Fortean phenomena

Discussion in 'UFOs, Ghosts and Monsters' started by Magical Realist, Nov 16, 2016.

  1. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    I'll take this opportunity to wish all UFO pilots and their crew, all ghosts, goblins and ol Bigfoot, all interdimensional travellers, and any other entity wandering in the paranormal and supernatural world a Happy Solstice, Merry Xmas and a Prosperous New Year.
    Yáll come and visit me some time!

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
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  3. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Trace evidence ufo case in Delphos Kansas:

     
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  5. Q-reeus Valued Senior Member

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    You got caught out again MR. See (currently 4th down) comment & quote by Cory Landolt, complete with link to debunking site: http://midimagic.sgc-hosting.com/ufoprank.htm
     
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  7. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Have you made any more progress on the Ravenna UFO yet, Magical Realist?
     
  8. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Practically bebunked in 40 minutes - is that a new record?

    Apparently, the mysterious "ring" on the ground, claimed to be caused by a UFO, was actually the site of a circular chicken feeder made from galvanised iron. Over the years, the galvanising coating broke down, and there was no doubt a lot of chicken poo around the area too. So, we get the formation of certain acid compounds in a ring where the feeder used to be.

    Add in a family who wanted to invent a good story in order to win a prize for the "best" UFO report, and it's practically case closed.

    But Magical Realist will still insist there was a UFO, guaranteed. Because "eyewitnesses" never tell lies.
     
  9. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    The video clip there is also a good case-study on how to present UFO sensationalism without raising obvious questions, because credulity is what those TV shows aim for.

    Notice, in particular, that they have an expert soil analyst who talks about the composition of the material from the "UFO ring", but they never ask how she thinks, in her professional opinion, the soil samples got that way. The very fact that this basic question is not put to the expert on camera shows that the makers of the program want to hide her real opinion. She says that the soil couldn't have got that way "by natural means", or something similar, but they don't follow up and ask what she means by that - that just want to put that statement to air because it sounds like she's saying it must have been supernatural or alien in origin. Probably, she just meant that somebody must have brought something else to the site in order to affect the soil that way - like a galvanised chicken feeder and lots of chickens, for example!
     
  10. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Strange that doing a google search comes up with only one site where that chicken feeder theory and the National Enquirer UFO story prize is mentioned. I'd have to see more than that to lend such a debunk any credibility. Could be totally made up for all I know. Skeptics will do that sometimes I bet.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2017
  11. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    You mean that compelling case you couldn't debunk despite 20 pages of trying. lol!? I've completely moved on from that one.
     
  12. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Who the hell is Cory Landolt and why should we believe him? What is his source for this?
     
  13. Q-reeus Valued Senior Member

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    The name was given so you could easily navigate to the comment & link (obviously to his source), which is what mattered. Sussed out a pro site:
    http://www.ufoevidence.org/cases/case192.htm
    Which anecdotally raises some points that sort of back the genuine UFO case. On balance though it really doesn't stand up as convincing. The mysterious white substance was known organic material, nothing exotic. Unless it can be shown the nay reference to that neighbour who brought up the chicken feeder is fake, the UFO claim best fits that label.
     
  14. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    I don't buy the chicken feeder story at all. The webpage you reference links to some guy's personal website claiming most ufos are fire balloons. Sounds like a crock to me. There's also no other mention of this chicken feeder story online. Reknowed skeptic Philip Klass speculates it was a water tank that left the ring, so not even he knew about this explanation. I still take the case as pretty convincing given the 4 witnesses and the strange nature of the residue, which glowed and left the woman's skin numb for years.
     
  15. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    "The ring itself remained visible for some time after the incident, and numerous soil samples of it were taken for initial analysis, as well as to store as evidence of the presumed visitation. A strange white substance was found within the soil – a substance that appeared to be the result of an intense and unnatural reaction.

    This white substance was later analysed by respected UFO researcher Jacques Vallee, who, in his book “Dimensions: A Casebook Of Alien Contact” offered his theory on what it might be. He stated that biological tests he had had done on it, showed that the white substance contained Actinomycetales – an organic organism similar to bacteria or a fungus.

    It was suggested that intense heat or some other form of energy had greatly accelerated these Actinomycetales to grow. The fact that they were in a ring suggested that the heat or energy source came from the underside of the strange craft that Ronnie had witnessed. Remember he particularly stated that the underside was by far the brightest emission of light.

    For their part, the Johnsons were regarded as very credible witnesses, who were not prone to giving false information. The Sheriff of Delphos, Sheriff Enlow, stated at the time that they were “well known and well respected” by the community, and that he did not believe the incident to be a hoax."---https://www.ufoinsight.com/delphos-ring-strange-cases-physical-ufo-evidence/
     
  16. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Agreed. Chicken feeders are far too extraordinary. It would require extraordinary evidence before one could plausibly posit their presence on a farm. Has anyone yet proven they even exist, let alone on a farm?

    UFOs, on the other hand, are common as fleas on a dog. One wonders how anybody could have seen they were on a farm at all, what with the air thick as pea soup with UFOs buzzing about.
     
  17. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Especially those new fangled ones that light up brightly and take off into the sky breaking tree limbs in the process.

    Probably even more common, numbering in 10's of thousands of sightings over the past 8 decades.
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2017
  18. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Magical Realist:

    Here is a link to the soil analysis report carried out in 1999 on the soil samples from the Delphos, Kansas ring of 1971:

    http://documents.theblackvault.com/documents/Budinger/UT001.pdf

    The soil analysis didn't turn up anything that couldn't have got there by terrestrial means. There's no need to invoke strange energies or alien activity.

    I found at least 3 sites that mention a chicken feeder or sheep trough within the first few pages of google search results. Perhaps you're not searching for actual information, but only credulous repeats of UFO belief.

    Of course you don't. You only ever buy the most credulous alien spaceship hypothesis on these things. And you buy it without ever investigating the case in any depth.

    He hypothesised a sheep feeder at the location. Whether it was sheep of chicken, either way you have animals excreting at the site, along with whatever the feeder itself was made of, along with whatever foodstuffs were spilled from it, along with any plant or fungus growth that resulted from all the fertilisation that was happening there.

    Even that "numb for years" fact is not confirmed. Some accounts say "a few days", while others say she is still numb years later. So, who knows? Also, the numbness has been explained in terms of the acids in the soil.

    Who said it was "intense and unnatural"? An expert, or just a UFO pusher like yourself?

    Sound like that fits the sheep or chicken theory.

    Only in the report I've linked above there is a finding that the soil samples had not been subjected to any heat. As an unidentified "energy source", that's just vague UFO-pusher speculation.

    Maybe it's what they left out that is important, rather than what they said.
     
  19. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Except for the fact that a brightly lit disk shaped ufo was seen to lift off from that exact location breaking tree limbs and even depositing the white glowing substance on the trees. Ofcourse those are details you conveniently leave out.

    From your own cited report:

    "A speculation is offered by a colleague (Dr. J. Robert Mooney). It is based on the presence of the high concentration (5%) of oxalic acid. (The following may sound bizarre, yet isn’t the whole UFO phenomena bizarre? It is worth contemplating.) Oxalic acid is a natural product in the soil. However, such a high concentration would not be expected from the usual plant source. Exhaust from a low temperature ionization or combustion engine (whose fuel source was elemental carbon) could leave a high concentration of the acid along with other lower molecular weight acids. Of course the major components from such an engine would be expected to the carbon dioxide and carbon monoxide. These would be lost as gases. The acids would concentrate in the soil beneath the exhaust. Use of elemental carbon, as a fuel, seems very reasonable as it is safely transportable and contains a high energy density. It is recommended that T. S. R. No.: UT001 P. A. Budinger Page 4 future ring sites be carefully assayed for oxalic acid and other low molecular weight acetic components4 .

    9.) Finally, others have countered that the release represents the products of “well seasoned barnyard soil”. If this were the case there should be much higher concentrations of elements such as nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium present. Also there should be evidence of significant amounts of other components such as urea, uric acid, and ammonium components, which are typical of animal waste and its decomposition products. These are not detected. Only the fulvic acid predominates."

    So much for the "chicken feeder" or "sheep feeder" or "whatever feeder you wanna make up" hypothesis.
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2017
  20. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Right. So if we postulate a magical propulsion that - without any other rationale behind it - that happens to have exactly the byproducts needed to corroborate our own hypothesis, that's definitely more plausible.

    I postulate a form of pixie dust has an even higher concentration of oxalic acid than the primitive "elemental carbon" device proposed. In fact, I propose that its byproducts perfectly match what was found.
     
  21. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    No..it doesn't confirm barnyard shit or urea at all. It's fulvic acid alone and in a quantity beyond what any natural decay could produce.
     
  22. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Right. And I'm proposing a mechanism for the creation of those byproducts. I posit a form of pixie dust. My pixie dust produces just the right amount of fulvic acid and oxalic acid, and no other byproducts.

    The fact that those ingredients were found is evidence that my pixie dust is a good fit for the explanation of the glowing ring.
     
  23. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    How do you know the composition of pixie dust? Have you or anyone else seen any pixies lately?


    Interesting detail from Mrs. Johnson on the scene of the Delphos ufo:

    "Mrs. Johnson said that the ground felt cool, even while it glowed. She also described the ground as slick and crusty."--http://www.openminds.tv/ufo-landing-in-delphos-kansas/37970
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2017

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