does the univerce have an end, a limit?

Discussion in 'Astronomy, Exobiology, & Cosmology' started by Shadow1, Jan 1, 2010.

  1. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

    i felt curiousabout that. Confused
    i mean, every one knows about the univerce expanding sence the Big-Bang,
    if the univerce is expanding, and i'm sure of it, so it must have a limit,
    something that have no limit, cant expand more, cause it's already ecaulse infinity, at least that's what i think.
    if it have a limit, what does it exist beyond, i mean, it doesnt look logic, that some thing with no limit, expand, so it must have a limit, and if it had a limit, so it must be there something else in the beyond, maybe the other side, is inlimited, or maybe the one after it, toaday, we only know 4percent of the univerce, and we only know the matter, and the anti-matter, is just a new discovered by theroies by some radio signals and the NASA stuff, Razz
    if the black matter, causes the expanding of the univerce, so it must take a space, to expand, a space from another part, that part may have no limit, or it may have, who know
    if it is true, about the other side,
    so what do you think there's there, i'm sure it's so fa from ower minds,
    after all, we only know 4percent of univerce, and the things, the matter that we see it is only 1percent, Shocked

    ((((((((Just a little thing, just for who beleive in the relegiouses, i don't know much about relegious, but i know that islam, in their holy book, they beleive in the univerce expanding, and the Big-Bang, beleive it or not, i think that chirstians holy book have some stuff like this too))))))===> just a guess, Razz i may look a little bet naiif cause i beleive in the relegious, but it's ok, even if i do, that want be a prob. some relegiouses, i don't know about others, but i know that the muslim relegious have some stuff about that topic, and the start of the univerce and solar system and stuff .... use your imagination, actually, every ones that i saw were true,))))
    i think that i'm a little bet off -topic now, so don't take what i said seriously
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  3. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

    What begins ends and what ends begins.

    It is possible to conceive of disconnected space-times, each existing but unable to interact with one another. An easily visualized metaphor is a group of separate soap bubbles, in which observers living on one soap bubble cannot interact with those on other soap bubbles, even in principle. According to one common terminology, each "soap bubble" of space-time is denoted as a universe, whereas our particular space-time is denoted as the Universe, just as we call our moon the Moon.

    The entire collection of these separate space-times is denoted as the multiverse. In principle, the other unconnected universes may have different dimensionalities and topologies of space-time, different forms of matter and energy, and different physical laws and physical constants, although such possibilities are currently speculative.
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  5. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

    Where does it say that in the Quran?

    Baron Max
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  7. Dark520 Rebuilt Registered Senior Member

    I believe that many physicists now believe that the universe has four spatial dimensions, so kind of like how you can walk around on the surface of the Earth endlessly (you will end up right back where you begin without hitting a wall or falling off the edge of the Earth, even though you haven't turned around), you can travel infinitely out from the universe and essentially just end up right back where you started.
  8. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

    Well, I think a lot people believe a lot of things, but that doens't make any of them factual or true.

    What always bothers me with questions like this are the answers ....people throw out all kinds of answers, some silly, some stupid, some whatever, but apparently few people want to admit that they simply don't know.

    "I don't know." is a perfectly good answer to something like this. Guessing and speculation about issues is probably doing more harm than good.

    Baron Max
  9. Pipes75 Registered Senior Member

    The universe is still taking it's form. It is still in the womb.

    If our universe is still in the womb, obviously their would be other universes and even 'parents' to the many universes. We don't know much about multiverses yet, so we don't know if their physics would be the same as ours, or if the physics is much different in other universes.

    Yes it would have an end, but we are just a small part of the interior, and the universes life cycle is so much beyond our own, it's very difficult for us to percieve.
    If you mean boundaries as opposed to end, well yes their would be boundaries too, but we don't see outside of the universe, so the boundaries are so wide spread, we just don't see them. To see the universes boundaries, we'd have to be able to see the entire universe, and I don't know if that's gonna happen anytime soon.

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  10. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

    yeah, you're right, if univerce expands, so there's another place that it take a part of it to expand, even if it was there nothing behing, that will be also called, a thing, that nothing, if it was there nothing behind, we don't know it is, cause even in the outer space here, there's nothing called nothing, a space totally empty, cause in the outer space, in our univerce, there's the dark matter, the matter, the anti-mater, ...

    To Baron Max: i already said i don't know all the quran, i remeber that i saw it somewhere, i'll post next time at the relegion section

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  11. nietzschefan Thread Killer Valued Senior Member

    It's ok to simply say "We don't know."
  12. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

    hehehehe, that's the most honest answer, but this topic is a discussion, i know that you all don't know, also me i don't know, but every one try to give his opinion and his thoghts.
  13. nietzschefan Thread Killer Valued Senior Member

    I personally subscribe to to the bubble universe theory. There was nothing special about our planet despite what superstition told us, there was nothing special about our solar system, there was nothing special about our galaxy, there is nothing special about our universe.

    Who knows maybe we'll expand into another one someday and have two universes or a combative reaction. (perhaps like a nasty chemical reaction that causes universe shrinkage and another "big bang" drama). I like to speculate too, but it all speculation.
  14. mananmater Registered Member

    yes like everything else the universe has an end.
  15. Blindman Valued Senior Member

    The universe most likely does not have an end.

    If it did have an edge what happens to energy and matter if it crosses / intersects this boundary. Do they bounce off or just disappear. Both present problems.

    Some suggest that the universe warps back on its self but there is no evidence for this so far. Interestingly it would put every point in the universe in the center of the universe.

    The best bet is that there is no end. That the universe continues on in every direction without end. One must remember that our perception of a 3 dimensional space is just that, our human perception. The exact nature of the dimensionality of the universe is still not know.
  16. kurros Registered Senior Member

    Actually it is perfectly possible to have an infinite universe which is expanding. In fact the simplest expansion models are exactly that. The expansion is of space itself, so distances between things get larger, but there is nothing about that which conflicts with the universe being infinite. Imagine an infinite ruler, then stretch it so that all the increments on it are twice the distance apart from what they were originally. If the ruler were finite it would now be twice as long, but since it was infinite to begin with it is now twice infinity long, which is of course still infinity. Yet the marks on the rulers are twice as far apart as originally.
  17. Dredd Dredd Registered Senior Member

  18. Crunchy Cat F-in' *meow* baby!!! Valued Senior Member

    That would be a logical assessment. If something expands then it seems logical that it has bounds. We don't know for sure that this is the case; however, it is compelling.

    Nobody knows what's outside our universe. Various theories of reality address this. My personal favorite is M-theory... which posits all of reality is contained within multi-dimensional Calibi Yao space structure and our universe is 4 dimensional membrane somehwere inside of this structure.

    Yep I agree. That's off topic

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  19. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member


    yeah, it is off-topic,

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    and about the M-theory, i actually like it, it seems more reseneball, and still, we don't know,

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    but this M-theory is the best in my opinion,

    and i don't know who asked me this question: where does this mentioned in quran,
    try to search google with the search word "the universe expansion in the quran" and enter the first headline, and the third, sorry for not puting a link, but i'm not yet allowed to, i'm new here

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  20. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member


    all the mater that we see, and know it, is just 3 percent of the hall thing, and the black matter, is nothing but another small percent, so,
    so, could it be there, more, after the univerce, could be there what after it,
    even in some relegions, they don't refer to the space by space, they refer to it by, building, or structure, and this is the true scientefic word, cause the space, isnt actually a space, it's not empty,
    like we all know,
    we think it is empty, but it's not, also, every thing in the univerce, is attached to each other, every thing,
    so, we can call it structure, better than the word space,
    maybe it really have no limit, mayeb it's like a ball, you run and run and run on it's surface wich it's space, and you still on this ball,
    but here, this ball's surface, is multi dimentional,
    so, could it be there more, for example, i know that the black hole, is a hole, in the space, that reach a limit, intill it become a point, and every thing stuck in it, there's always the worhole, wich also some relegions and civilisations talked about it, are a holes, that take you from a side of teh ball, to another side of the ball,
    so could it be there more things after the univerce, or, it's just inifity like a ball's surface,

    what are the other dimentions anyway, like a another place in the same place, but in a like other frequency,
    it's also mentioned in some relegions, and civilisations,
    we should somehow trust the old civilisations, they may have somethings true after all, being odl doenst mean primitive, if they had electrcity, propably they would be more developed that we are now toaday,
    anyway, let's go to the main topic,
    what is the space(it's a space for us, but there's no empty space in anywhere in this existence), what is the univerce, and what are the dimentions, i mean, how could two places, be in a one place? :itold::runaway:
  21. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

    My wife says, "The reason men invent religions is so you never have to say 'I don't know'."
  22. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member


    hm maybe, but i still say, i don't know, that's why i ask, if i know, why will i ask,
  23. pywakit Registered Senior Member

    Or it could be infinity not the surface of a ball.

    Think of a 3 dimensional straight line grid. Each line extends to infinity.

    There are no curves to the lines.

    Einstein said space is uniform. That is what GR says. It only curves in the presence of mass/gravity.

    Take away the gravity, and the lines are straight.

    In other words, outside the expanding bubble of the local universe's gravity, the lines are straight.

    Gravity is encroaching on those lines at the speed of light, plus space appears to be pushing/pulling the superclusters of galaxies apart at an accelerating velocity that currently exceeds the speed of light relative to each other.

    But beyond this expanding bubble of gravitational waves .... however big it is, the lines get straighter and straighter.

    Einstein could not accept his own math. He could not make 'the' universe any bigger than where we exist. Religion would not allow anything beyond our local universe either.

    But GR is an excellent predictor of all things macro.

    There is no reason to think that 'space' was created just for our universe, our existence. There is no reason to think that space was not already here before our BB.

    And there is no reason not to think that space is uniform, unless disturbed by mass/gravity.

    Therefore, space is infinite. Not a ball. Our local universe is a 'ball', or it would be if that were the actual shape. That does not appear to be the case either.

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