most famous, most strong, most charitable and most renounced of all beings.'
     
  9. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    THAT is WHAT I'm trying to get thru to people.
     
  10. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    {NUMEROUS questions not answered. NUMEROUS points ignored. NUMEROUS fallacies pointed out but ducked under. NUMEROUS assumptions & circular arguing>}




    Is this your idea of a joke???
     
  11. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    I believe I'd be much more renounced than any god if enough people knew enough about me.
     
  12. Sarkus Hippomonstrosesquippedalo phobe Valued Senior Member

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    Not at all... you just need to demonstrate how one can claim absolute knowledge of something/anything without being an authority on it, even if it is just one tiny bit of knowledge.

    Man is reliant on interpretation. Man must therefore interpret that they are the authority on what knowledge God has supposedly passed to them - i.e. they must interpret that God has made them an authority on whatever knowledge he has bestowed upon them.
    But all Man can do is interpret that that is the case.

    And so he is trapped, according to your concept, with mere interpretation as bedfellow, UNLESS God delegates some authority to Man and allows him to be the authority on it as well.

    But, shock, this isn't part of your concept.
    But then your concept is already changing... so I guess it'll change again - although you probably won't realise that it is, and you'll argue that it isn't.
    But that's just a guess.

    And even then you are still left with explaining the process by which God delegates His authority (even for the smallest jot of knowledge) that differentiates it within the mind of Man from being merely confidence.


    Can you do that as well?
     
  13. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    tnerb,

    I think that the concept of God represent "perfection" period.
    The thing is some people cannot bring themselves to consider it, because their worldview simply won't allow them to. I can understand them knocking religion, and theism in general, but to have that same mentality with regard to the concept, seems quite dogmatic, a kind of superstion.

    I know what you mean.
    We get flashes of perfection, even from something which is flawed.
    Maybe perfection is a clear, unadulterated understanding, a realisation, a moment of truth. In that frame of mind it may be possible to see something
    as it really is.

    Which makes it hard to convey to another what perfection actually is, unless they themselves have had similar experiences.

    I think belief is how it starts, but experience, realisation, and understanding, is the necessary ingredient.
    I teach people how to play the drum kit, and my motto to them is, practice makes perfect. I also make it clear to them that, although they must strive to become perfect players, they may never reach perfection, but they will become excellent on the way.

    Or maybe it's not a gift, but a state of being.
    It's probably the true/real normal, everything else being abnormal.

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    jan.
     
  14. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    This should be locked and/or Cesspooled.
     
  15. glaucon tending tangentially Registered Senior Member

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    Yes. At this point, I have to agree..
     
  16. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    What a strange decision.
    Did you actually check strangers contribution to the thread, out?
    Oh well.

    jan.
     
  17. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

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    Apparently, Glaucon expemplified what a 'strong mind' is.
    And what a heavy censor's hand is.
     
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