Causality and creation of the universe

no whats impossible is for something to be born from nothing without a cause. your saying non existence can just for the sheer hell of it without any reason atall just turn into existence. thats illogical,

cause and effect within an infinite circle is possible, an everlasting set of cause and effect wich had no start. we as mortal humans have trouble grasping the idea of true infinity. but thats only because we think of things in temporary terms as wisdom S stated.

peace.

 

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I think the idea is that God existed forever and the universe was made by God at some point in His "time".....

It must have taken forever for Him to devise us, that's for sure...

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he knows this is the belief anyway, i dont think he was actualy expecting an answer that he would take seriously anyway.

peace.

 

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There can't be a "cause" for Anything because if there is then that "cause" also needs a Fucking-cause unless it's the Only-cause (Nothing, No-Cause).

YOU mortals can't understand MY infinity because you live in time. But I live in this Eternal-Fucking-Moment.

The-Fucking-Truth is that Nothing is created, and at the same time Everything is created, and it doesn't need a cause, but it needs, and it doesn't Matter because it's all a Fucking-Joke.

 

i dont believe in time, i think the universe is infinite and time does not exist,

peace.

 

i don't believe in that Shit either, it's Nothing but thoughts but it's ALSO real be-cause James R (or Whoever) be-lie-ves in time, and he believes in it because it's a Fact proven by Ein-steins Wormholes.

WAR!

 

nowdays facts are subjective.

peace.

 

nothing because likie i said before... god is nothing... just a fantasy

 

It may be hard for your human minds to comprehend, but the universe always has been and always will be, it wasn't created, it always has been, so from my athiest point of view I AM GOD since life is so scarce and spread out in the universe!!

 

So the big bang didn't happen?

 

It may not have been the beginning

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Possibly not, but is there anything other than supposition to to support that idea?

 

JamesR

there is no understanding of exactly how, when and where consciousness developed from matter (plenty of theories no doubt)

there is not even an understanding how, when and where matter can form complex formations without the assistance of consciousness
(plenty of theories no doubt)

(how many millions of years do you think it would take for a room with a box of crayons and a roll of paper to evolve into a crayon picture of a planet without the conscious contribution of a six year old?)

 

no offense - but somehow I think the god mentioned in scripture is a bit more substantial than yourself

 

hence my comment about the problem of consciousness

 

Assume for a moment that "God" did create the universe, that he was the first un-caused creator.

Other than attributing this god with having started everything, why attribute him with any other powers at all --why, as many religions do, attribute him with omnipotence, omnipresence, omnibenevolence, omniscience . Based on the assumption I first stated, is it not just as reasonable to say that this god created the universe and then disappeared forever.

I should also state that I don't agree with my stated assumption. Regarding the "first cause issue", I find it satisfying enough to admit that I really don't know what happended. I mostly hold beliefs on what didn't happen, opposed to holding beliefs on what did happen.

Who knows, maybe our minds are just looking for patterns. All that we know and deal with is temporary. Is it so unreasonable to say that our reasoning and intuition may be flawed?

Maybe cause and effect do not govern everything. From my utterly amateur knowledge of modern physics, don't many interpretations of quantum mechanics call for purely random events? Events without causes?

 

non-sequitor
if you give god the status of eternal, this problem doesn't arise

Other than attributing this god with having started everything, why attribute him with any other powers at all --why, as many religions do, attribute him with omnipotence, omnipresence, omnibenevolence, omniscience . Based on the assumption I first stated, is it not just as reasonable to say that this god created the universe and then disappeared forever.[/QUOTE]
not at all actually

if you examine the contingent relationships between energy and the energetic (like say, electricity and a power house) its obvious that if you take away the cause you also take away the effect

 

That all makes more sense to me than the whole "if God created this, what created God?" thing. Especially paragraph #2.