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Hey, that is a cool site, huh? Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Glad you liked it!
Excerpts from the New American Bible, Sacred Scripture, Its Inspiration and Divine Interpretation: Unlike the exact science of history today, ancient biblical history, with rare exceptions, was less concerned with reporting in precise detail all the facts of a situation than with explaining the "meaning" of events. Such history was primarily interpretative and, in the Old Testament, its "purpose" was to disclose the action of the living God in the affairs of men. For this reason it is spoken of as "sacred history". Its writer's first concern was to bring out the divine or supernatural dimension in history... The divinely revealed realities which are contained and presented in sacred Scripture have been committed to writing under the "inspiration" of the Holy Spirit. The revelations contain the "meanings" of the "truth" which God wanted put into the sacred writings "for the sake of our salvation". The divinely inspired Scripture is to be used for teaching the truth and refuting error for reformation in manners and discipline in "right living" for salvation. Since God speaks in sacred scripture through men in human fashion, the interpreter of sacred Scripture, in order to see clearly what God wanted to communicate to us, should carefully investigate what "meaning" the sacred writers really intended, and what God wanted to manifest by means of their words... For the correct understanding of what the sacred author wanted to assert, due attention must be paid to the customary and characteristic styles of feeling, speaking and narrating which prevailed at the time of the sacred writer, and to the patterns men normally employed at that period in their everyday dealings with one another. From me: God's divine message concerning our salvation is not found in a science or math book because that is not such a book's purpose. The Bible's purpose is not to teach science or math, but to share God's word concerning our salvation. The information contained in science and math books changes over the years... as new discoveries and new information is obtained, the books are rewritten. The purpose of the Bible and the message given to us by God in the Bible concerning our salvation is timeless and does not need to be rewritten. One only needs to understand the true "meaning" of God's message.
That's so weak. Here, an answer for the first earth-shattering dilema...maybe the sea wasn't perfectly round. How many seas of anything have you ever seen that have been perfectly round? One source of contradiction, that the author just blows off, and that I've mentioned several times, is the difference in the laws that came when Jesus came, and in the New Testament versus the Old. Most of it is just logistical and mathematical detail that is hardly relevant to the message. Are you trying to tell me that you can't understand the overwhelmingly powerful message of the crusifiction and resurrection without knowing the logistics of the event? The message in the Bible is unmistakable if you keep your ego out of it and really seek to find the truth. You are not seeking that. You are seeking untruths. Start with something in the Bible that you consider to be true. Hey, now there's an idea! Look at your life, and look at this world, and see it's truth. Keep doing that. Really seek to understand it and you will. That's a promise God gave us. Open heart, open mind, and stay away from money grubbers in very bright attire! ------------------ "ET phone home!" "Uh, hello Satan?" "Hey, your plan worked great! They all think I'm cute!"
One thing I've been wondering is why hard-core Christians will declare that the bible is to be taken literally until you point out the errors, inconsistencies, and contradictions. Then they say it is symbolic. Actually, I'm not wondering too hard. I think I already know the answer.
Lori, Well ya know...I went this route because I gave you a whole bunch of scriptures that didn't add up..and I'm not talking about the ones you think you figured out. I do seek TRUTH....straight from the Spirit. I choose to focus on what the Spirit teaches me... which IS truth. Oxygen, I have been trying to make that very point for a year now... *pssst* but they still refuse to answer Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Listen, It would be different if someone could come up with some contradiction that actually MEANT something, or affected or changed or made unclear the messages in the Bible. But the fact remains, and there's no way in the world that anyone can deny this...that there is NO WAY anyone can say that the messages are unclear. Give me a contradiction that amounts to a hill of beans for crying out loud. And I'm not sure what you're talking about because I've never known a Christian who claims to understand every single little tiny bit of truth that is contained in this book. I also think that there are historical facts mixed with metaphorical parables. So what's so mind numbing about that? I just don't get you people. I'm telling you this though, and not one of you will dare to try, but if you honestly did what I suggested, and looked for truth in the Bible, you would most definately find it, and if you sought with an open heart, you would be saved. No doubt in my mind. You want to cop out? Fine. You want to focus on trivial logistical crap that doesn't make sense to you? Fine. But you're not doing yourself any favors, that's for sure. And you're hardly looking at the faith objectively. Why? Because you're afraid of what you would see. What's that? The truth. Why are you afraid? Because you sin and you know it. Get honest. ------------------ "ET phone home!" "Uh, hello Satan?" "Hey, your plan worked great! They all think I'm cute!"
Oxygen and Flash, I have always cautioned against taking the Bible "literally" and even talked about it a number of times on this board. I guess you missed it. Or, maybe because of my position, you don't consider me to be a true Christian?
Lori, You've made some great points there. I have also found that to be true... that people are afraid of the basic truth of God's message because it means that they will have to give up some of their sinful ways and change the way they lead their lives.
Flash, Once again, on Christmas Eve, a local family of four, (mother, father, five year old daughter and infant son) was left homeless when fire destroyed their townhome. The fire was started by a young child playing with matches under the bed. The local Fire Chief has seen this happen so many times and knows that it can be prevented if parents are more diligent in their efforts to warn their children against playing with matches. So, the Fire Chief asks a reporter, who was at the scene of the fire, to write an article in the local paper about this fire and to warn parents and children about the dangers of children playing with matches. The reporter does so. However, in the article, the reporter states that the fire was started by their young "boy" playing with matches under the bed. Now... wait a minute! The "boy" was an infant... Everyone "knows" that infants don't have the manual dexterity to light matches, right? That would mean that the reporter stated an "impossibility" as fact with respect to who started the fire. So, should the Spirit of the Truth of the message be lost on the reader? What is the Spirit of the Truth in the reporter's article mentioned above? What is the Spirit of the Truth in the Bible?
Lori, Ok girlfriend...I'm going to do some research..but when I do..I expect some ANSWERS to the contradictions I WILL show you. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
TS, Ok...I see what point you are trying to make. However, think about it in this light. If things can so easily get messed up..tell me this..how do you know which part of the bible is truth? Details are important! Lori didn't like this analogy..but let me try it on you. Say someone brought out a thick juicy steak..the aroma was to die for..you could actually taste the steak before you took a bite. Before it is served to you though..they put a piece of dog poop right smack dab in the middle of it. Now, wouldn't that one detail, that being the dog poop, keep you from eating the steak?
Lori & TS, Regarding the comments about "sin" and that being why people do not want to be a christian..because they would have to give it up. Nuh-huh! That is not it. I think for the most part..people try to live a good life..sure we all F up ...but so do christians. It's more of a "to believe or not believe"
Flash, I agree that details are important, to a certain extent, depending on what the purpose and meaning of the message is. I do not look for strict scientific, mathematical or historical accuracy when reading the Bible because the Bible's purpose is not to teach science, math or strict history. The Bible's purpose is to reveal God's divine message of salvation. So, you know that the truth is contained in the divine message of salvation. Take the article about the fire, for example. Yes, things can get easily messed up. How do you know which part of the article is truth? Do you consider the erroneouos but insignificant statement that a "boy" started the fire to be the "poop" on the steak which prevents you from consuming (understanding) the message about the dangers of children playing with matches? By the way, I think that the article above is more analogous to the discussion... And I have to agree with Lori... The "poop" analogy stinks! LOL!!! Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! [This message has been edited by truestory (edited December 28, 1999).]
TS, LOL NO, NO, NO.. I guess what I was thinking when I wrote that was the many many VALID contradictions that I posted long ago..those which had nothing to do with science, math, or history. The messages were so pooped upon it was totally obvious.
Flash, I haven't read through this entire conversation yet, but I wanted to mention before I forgot, that you did not SEEK the truth from "your" spirit. You didn't seek a damn thing and you know it. Your spirit is force feeding you without so much as one itty bitty question from you regarding anything it tells you whatsoever. You did not seek it out. It sought you out because it saw that you were extremely open to the suggestion that Christianity was not the truth, and then swooped in and mesmorized with a bunch of hocus pocus. I'm just saying, if we're going to talk about this, then at least let's be honest. Sorry, still wub ya though! Ooooh honey, you are soooo busted! So you think that stuff I said about sin isn't the real reason huh? Well, let's see here. If I had a nickel for everytime you've said to me.... if being saved means I have to do this, then I'll go to hell no problem... if being saved means I can't do that, then I'll gladly burn in hell for eternity. You know what I'm talking about girl. Fess up time! ------------------ "ET phone home!" "Uh, hello Satan?" "Hey, your plan worked great! They all think I'm cute!" [This message has been edited by Lori (edited December 28, 1999).]
TS, I do know that is the main reason that people shun the Bible (because of what sin means). I know this because that's why I did for so long. Sure I didn't admit that to myself. I told myself all these other trumped up reasons, like these so called contradictions, or the sins of Christians throughout the ages, or the fact that so many other religions exist, but when it came right down to it, and I finally GOT HONEST, it was really because I was a pot head slut with a potty mouth and a lot of pride surrounding my secular achievements. I simply did not want to admit that as smart as I was, I had made many mistakes. It's that simple. The thought of changing those things made me scared to death. I thought there was no way I could, and I didn't even want to, so I thought great, I'll be saved but I'll have this boring life in which everyone will treat me like some kind of leper because I'm so goody-goody two shoes. AND I'M TELLING YOU GUYS, IT'S NOT LIKE THAT, IT'S NOT LIKE THAT, AND IT'S NOT LIKE THAT AT ALL, NOT ONE LITTLE STINKY BIT! And I'm still being honest. ------------------ "ET phone home!" "Uh, hello Satan?" "Hey, your plan worked great! They all think I'm cute!"
Lori, Wait a minute...I have asked questions..and you know it. I just didn't do it the way YOU wanted me to. The Spirit is not force feeding me.. come on.. and I AM BEING HONEST!!! *sigh* I am really beginning to wonder if people know exactly what that word means
Lori, AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!! Man, you just take the cake and run with it ..don't ya? Who are you to tell me or anyone else for that matter what we think..feel..deny..admitt to..ect...???? I know EXACTLY how I feel and think. Oh, and I am BEING H O N E S T!
