If you say so. We'll just call those two dogs something else. We'll just call that primate sexual activity something else. Right? Right? Though I'm well sympathetic to the idea that I'm the only person in the world who has heard of homosexual behavior among animals, I know I'm not. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/A...57542/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_6_1/102-4010116-8737701 You know, I've seen it in nature. I've seen it in a classroom. And now I'm showing you a book review on the very same idea, so I know this isn't some hallucination of mine. Which leads to a question: If it's not natural, how does it exist in nature? Humans seek sexual gratification for reasons other than reproduction. If the nonviability of homosexual reproduction is the issue which makes it unnatural, and if we consider that issue in terms of adoption per the topic post, then we might say that people should be denied the right to raise children if the heterosexual couple has casual (nonreproductive) sex. When we put the waste of masturbation on that list, there are suddenly very few people who are "qualified" to raise children. Quite frankly, and based upon the sampling of my life's experiences, I don't think someone that repressed should be raising anything. I'm aware of that. It's also the dumbest thing I've ever heard, even the first time I heard it in Catholic school where such silliness was considered a Very Important Point. We might, then, point out that the reason for this may be because a male should never have sexual relations with an equal. A male should, apparently, only have sex with something established as inferior. You know, kind of a woman's payback for the rib? Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Since you've ventured your opinion and chosen to withhold this information, I'll bite. I'm curious why you didn't find that information important enough to give, anyway. It helps us understand why you hold the opinions you choose to voice. thanx, Tiassa Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
In having such passionate faith. Let me ask a question: do you know what the essence of Christianity is?Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Hi Tiassa! well the reason why I held back that piece of info, is just for the sake of retained suspense. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Before you read it I warn you, what ever it is that you are about to read is spiritually based, and is my personal choice of spirituality. Ok then, here it goes... I believe in one God, and that is the God in the Bible. I believe in the God who created the world in 7 days. I believe in the God that has sent His son to save you and I from the penalties of our sin. I believe that we are all sinners, no one in this world is perfect without fault. No one in this world is worthy enough to enter the Kingdom of God; Heaven. Thus, we need the love and grace of this God to help us through. Many of us, choose to ignore this issue but we have to realize that one day we will die. None of use are gonna live forever, which is something I know you know already. So, the issue of death has surely come across your mind at least twice in the course of your whole life. I believe that this God will protect me always, I believe that this God is the key to my happinnes. I believe that this God loves me so much, that he even sacrifised his one and only son for me. Hece, in every aspect of my life, I always consider him. I try my best to obey His commands, because I want to please Him. He loves me, and in return I want to give back a little of what He has done for me. The Bible states that homosexuality is a sin. Do you know the story of Sodom and Gommorrah? It mentions in that story that homosexuality was a growing practise in Sodom and Gommorrah, God hated it, he was angered and eventually He destroyed the place. This way, I know for sure that God disagrees with homosexuality. As a devoted Christian I live according to His way. Thus, explains my point of view on homosexuality. Why do I believe in this one God with such passion? BEcause I have felt his prsence in my life so evidently. In everything that I do, in everything that I am about to do, I feel that He is always there to guide me. I know He's there. YOu might think that this all sounds very cliched, coz to me you sound like a very logic-based thinker, but there's more to life than life itself. Somewhere out there there's a greater being that has made all things possible. There is another level in life, than just the reality of the world. There is not just the physical but also the spiritual. Ok then, that's it for now. I look fwd to your reply. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
You think to know Christianity? -Ha! Salient, (this also applies to some others, they know) You cannot start to imagine how incredibly short-sighted I think your ideas are. I condemn these ideas of you. And I know to have Right on my side and I speak the truth. The strange thing is, that I base this condemnation, if you will, on the same book as you base your ideas on. I will pray to God asking for you to get some insight. For it is the hatred that you are proud to show off, that is the root of evil and the voice of the Satan on Earth. The tricky thing is that this evil voice has disguised itself as the voice of God. Causing many a non-believer to think that the filth that comes out of your mouth is what Christianity is all about. Go and feel ashamed for staining the Bible! If you ever wonder why so many people are angry with God, Christ, and the Bible - You made them angry. It is your doing! Well. ok I know this posts will only piss you off. and you are not going to change. But don't say I didn't warn you! P.S. You may consider reading another translation of the Bible. Since yours obviously made an error in the Sodom and Gomorra episode.
Filmed at 11:00Pm news flash... Tipical, it never quite ends, the argument between two fellow believers, who's got it right?, It's been happening for thousands of years, and now in modern times it's still happening!. Can't theist get their "crappy" religions together?.
Salient ..., Salient Thank you very much for the reply. On the one hand, it appears you've given the issue much consideration. To the other, I hope to present a couple of perspectives that may have not have come up. It is important to me to ask here why you believe in God. You seem to explore that idea in a couple of aspects, but by and large what I'm after is how you came to accept that faith. The Bible speaks of homosexuality in two primary bodies: Hebrew laws pertaining to a good stretch spent wandering the desert, and the Pauline evangelization of which many of his assertions are definitively contemporary opinions of Christ, and not factual. In the case of homosexuality, for instance, Paul is instructing Christians in a subject ignored by Jesus. There is much debate, I suppose, to be had regarding whether or not that lack of attention is deliberate, and how it relates to Jesus' perspective on Hebrew Law. What of those parts of the Law he didn't address? In the modern, political fight, then, we see a reliance among Christian homophobes on Hebrew Law and Pauline evangelism while those inclined to the liberty of all people would point out a lack of any specific prohibition from Jesus' mouth and extrapolate on compassion. How one comes to faith is vital in determining the relationship between faith and the living experience. For instance, a lifetime Christian, taught in the cradle, may indeed overlook perspectives due to the inherent prejudices of the religious system. A recent born-again might tend toward self-centered issues, the idea of "What Jesus has done for me." To the former, I always hope to offer alternative perspectives. To the latter, I do generally accuse a sense of greed in which one's salvation is the central motivator of faith. There are, of course, myriad degrees of faith, but the generalizations should at least justify why I ask. What I find interesting in this aspect about the tale is that one can throw one's own daughters out to be gang-raped, and at least it isn't as bad as homosexuality. Sodom and Gommorrah is an interesting tale, indeed. Of Hebrew Law, though, consider those laws written around the period in the desert: Homosexuality, tattoos, bowel movements, self-mutilation in mourning--do we see any common trends here? All of these things lead to danger for a limited group of people functioning in those circumstances. Reproduction is key, sanitation is vital. Prohibitions against homosexuality relate to the spread of disease, just as prohibitions against casual heterosexual intercourse are designed. (Note: one need not be a genetecist to document that incestuous offspring often have birth defects; since style wasn't as important in the sense of How desperate do you look? it's fair to wonder if prohibitions against incest weren't Spencerist recognitions of the perpetuity of the human species. Do you cut your temple locks? It seems to me that you believe He's there, not know He's there. Presently, I'm reading a faith statement. How do you know it is His presence? I asked my mother once if she was happy. She said yes. I knew this was BS, so I countered with the question, "Have you actually found happiness, or have you found something and called it happiness?" Of faith and knowledge, I ask the same: Have you found knowledge, or have you found faith and called it knowledge? Those "all things" also include homosexuality, whether in humans, canines, primates, or otherwise. It's part of nature, and is therefore natural. Masturbation isn't unnatural just because it doesn't procreate. In fact, there are parts of the world where procreation is a bad thing due to resources (e.g--Africa). I agree. Where we probably differ is that in light of such a fact, I wonder why we would wish to limit our potential within that reality to the finite product of a single-volume anthology. For two-thousand years, people have reformulated Christian faith with no sterling result; the outcome is a world that is ready to pass Christian values by. It's not that the values are bad, but that they're baseless and unyielding. I understand that your faith compels you to this opinion, but I also see that faith and its result as divisive and detrimental. Christian harmony can be a presence in the world; it simply requires better tolerance. Understandably, this is God's command, according to the faith, but Western Christians don't seem that inclined to adhere to those points: God says Thou shall not suffer a witch to live. Barbaric Christians in the past used this and other Biblical justifications for murder. Why not now? Just like the homosexual prohibitions, this is what God commands. Point being: we know this is a bad idea, to be killing people in a free society for religious disagreements. But that doesn't change the Bible. We see that people have adopted civil tolerance before; what, just because the law doesn't force one to respect someone, they might as well go forth condemning? I just don't understand it philosophically. It seems an arbitrary faith point designed to reinforce existing prejudices. And that, sir, is why I object. thanx, Tiassa Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
merlijn... You seem to agree with homosexuality despite your claim of being a fellow believer. However, it would be of much help if you would tell me, which aspect of Christianity has made homosexuality a rightful practise? Is that not the same justifying other sinful doings such as stealing and killing?Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Tiassa... Hello again, Tiassa! It's great to see that you have been reading my replies and thinking them through, as I have yours. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Hmmm, this is a tough one. Why do I believe in the God that I believe in... It's crucial to understand that Christianity requires a lot of faith and most of the time it's a matter of God, touching your life. I have experienced a lot of hard trials and tribulations and I'm sure that you have too, possibly even worse than I have. However, during these times, my parents and friends have continually advised me to pray to this God in the bible. I did, and I opened my heart, and it is amazing how much it made a difference. I don't know how to describe it to you, but it's a feeling of peace. A sense of comfort, knowing that I'm not in control of my own life, and I don't have to control it because my life is in His hands, and I know with much faith that he will never let me fall; only stumble. Thus, I believe and you're right, I know that God is with me always. The faith itself is a result of God's grace. God planted this faith in my heart and I try my best to make it grow. You may not understand, where I'm coming from, because my experience is personal, and it is not until you've experienced it yourself will you understand too. But, one day in your life, God will find you and he too will touch your life. The only thing you have to do is to open your heart and humble yourself. Admit, that God is greater than us mere humans. If it makes you feel better, take comfort in knowing that no one has the ability to fully comprehend God's ways, not even me, because God works in mysterious ways. But I have enough faith to know that his ways are best for my life, and for the life of everyone else in this world. I also think, that God has intended for us to not fully understand everything because we are not God. We don't have the same intellect or wisdom to understand what he understands. Thus creates another basis for the admittance that he is far greater than us. We are his creations and He is the Creator who loves his creations. I hope I have made sense of myself. I hope this has made you understand where my faith has rooted from. Till next time!Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
I don't have a problem with fags As long as they are able to give biological birth to their own offspring. Otherwise they should be treated as all other sexual deviants.
Whats wrong with homosexuals. I've heard that christians think it is bad because of Sodem and Gamora. Thats the only reason. They just percieved it as being bad. it doesnt even say in there bible there is something wrong with it. I certainly aint gay, but I can understand what those people go through. The pope is apologizing to the protestants jews all these people. How long will it be till he apologizes to gays?
Whose America? Eddie, Just to let you know something... "your" America is not my America. I think people like you need to be reminded of that every time you roll your flag-tatooed asses to showboat your vision of the world in public. Wellcome to freedom, if you can comprehend what "freedom" means. Patriot my fannie.
I don't have a problem with morons .... .... especially when they cut their own throat. Take Ed Anger's uh, point: So it would seem procreation is the standard. Well, Ed, I hope you've never masturbated; you just made yourself a sexual deviant. Oh, yeah, what about those wasted sperm when you take a leak? Did your wife have her period, lately? She's a deviant, since her sexuality didn't cause procreation. I know it seems like a nice idea, Ed, but given what sexual repression does to society, it's a stupid idea. Try again, unless of course you're happy being listed as a sexual deviant. thanx, Tiassa Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Elbaz While Christ never spoke directly about homosexualty, Christians like to debate which parts of Hebrew law remain intact. Predictably, it's whatever portions support a given Christian's preexisting prejudices. At my Catholic high school, priests unqualified by Leviticus 21 operated in violation of the Law. Laws against tattoos, cutting one's hair, and specific types of mourning have gone by the wayside. Indoor plumbing has revised perceptions of Laws pertaining to hygeine. Beyond that, there's some strange Pauline balderdash at play, but again it's just an evangelist putting words in Jesus' mouth and attributing his own prejudices to the scripture. OT-based prohibitions against homosexuality are not particularly well-founded in light of the adaptable Christian faith. And it's always worth reiterating that where Sodom and Gamorrah are involved, it's a better thing to give your daughters to be gang-raped by a mob than to let a man have anal sex. We should always keep such a value in proper context. thanx, Tiassa Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
what? From what I've heard they think gay is evil because the place was destroyed because the townspeople tried to descend on angels of the same gender and they were generally gay, so thats why they think it is wrong. How did daughters being gang raped have anything to do with that?
Simply ... That God would prefer you throw your daughters out to be gang raped than any man take it up the yang. I mean, angels praise that sort of thing. The irony is, well ... yeah. thanx, Tiassa Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
The value of giving your daughters to rape .... In its biblical context, well ... if that's what God says is right, that's what God says is right. That's why I've pretty much cast off conventional religions; I still have an ornery reverence for the greater mystery, but the formalisms of human religion by and large reduce God to a finite sum. Or something like that. It's hazy in here and I'm listening to Floater right now, so I'm just gonna grin right alongside you Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! thanx, Tiassa Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Arbitrary Salient asked me some time ago what my ideas are on the essence of Christianity. I have not answered the question. But now the time is right, since tiassa and Elbaz have done some work for me. I wanted others to bring up the point in a somewhat explicit manner... True faith is Love (or charity), for that is God. The Law and it is not arbitrary! The laws that are 'received' are arbitrary. (e.g. the 10 commandments -Exodus 20- are completely arbitrary of nature.) If one thinks that right and wrong, good and evil are defined by some received wisdom, you are become as sounding brass (I Cor 13). For you are in the hands of arbitrariness. Have you not noticed that all the received laws are in the old testament and the the coherent logical rules are in the new testament? (read e.g. St.Matt 22:40) This is what sets Christianity apart from (most) other religions and it is the essence of Christianity. Unfortunately most have forgotten (or are just too stupid to realize) this.
I dont really look at Judaism, my religion the way other people do. I believe that God is one, and God is everywhere. Love and feelings and good and bad are undefined. What is bad to someone is good to another. Thats why a common goal in my religion is to become united and part of the whole. Not really agreeing but understanding all of this. Now I dont like the idea of christianity, because firstly, the whole idea of a virgin having a child sounds like a person lying through their nose. She probably wouldnt admit she did it with a deadbeat that ran away because she would have been treated very poorly. Secondly, its so contradictory. The idea of Good vs Bad is bogus. It propogates so many things like hate against homosexuals, and abortions. This is hitler behaviour. That is in my opinion a bad quality. And charity as merljin pointed out, is sortof a piece God. Its like becoming part of the whole, which is imperative in completing what I consider the purpose of mankind as taught by Judaism - controlling our surroundings and nature. I have so many things to say about it, but the people are who define it. And such people as tony1 are giving it a bad name. Let me ask, do you question christianity? What do you take of its contradictory nature? Do you believe homosexuals are devoid of human nature and choice is no option? If you can genuinely answer these questions only in regard to yourself, then christianity is completely relevant. But I dont know anyone who can answer these not only logically, but honestly. I dont mean any insult to christians here, but its just a touchy subject.
I don't know. Adopting a gay is such a responsibility. Have to take care of him etc I guess not, I don't want to adopt a gay. I think they can stand for themselves. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
