Dr Watson's views on race seem very sensible.

Discussion in 'Science & Society' started by Lord Hillyer, Oct 21, 2007.

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  1. Lord Hillyer Banned Banned

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    And now the old man is being hypocritically denounced by the same self-righteous establishment that continues to harm Negroes by pretending that they are the intellectual equals of other races, when the body of historical evidence and statistical data tends to persuade to the contrary.

    As a liberal humanist, who generally wishes the best for everyone, I agree with Dr Watson that if a group has proven to be permanently disadvantaged, no favours are done by pretending otherwise for the sake of propelling a false paradigm.

    Like Dr Watson, I don't propose institutional discrimination based on race or skin colour alone, but to avoid this issue entirely is analogous to wondering what economic prejudices have caused the special education class to be underperforming relative to the rest of the school.
     
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  3. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    What do you think of Dr Watsons earlier claims?

    1. Hispanic people have more libido due to sunshine
    2. Fat people have less ambition
    3. Mothers should abort gay babies
     
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  5. Orleander OH JOY!!!! Valued Senior Member

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    I would love to see links to those. He really said that?!

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  7. Atom Registered Senior Member

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    No.2 is generally correct.

    No.1 probably but more general than No.2.

    No.3 both immoral and unlikely. Even if there were a 'gay gene' it would be totally wrong.
     
  8. milkweed Valued Senior Member

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    1. and 2.
    http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2000/11/13/MN111208.DTL

    "Watson, who has a reputation as an engaging lecturer, started off describing an experiment by scientists at the University of Arizona, who injected male patients with an extract of melanin. They intended to test whether they could chemically darken the men's skin as a skin cancer protection, only to observe an unusual side effect -- the men developed sustained and unprovoked erections..."

    "Then he delved into what he presented as the bad news, good news aspects of being fat, the students said. The bad news, said Watson, is that thin people are more ambitious and therefore make better workers. On the other hand, fat people may be more sexual, Watson told the assembly, because their bloodstreams contain higher levels of leptin, one of the hormones derived from pom-C..."

    3.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/htmlContent.jhtml?html=/archive/1997/02/16/nabort16.html

    "...Dr Watson says: "If you could find the gene which determines sexuality and a woman decides she doesn't want a homosexual child, well, let her..."

    Regarding intelligence and Watson:

    http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn3451

    "Watson says that low intelligence is an inherited disorder and that molecular biologists have a duty to devise gene therapies or screening tests to tackle stupidity."

    He probably could use a publicist or good speech writer to convey his ideas in a more palatable (read politically correct) way.
     
  9. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    from here
    http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1673952,00.html

    He has been involved in eugenics for a long time. It was his prime motivation for starting the Human Genome Project (from which he was kicked out due to his tendency to get on people's nerves).

    He genuinely believes all behaviour can be reduced to genes and that genetic research can create the perfect human, by eliminating "undesirable" traits. Its a little known secret that eugenics research was being carried out in Cold Spring Harbor at the time that it was being carried out in Germany during the war.

    He has been a serious advocate of germline engineering of humans

    http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/summary/276/5314/892



    And his ideas about the ethics are a little unconventional

    http://geneticsandsociety.org/article.php?id=245
     
  10. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Not to mention what they have already done in the past at CSHL, where Watson is the major fund raiser for research.

    http://blog.sciam.com/index.php?title=james_watson_and_eugenics&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1
     
  11. cat77 Registered Member

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    social X racial issues

    I wanted to see the results grouped by social classes rather than races. I am sure it would be a much greater correlation between IQ and social/economical level than race. Maybe this will show that a poor black performs as bad as a poor white in an IQ test (and actually, does it really tests how intelligent somebody is??).

    Sadly, in many countries (US included), blacks have been aside the society for centuries, and the "inferiority stigma" is still there (and actually in the US I think they help to perpetuate this "stigma", but I won't get into this discussion).

    But so far, what proof this gentleman has given that his theory is true? Where are the data? Clearly, bias is playing a huge role on his results... I think he is giving proof that he is going out of his mind, maybe retirement should be a consideration.

    Period.
     
  12. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Quite

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/09/070921100332.htm
     
  13. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

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    Scientific data was collected and studied for years and years, and consistently showed whites doing better in all kind of intelligence tests ....until the liberal doo-gooders shut it down because the results didn't match their liberal viewpoints!

    Now it's so UN-politically correct, that no university or researcher is willing to take on the task. They'd all prefer to "believe" in equality ...sorta' like a religious belief, ya' know?

    And on what scientific data to you base your assertion of bias? Or are you just another liberal doo-gooder who'd prefer not to know the truth of your beliefs?

    Baron Max
     
  14. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Tests designed, conducted and administered by?
     
  15. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

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    All kinds of researchers and educators in the 50s, 60s and 70s. I think they all showed that blacks were less intelligent than whites. But then the liberal doo-gooders shut it down ....and now scientists are shot at sunrise if they even mention doing such research!

    Baron Max
     
  16. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Was that the same time that the US and Europe and other countries were also involved in mass sterilisation and eugenics? The same time that the civil rights movement was going on?

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  17. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

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    Hmm, yeah, I guess. And it was at that same time that we discovered the polio vaccine, the treatment for malaria, the cure for measles, ....and a whole slew of new scientific advances in medicine and science. So, ...what's your point, Sam???

    Baron Max
     
  18. Zephyr Humans are ONE Registered Senior Member

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    Not only immoral but stupid. If there really is a 'gay gene', it would disappear rapidly in areas where gays are not pressured into marrying and having biological children. The homophobes who hold that theory hardly need to push abortions. :shrug:
     
  19. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Thought as much. Makes sense now why they did not emphasise the variation within group
     
  20. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

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    Why do you say that, Sam? I mean, on what UNbias info do you base that assertion?

    Baron Max
     
  21. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    The fact that the variance within group is higher than between groups and was not emphasised
     
  22. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

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    Where do you get that info, Sam? Just saying it doesn't make it true!

    Baron Max
     
  23. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    look at the OP
     
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