Consciousness in the Physics Forum is warranted.

You mean his analysis is flawed? LOL. Never stops here. "..... the projector is being run by a god......" That would be Leonard Susskind.

 

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Take note of this guy [wellwisher]. This is every post this guy makes. Continual regardless the subject. Unadulterated sociopathic unsubstantiated bullshit.

 

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Come on now, it looks like you are trying to get this booted out of the science section so you can rant about the evil moderators.

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What else is there?

 

The power of an EM wave falls off with the square of the distance, and the power that our brains can generate is limited to 20 watts or so. For comparison, a transmission to one of the early Mars rovers takes like 400Kw.

 

@ Spidergoat,

I suppose it would need to be be something other than your magnetism idea.

Here is a thought (not claiming this). Holograms have information repeated in many areas. If this is a Holographic Universe then maybe I have an entire Universe and all the information inside my cats litter box.

Another thought is perhaps it is some unknown method that wont be able to be measured for another 50 years.

 

As a fan of David Bohm I won't reject the concept of a Holographic Universe out of hand.
However, it is not a question of holography which is how the human (and most other animals) brain works, but the concept of assigning a motivated intelligence (mass consciousness/telepathy) is another story. A hologram is a sophisticated form of connectedness, but does that make it intelligent?
Computers can create magnificent holograms, but no one would assign intentional motivation to a computer.

So the article describes a form of conectedness of which a small part is observable, which is certainly not a new idea.

We need definitions and clarification on these sweeping statement. Bohm wrote a scientific thesis on this in his book "wholeness and the implicate order".

Then there is the question of CDT (causal dynamic triangulation) or fractal nature of space, and fractals are holographic innature (self similarity).

 

Did it ever occur to you that, if you prefer posting in a science forum, then all you need to do is to start engaging readers on topics in science?

Let's look at what you are proposing here:

1. Nature explains: In 1997, theoretical physicist Juan Maldacena proposed . . . [t]he mathematically intricate world of strings, which exist in nine dimensions of space plus one of time, would be merely a hologram: the real action would play out in a simpler, flatter cosmos where there is no gravity.

2. Nature goes on to describe a recent computer simulation which corroborates Maldacena's proposition.

3. Therefore: It now appears that anybody denying God/Mass Consciousness/life after death/etc., might be wrong.

What, other than a hit of killer blotter acid, is supposed to lead your audience to that conclusion?

 

The problem with talking about consciousness is that you have such a wide range of alleged scientists who try and make some kind of very special connection between consciousness and the stuff of the universe. Take this for instance, which has gained a considerable amount of attention from non-scientists:

http://www.spiritscienceandmetaphys...ciousness-moves-to-another-universe-at-death/

Ignoring for a moment, this guy isn't actually claimed to be a physicist, it seems more that his profession had leaned towards the biological side of science, he claims that quantum physics proves there is life after death. He draws his claim for a seriously faulty premise that he ''presumes'' must be true. I wonder if you read and saw the faulty premise?

Actually, there are loads of things he get's wrong, but the main one that struck me is that he claims if you can remove matter and we remain, then you can remove spacetime and we still remain. He correctly states that time is a tool in which we use, but he claims space is also a tool we use and we ''drag this tool around with us.'' I can only imagine he talking about the 'bubble of perception' but he has it all backwards and terribly misunderstood. Reality doesn't follow us, what we see in reality is a shared experience and nothing more. He says this ''turtles shell'' which I can infer he must mean our bubble of perception and somehow the same as space and time, he claims when removed, we still remain.

This cannot be allowed in physics. You cannot remove space and time, nothing exists outside of space time. This is a fundamental principle of relativity.

The thing he does get right, is that the fundamental constants (and certain conditions) do appear to be fine tuned to allow life. There is a strong consensus, or agreement might be for a better word among astrophysicists that this is the case. So one might infer there being some form of intelligence before matter. But one can also infer there being an intelligence after matter later in our universes future cone that is responsible for the creation of our universe. These are so-called Top-Bottom models of cosmology.

This is besides the point though, we need less guys like this one clearly. I have no doubts however, that there could be a relationship between consciousness and quantum physics. We have already identified hundreds of plantforms that actually use quantum mechanics in different ways. The brain is far more complex than even this. It is the most unknown of all aspects about our physiology, even though we know a lot.

 

If you toss out your cat's litter box into the garbage can and the garbage man takes it out to the dump where they bury it, then the information of your cats stinky will be lost forever! No information about it's smell will ever be sniffed by anyone else again! Therefore, according to Stephen Hawking's logic, your cats stinky will then evaporate by absorbing anti particles from particle pairs and then send out only the corresponding particles to create a cat smell outside of tons of dirt. You could never truly get rid of you cats stinky ever!

 

I think there have been two computer simulations in physics so far which corroborates the theory. There was one a few years ago and one just recently.

 

If you took a holographic slide, and used a hole punch to cut out a small piece, the punch out would reproduce the entire image of the hologram. What that logically means is holographic universe uses a basic schema, that is repeated, as reality scales up. At any level, you see the same repeating schema.

As an example, say we start with a tiny sphere. These tiny spheres combine until another larger sphere appears, etc. IF we make a punch of the larger holographic sphere we see the littler spheres which look like the full sphere slide.

 

By the way... I've been watching the comments here of the holographic principle.

I actually believe the universe is a retrocausal hologram projected from our future horizon. There is something located in our universe shaping up the initial hologram. Some can call it God who like to relate some kind of religious importance... myself personally, I don't like the noun God. I prefer to simply call it an intelligence.

 

RJBeery/origin,

ESP has been a hobby since I was a teenager, and I have likely participated in and organized more psychic experiments than anybody here. I run a members only paranormal website. I also have other associations that I do not wish to make public.

I myself have had extremely successful experiments reaching into other countries.

The moon example I gave was only anecdotal to show measured success (Can only speak in probabilities do to nature of instruments flesh and blood).

Here is a link to that however ...
http://lifestyle.inquirer.net/1613/experiments-in-telepathy-from-outer-space

This Astronaut spent more time on the moon than anybody in history (known history?). He also has made some fantastic claims that Aliens exist so his credibility might be for sale. I do not know.

I can reference a well documented experiment between a well known fiction writer/ESP hobbyist Harold Sherman, and Sir Hubert Wilkins (Knighted by Queen) a famous Arctic explorer. Wilkins and Sherman maintained a psychic schedule throughout a polar expedition beyond reach of radio (at the time). 3400 miles apart the explorer sent messages to a Manhattan apartment 3 nights a week for 6 months. Witnesses to this were many public figures including a radio operator who viewed copies of Shermans impressions before radio contact was made. There is a book entitled, "Thoughts through Space" documenting this. It was deemed to have hit rate success of over 70%, and some of what Sherman described is extremely accurate.

Note: Harold Sherman is also the author of "How to make ESP work for you". This book is what started my interest in the subject.

This author was famous for writing an adventure series and writing in the movies, however he does discuss this experiment on a psychic talk show. Here is link.
Bear in mind this author was quite famous for his other work. He authored at least 50 books in an era when books were made with paper.
Here is link to wikipedia on him...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harold_Sherman
Here is wikipedia on Sir Hubert Wilkins ...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubert_Wilkins
Note Wilkins changed his "religion" to that of the Urantia Book (PSI pseudoscience stuff).

Here is Harold Sherman on Youtube of him discussing experiment.

NOTE: START VIDEO AT 6:30 ... That is when Harold Sherman starts.

[video=youtube;VQTIITrjNz8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQTIITrjNz8[/video]

NOTE: Underlining terminology like Crankcase above. The receiver person not only got a "hit" but it was in an incredibly descriptively accurate way. This type of uncanny accuracy pervades authentic telepathy and can be extraordinarily convincing to those participating. A skeptic would count this as a lucky "hit" and dismiss the accuracy. If a mother suddenly envisions her child in an auto accident and it turns out it was true in both time and nature the accuracy is dismissed by many. I thought this was worth saying.

The Urantia Book is available online in dozens of locations for free, such as.
(It takes a while to open)
https://ia701202.us.archive.org/27/...-Urantia-Book-1955-Guardian-Plates-600dpi.pdf

(I do not endorse this book, but it might hold some truths).

More on Sir Wilkins
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vcwcr7A4vOI

Both of these men were very respected. Wilkins as an explorer, and Sherman as a Hollywood movie writer and author.

@ RjBeery / origin(still),

So even if my comment was a simple statement suggesting that telepathy is possible longer than Spidergoats 20 feet, it was not without some forethought.

@ Trapped,

The world is full of fake healers and quackery. Does this mean real doctors and medicine do not exist?

I disagree. I believe many things exist in superposition as possibility waves. See link.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Measurement_problem

I think we all live our lives mostly in this Juxtaposition state, but our actions are not finalized until we are observed.

Note: There are experiments out there that suggest precognition exists.
http://www.popsci.com/science/artic...research-shows-human-mind-can-perceive-future

My reasoning for expecting a wavelength to be able to collapse altering our pasts is because for Karl Jungs Synchronicity to occur there is often things that occurred in the past to make it possible.

i.e. Imagine you start discussing "Blue Eyed Mary" that worked in a University Restaurant in your college days. Suddenly she enters the restaurant in which you and your colleagues were discussing her. This would mean....
a) You psychically sensed her and started discussing her ... or ...
b) She altered course 2 hours before the conversation because your present conversation altered the superposition and path of Marys Possibility waves.

This is taking the Schrodinger Cat experiment as literal as opposed to using it to show ridiculousness of the idea.

I will suggest that we shape our world with our own thoughts, and our thoughts shape our behaviors in superposition so when we are collapsed our reality is more in tune with our beliefs and expectations.

The Fred Alan Wolf (dr. quantum) views are common to many, but it is scorned in sciforums.


Also at Trapped,
I also dislike the term god. I often just say Universe/All that is/Mass consciousness.

@ Aqueous Id,

A holographic Universe (if true) would flip known science on its head. I certainly think the ideas of Russellian Science could apply more in such a world.

@ Everyone,

Show me a model of our Universe that explains telepathy (which I shall never be able to deny), and I will be more open to it. However; simply the idea of telepathy being true means a Mass Consciousness must also be likely (since we are linked anyways).

 

Well then, with the tack that this thread has taken, I suppose this should not be in the science section of the forum anymore and should be moved to the fringe section - paranormal I would say.:shrug:

 

@ Origin,

Odd. This suggests you at one time thought it did belong in physics.. lol

That is a shallow note. I suppose the idea of a Holographic Universe also does not appeal to your "belief" structure. The very title of this thread and my Opening Post suggested it would be moved long ago, yet it has gone several pages already. Perhaps this is a sciforum longevity record for discussing consciousness in the physics section.

Maybe you missed it when I wrote (IN OPENING POST) ...

or maybe your memory is failing ...

My stance that telepathy must be included in any Universal Theory I would accept may not be popular, but as has been said by others "Telepathy cannot be disproved". Writing off entire possible avenues of possible science while mankind is still in its infancy seems unscientific above all else.

I just wish I could share what I have seen and experienced in this hobby of mine as it is sad to see such skepticism. I understand because I likely would not have believed this either. It is sad for you lot that do not believe in telepathy/mass consciousness as you must think death is it for you. Weird.

I also realize my views are not shared by many here, but it is not only me that thinks this way. My stances are endorsed by others.

I have seen some banned for constantly discussing consciousness in physics, but science is science. I feel eventually consciousness will/must be recognized in physics, but I will not hold my breath.

I did not think this would stay in physics this long.

 

Indeed. Hypotheses about the paranormal are not part of physics, and have yet to form part of ANY recognised discipline of science.

That is not to say that testable hypotheses, and observations aimed at verifying them, would be unscientific, it is just that no body of theory or reproduced observation has been accumulated.

Wilkins was knighted in or around 1928 by the way, so this would have been done by the king, not the queen.

 

Nor is it scientific, nor rational.
Follow the evidence with rational interpretation; do not insist upon certain interpretations.

Would you advocate funding the search for an actual Celestial Teapot?
As and when theories of telepathy are submitted, they can be tested and peer reviewed.
This has always been the case.

You merely have to post your evidence and allow your falsifiable theories to be peer reviewed.

But not all science is Physics.

It is quite valid for consciousness to be discussed in Physics forum, IF the context is of a physics nature. After all, even if consciousness is deemed to be the result of evolution, there must be some physics behind what we consider consciousness to be - the physics that gives rise to it.

But the context of any theory is rather important to where it is best discussed.

 

Oh I did, when you pretended that you wanted to talk about the Science article. I even added a link about the holographic universe.

No, the problem is that I foolishly thought that you would realize that telepathy, cosmic consciousness and God have absolultely nothing to do with the holographic universe.

Of course it won't. What do you expect when you ignore the scientific aspects of the holographic universe and instead you talk about silly make believe garbage instead.:shrug:

 

@ Sarkus,

So what proof would anybody have that they received a telepathic message? In this thread I have given examples of two highly respected individuals.

Sir (Canadian Knighted by King) Hubert Wilkins is the well known aviator and Arctic and Antarctic explorer who has taken part in ten Polar expeditions, commanding six of them; he holds the Military Cross of the British Empire and has been honored by leading scientific societies throughout the world. Mr. Harold M. Sherman is a successful author and scenario writer, now living at Hollywood.

Their telepathic experiences were registered with numerous third parties prior to any radio contact which was not so simple back then, and was documented by many reputable persons including the Mayor of New York at the time.

Not that you will ever be enlightened enough to follow this subject further but I have that book in my library. The same cover/edition as was shown in the video (in this thread).

So I have shown "EVIDENCE". Is that acceptable for you? No, of course it is not.

I have said in a dozen threads that no experiment that uses Humans as a measuring device could ever be proven. Until someone can measure telepathy then you folks unwilling to try these things yourselves will be stuck in your sad delusions.

So when you say,

it does not make much sense. Maybe in 25 years I will be able to update this with proof, but your comment is a bit ridiculous.

@ Origin,
I had said,

you responded,

Can you see any idiocy in your statement.

Let me put it this way. I said I did not think this thread would still be here, and you are telling me it isn't. Yet it is.

I agree it will be moved as I said in OP, but your statement is just stupid. I cannot make sense of it.