# Does time exist?

Discussion in 'Free Thoughts' started by Asexperia, Sep 28, 2015.

1. ### AsexperiaRegistered Senior Member

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Time exits independently of space.

3. ### NotEinsteinValued Senior Member

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Although the concept of spacetime introduced in the theory of relativity couples the two inextricably, I agree that space and time as we experience them are distinct, different, and (seemingly) independent of each other.

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8. ### AsexperiaRegistered Senior Member

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Sorry here is the post. My tablet has some problem.

Space is the place occupied by bodies. In space we can determine the position of a point in relation to a frame of reference. In time we take as reference a moment in the past. The use of a frame of reference is what relates space and time.

9. ### NotEinsteinValued Senior Member

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While it is true that a frame of reference does relate space and time in one way, events (as the term is used in the theory of relativity) does so too. For example, lightning strikes a tree. Here we have a specific location/place (the tree), and a specific moment (the lightning strike-moment).

So what is your conclusion regarding the topic's opening question? Does time exist? Your post #981 strongly suggests the affirmative.

10. ### BWE1Rulers are for measuring.Registered Senior Member

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I am on the fence about his number 2 depending how I read it. Equally real just means they each have the same relationship to reality. It doesn't qualify that relationship. Reality is a notoriously slippery concept and it seems to me that time is inextricably linked with reality, but I don't think it is real in some objective sense since it is so subjective in both frame and perception senses.

11. ### AsexperiaRegistered Senior Member

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The lightning strikes the tree at a specific moment of the day.
The moment of reference is the midnight. For example at 07:32:26 PM.

Last edited: Oct 3, 2017

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What?

13. ### AsexperiaRegistered Senior Member

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Albert Einstein conceived the space-time as a mesh that extends into space and
that is curved for the mass of a star. This mesh has never been detected.

14. ### DaveC426913Valued Senior Member

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Er.
Einstein never talked about a mesh.
And no one has ever taken any such concept literally.
And what dos this have to do with the topic?
And what does that have to do with lightning striking?

So. Many. Questions...

15. ### NotEinsteinValued Senior Member

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That one is my doing: I was giving an example of an "event". Something with a clear location (a tree), and a moment (the moment of the strike). All observers have to agree that this event took place, because there is only one reality, but they may differ on where and when. Ergo, space and time are relative, but events are not.

I'm pretty sure Asexperia is referencing that.

16. ### AsexperiaRegistered Senior Member

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For observers on the surface of the Earth its orbital and translation speed are magnitive.
It seems to us that the Earth doesn't move, We don't feel its movements.

17. ### AsexperiaRegistered Senior Member

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I meant orbital and rotation speed.

18. ### AsexperiaRegistered Senior Member

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- It's subjective (ilussion): Julian Barbour
- It's subjective (a priori): Immanuel Kant
- It's objective (real): Lee Smolin
- It's magnitive (objective, measurable, imperceptible
and intuitable): Asexperia

Last edited: Oct 17, 2017

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20. ### AsexperiaRegistered Senior Member

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Don't feel guilty.
Sooner or later anyone would think about it.

21. ### NotEinsteinValued Senior Member

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Let's grant that time is "magnitive". That means that your answer to the topic's question is "yes". But, what else? What useful insights can be gained from your opinion about time? What are the predictions about time that you make that haven't (yet) been verified through science?

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22. ### AsexperiaRegistered Senior Member

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The construction of the perfect clock. Current clocks use a frequency
or vibration that can be affected for the speed and gravity. Time
wouldn't be relative if They used a perfect clock.

Last edited: Oct 18, 2017
23. ### NotEinsteinValued Senior Member

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Describe how to build such a perfect clock using magnitive time, or at least how it works.

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