DEAD SEA SCROLLS:FAKE

Discussion in 'History' started by paddoboy, Mar 23, 2020.

  1. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    https://phys.org/news/2020-03-dead-sea-scroll-fragments-museum.html

    Dead Sea Scroll fragments in The Museum of the Bible found to be fake:

    A team of workers at Art Fraud Insights, LLC, has found that all of the Dead Sea Scroll (DSS) fragments housed at the Museum of the Bible in Washington D.C. are fake. They have published their findings on their company website.

    The Dead Sea scrolls are a collection of scrolls found in the Qumran Caves near the shore of the Dead Sea. They were discovered by a Bedouin shepherd in 1946. Since that time, the scrolls have been identified as ancient Jewish manuscripts created over the last three centuries BCE and the first century CE. They are housed in the Shrine of the Book on the grounds of the Israel Museum.
    MORE AT LINK.....

    EXTRACT:
    It is still not known who went to such great lengths to create the fake DSS fragments.
     
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  3. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Supplementary:
    https://phys.org/news/2019-10-museum-bible-quietly-artifact.html
    OCTOBER 5, 2019
    The Museum of the Bible in Washington quietly replaced an artifact purported to be one of a handful of miniature Bibles that a NASA astronaut carried to the moon in 1971 after an expert questioned its authenticity.

    The move follows an announcement last year that at least five of 16 Dead Sea Scroll fragments that had been on display at the museum were found to be apparent fakes.

    more at link....
     
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  5. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Thanks Pado .
    I am surprised there are no comments from other members.
    Alex
     
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  7. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Interesting, considering the DS scrolls were the best evidence for the authenticity of the Bible. Now, theists have nothing to fall back on.

    How now brown cow?
     
  8. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    I'm not.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
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  9. gmilam Valued Senior Member

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    Non-sequitur. Nobody said all the DSS are fake.
     
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  10. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    The fake ones were put there to test the faith of true believers, just like the fake parts of the shroud were added to test faith.
    How many scrolls have been tested? Has the Pope issued a statement? Will the faithful reject the science of testing?
    Alex
     
  11. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
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    https://phys.org/news/2020-03-dead-sea-scroll-fragments-museum.html

    Dead Sea Scroll fragments in The Museum of the Bible found to be fake:
    A team of workers at Art Fraud Insights, LLC, has found that all of the Dead Sea Scroll (DSS) fragments housed at the Museum of the Bible in Washington D.C. are fake. They have published their findings on their company website.

    extract:
    Officials of the Museum of the Bible obtained 16 fragments of what were claimed to be additional DSS fragments sometime after 2002. Soon thereafter, other institutions that had obtained samples from the same collections found evidence that they were not authentic DSS fragments. That finding cast doubt on all of the others. But it was not until 2017 that the Museum of the Bible opened its doors, proudly showing off its collection of DSS fragments. The next year, some of them were tested by Germany's Federal Institute for Materials Research and were found to be fake, as well. That led the museum to ask the team at Art Fraud Insights, LLC to examine all of their fragments.

    The final verdict: the fragments were not only fake, but had been created for the purpose of deception.
     
  12. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    The rest of the fragments were being tested, the results to come.
     
  13. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 71 years old Valued Senior Member

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    Very interesting

    I could understand the Museum of the Bible having copies made since the originals would I think be considered priceless

    Trying to pass them as originals very deceptive

    If the originals are classed as fake, whole new ball game

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  14. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    The pope is not such a mug as to make any statements about the authenticity or otherwise of these things.


    My understanding is that what have been tested are some fragments of dubious authenticity, acquired by this new museum of the bible in Washington DC, that opened a couple of years ago.

    None of this has any bearing on the authenticity of the main body of the Dead Sea scrolls which are kept, I think, in Jerusalem. Those were dated radiometrically a long time ago.
     
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  15. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    While it is correct that the article does not actually refer to the original dead sea scrolls that are kept in Israel, the question does need to be asked, why would someone go to such great lengths?

    Obviously also in relation to the original dead sea scrolls, in effect they still remain ancient obscure text, written in an obscure age, by obscure men. Certainly still though of great historical significance.
    found this on the original scrolls......
    https://theconversation.com/the-dead-sea-scrolls-are-a-priceless-link-to-the-bibles-past-105770
    extract:
    The Bible and the Dead Sea Scrolls
    Before the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls, the oldest known manuscripts of the Hebrew Bible dated to the 10th century A.D. The Dead Sea Scrolls include over 225 copies of biblical books that date up to 1,200 years earlier.

    These range from small fragments to a complete scroll of the prophet Isaiah, and every book of the Hebrew Bible except Esther and Nehemiah. They show that the books of the Jewish Bible were known and treated as sacred writings before the time of Jesus, with essentially the same content.

    On the other hand, there was no “Bible” as such but a loose assortment of writings sacred to various Jews including numerous books not in the modern Jewish Bible.

    Moreover, the Dead Sea Scrolls show that in the first century B.C. there were different versions of books that became part of the Hebrew canon, especially Exodus, Samuel, Jeremiah, Psalms and Daniel.

    This evidence has helped scholars understand how the Bible came to be, but it neither proves nor disproves its religious message.

    extract:
    The scrolls provide a rich trove of Jewish religious texts previously unknown. Some of these were written by Essenes and give insights into their views, as well as their conflict with other Jews including the Pharisees.

    The Dead Sea Scrolls contain nothing about Jesus or the early Christians, but indirectly they help to understand the Jewish world in which Jesus lived and why his message drew followers and opponents. Both the Essenes and the early Christians believed they were living at the time foretold by prophets when God would establish a kingdom of peace and that their teacher revealed the true meaning of Scripture.
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  16. mathman Valued Senior Member

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    1,808
    Museum of Bible fakes have no bearing on the authenticity of Dead Sea scrolls. Also Dead Sea scrolls are older copies than previously known versions. The bible being "authentic" (whatever that means) is a completely different question.
     
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  17. Luchito Registered Member

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    11
    It is understood a museum in DC will have the copies only. I went to New Mexico and visiting the museums, no original ancient ceramic was on the shelves but art work made by people in recent years. To me was a kind of fraud. I asked to a person who worked over there and I was told the original works are not to be shown to the public.

    Later I visited one of those Indian communities and I was warned not to use the video feature of my camera but that I was allowed to take pictures only. I think Indians have the belief spirits might get into the video or something like that. I kind of related such beliefs to the prohibition of showing original art work in those museums. This happened more than a decade ago. Perhaps today the museums have changed their policies.

    I heard that the "moon rocks" at the museum are also fake, and if this is true, it won't be a surprise as well.

    To me, original scroll patch or copy of it, is not the main issue but to show the writings as they were originally.

    Of course, ethics claim for the Museum of the Bible to add a sign saying those are copies, such is required to honor a museum dedicated to the "word of God".
     

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