Formula 1 Engines

Discussion in 'Architecture & Engineering' started by jayeeyee, Jun 27, 2012.

  1. jayeeyee Registered Member

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    I'm a self-taught mechanic. I love working on cars, especially my own. I love and enjoy understanding the properties on how a everything mechanically operates and the raw power it generates. In a nutshell, I'm very proud of what I learned and can accomplish, maybe I should post this on an automotive forum but I believe that the technology inside a combustion engine is so advance in terms of engineering these days that it deserves it's place in scientific community (I'm not saying that science doesn't have anything to do with the automotive industry, in fact it's all thanks to it).

    After I watched this video on YT (youtube.com/watch?v=rp4SV8FGZoo) and even with all my full understand how combustion cycles/strokes works.. my mind could not grasp the level pure 'awesomeness' (no other word for it) that this engine produces. This Honda F1 engine produces 18,000RPM, each piston stroke is traveling 300 times A SECOND!!! In almost the time it requires to blink your eye, the piston has already went up and down 300 times. It still amazes me till this day and a part of my brain still cannot comprehend the the truth of it... but the math is there and it is proven possible.

    Serioualy, 300 times a second. The amount of heat generated and the precision required is so fine that even the slightest imbalance in any of the components will cause the engine to implode upon itself. The level of engineer is just so mind boggling. Damn, I love cars.
     
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  3. MacGyver1968 Fixin' Shit that Ain't Broke Valued Senior Member

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    I get a woody just thinking about it. They are hands down, the most advanced race engines on the planet. The whole car is made of pure awesome.
     
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  5. Buddha12 Valued Senior Member

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    What kind do you own?

    What have you accomplished?
     
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  7. jayeeyee Registered Member

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    Because of my interested in automotive engineering/repair, I ended up working at a couple of shops and got a lot of on hand experience. I also got a chance to learn automotive body repair/refinishing as well. So yea, it feels (at least to me) a great accomplishment that I can pretty much tackle any car issues. Almost.

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  8. Buddha12 Valued Senior Member

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  9. jayeeyee Registered Member

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    Yea, I've read up on the DeltaWing from Car&Driver magazine while sitting on the John one day.. I have to admit it's an unconventional design.. especially the front steering layout but if they succeed, they'll have all the bragging rights. Still looks like the Batmobile to me though.
     
  10. Buddha12 Valued Senior Member

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    I see a little similarity but not that much especially in the front end where the wheels are far apart not close together.

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  11. MacGyver1968 Fixin' Shit that Ain't Broke Valued Senior Member

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    I wouldn't say the delta wing failed...it just crashed out at Le Mans this year. The whole idea is... it uses 50% less fuel and tires than the standard car, so it means less pit stops...and in a 24 hour race like Le mans, a few less pits stops can add up quick. That's one really cool thing at Le Mans...they have an "experimental class" allowed to race...but not win...just an exhibition kinda thing. That's what the Delta Wing was.

    I was really impressed by the hybrid technology both Audi and Toyota brought to Le man this year...they really performed well. Turning braking energy into energy that can be used exiting a corner with a max torque @ 0 rpm electric supplementary motor ..I see why they were so fast....with the added benefit of running on electric only if you push it to long and run out fuel a good ways away from the pit entrance.

    Edit: Physics question: With a normal friction braking system...pads and rotors...is all of the momentum of car turned to heat energy on braking or is there something else?
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2012
  12. MacGyver1968 Fixin' Shit that Ain't Broke Valued Senior Member

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    Let's get back to F1 talk....did anyone see the race in Valencia this week? One of the best races I've seen at Valencia in a long time. Normally the tight street course with walls on both sides is hard to pass on....but lots of drama happened on the track this year...include the reigning champion and a top 3 contender...both using Renaugh engines having alternator failures during the hot race.

    The OP brings up these engines that turn at 18,000....the crazy part..even though they experience much higher stress than a normal racing engine...spinning at that high rpm...they make them of a composite of unobtanium and unicorn dust...which somehow limits the amount of engine failures they have in the race. They only have a certain number of engines to run in the season..so they have to make them last more than one race. It's crazy how they can get that much power AND get reliability.
     
  13. jayeeyee Registered Member

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    With conventional friction braking systems (pads & rotors) only, all the kinetic energy caused by the deceleration of the vehicle is turned into heat energy and wasted.. so yea.. you're correct. Nothing special happening on conventional brake systems. With regenerative braking, it's a whole new story. In a nutshell, the kinetic energy caused by the deceleration (braking) of the car drives a generator which stores a portion of the kinetic energy which then converts it into electrical energy which is then stored into the battery. The whole tidbit and mechanical explanation ofcourse is much more complicated. You have solenoids, switches, drive generators on each wheel that slows the car down but when the generator is no longer capable of stopping the car by itself, the friction braking system comes into play and bla bla blah.

    Oh, and with F1 engines.. it's rebuilt after each and every individual race up to a certain amount before they chuck it and put in a brand new motor. I'd give my pinky to have one of them discarded 18k rpm motors

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  14. Grumpy Curmudgeon of Lucidity Valued Senior Member

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    Just a point, the F1 engines really have no higher piston speeds at 18,000 rpm than the new GT 500 5.4 supercharged Mustang engine does at 7500. Peak piston speed is the current limiting factor in engine design. While the F1 piston reverses many more times per second, the piston speed is kept in check with very short strokes. This requires a larger piston diameter to give the same displacement(comparing short stroke to long stroke)but that allows bigger valves, a bonus. In the Mustang engine the stroke is very much longer and the PEAK piston speed is the same as the F1 engine at maximum rpm. Strangely, the Mustang engine produces almost exactly the same HP as the F1(around 800 hp), more torque(500 vs 250 or so)and comes with a warranty. Of course it weights more than three times as much, is twice the size and it will not survive more than a few minutes at continuous maximum power.

    Grumpy

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  15. Motor Daddy ☼☼☼☼☼☼☼☼☼☼☼ Valued Senior Member

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    Grumpy, do you work at Ford?
     
  16. Mikemcc Registered Senior Member

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    When they build the F1 engines they have to heat up the blocks to be able to fit the pistons. Prior to running a race they have to warm the engine oil up to bring the engine temperature high enough to free the pistons so that they can move!

    Unfortunately I can't post links yet but try googling for F1 engines playing God Save The Queen. Very cool.

    The Bloodhound SSC car is using a Cosworth engine... as a fuel pump! The oxidizer for the hybrid rocket motor is pumped using this engine.
     

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