No scripture or church can tell you the whole truth, not even one. Everything exists because of its counterpart. The only truth is the living truth inside each of us, the inner-most self. In the great work of Nietzsche “Thus spoke Zarathustra”, the last message from Zarathustra to his disciples was: “Be careful with me. I have told you everything I had to say. Now be careful with me. Don´t follow me; forget about me. Let me and go away.” This is the last message from all the great masters. No great master want to turn you into a puppet, because he would be killing you. He would be a Killer. He will help you be yourself. The master means a chance for you, to be yourself. Only the small minds, the narrow minds that pretend to be masters and aren´t, will want to impose over you.
Let me tell you something to meditate about: Saints exists because sinners exist. If there were no sinners, there would be no saints. Like darkness exists because light exists. If you want to explain what is darkness, you would have to use the term light. And if you want to explain light, you would have to use the term darkness. Same happens with about anything, like all the teachers that contradict each other, but they are all right. For example: Osho teaches the "Vigyan Bhairav Tantra", which consist on techniques to achieve enlightment. And Krishnamurti tells you that there is no technique. So they are clearly contradicting themselves, but at the same time they are not. Because "there is no technique" is actually a technique by itself. So for enlightment, there is no common path for all persons, there are paths as people are on this planet. For one person the technique of "there is no technique" may work, because enlightment is simple, it is there, but we cannot see it. But for other person, this "there is no technique" may be a puzzle, because the person may not feel enlightened, so this generates frustration. In the other side, Osho gives us techniques, but he says that the techniques are not for everyone, in the 112 techniques of the "Vigyan Bhairav Tantra", it could happen that only 1 technique is for you, and all the others will only confuse you. They are teaching the same thing. They were both conscious. Another example: Mahavira teaches that to kill any living creatur will affect your karma (this includes insects). And Krishna teaches that killing is not a reality, that you can kill people, but you can never kill a soul, so if you kill someone, you are actually liberating the soul from the punishment of the body. And they are teaching opposite things, but they are both right. Why? Because it is true that you cannot kill a soul, and that a body is only a mental reality. But it is also true that the path towards enlightment may include the precept of "not harming any living creature". The key of everything is acceptance of others; and most importantly, true acceptance of one-self.
This verse echos your own concerns here Seti. He's asking if God is all powerful then how can we do anything but what he's manipuatlated us into? That's the most intresting detail about manipulation. It requires an offer of a choice, to do one thing or another. It's not a remote control preventing us from doing one thing or another. With God knowing our heart condition, sensing our openess or arrogance and willingness to stiff arm reason he then uses it. Arrogance is an easy emotion to control just Anger and Jealousy is. Most emotions in excess and with out control can lead us away from logic. This excerpt reveals the understanding of the scripture I quoted earlier. Like Clay in a potters hands God manipulates the clay. But he could make his power known just by outright destroying but that wouldn't show his ability to bring his purpose to past on the Earth. It would show only power. By manipulation God's servants have the opportunity to witness a manifestation of their faith. The wicked understand the futility of working against him. It's a display...litteraly a demonstration. He doesn't have to make us part of his purpose...he could have created the universe without his son, the angels: he could find a means of dilevering messages to humanity without there help and humans would just sit back and be saved.... But that wouldn't allow us to prove ourselves to him. It gives us the opportunity to do good...just as it also gives us the opportunity to do bad. This is an intresting translating of the verse. It's not wrong but it's also not very clear. Note: 2 Thessalonians 2:9 So we know your scripture is referring to the lawless ones who are turn are being manipulated by Satan. Now observe the slight clarification in this translation: 2 Thessalonians 2: 11-12 So that is why God lets an operation of error go to them, that they may get to believing the lie, (12) in order that they all may be judged because they did not believe the truth but took pleasure in unrighteousness. These people already "took pleasure in unrighteousness." They were wicked. The "operation of error," is understood in verse nine which says... But the lawless one's presence is according to the operation of Satan. God allowed these individuals "pleasure in unrighteousness take them right to the appropriate conclusion. In other words these people got what they deserved. Whether that means swindling money, theivery, murder, rape...All unrighteous behavior eventual does come to a negative end. I wouldn't say the scripture was translated wrong...but if you ask me was the scripture translated for clarity...I'd have to tell you, no. [/QUOTE]
No doubt then you've noticed that the bible is the popular book of all time. It also the best selling book of all time and the most available book of all time. As a result isn't it evident that we all have an equal opportunity to read it and take in life saving knowledge? Then I rebuke anyone saying otherwise. The bible tells us test the inspired expressions....That means for us...The bible iteself. 1 John 4:1 Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired expression, but test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world. Those inspired expression it speaks of...are two fold. Satan has his crew sowing deciet right in among the lies. (Remember the parable of the man sowing fine seed and the bad man coming along and sowing bad seeds among the fine seeds) And God has his people sowing good. It takes a keen eye to tell which is which earily one. But that parable tells us to WAIT. If we weed out bad seed too soon we could uproot the good with it. (That's much like our justice system today. Never take a chance on convicting an innocent man.) The Master in the parabol tell the servants to wait until the harvet. At that time they could easily discern which is the wheat and which is the grain. As a matter of practice we are not only told to test the inspired expression but the undertake one more task... 2 Timothy 1:13 "Keep holding the pattern of healthfull words..." I have always believed that there is often truth in patterns. By the scriptures I have come to learn (above) blind faith is useless to God. Questioning him has happened many times in the scriptures...Lot, Noah, Job. However in one example to another you will find God's responses to being questioned had nothing to do with the question...but in the respect or lack of respect the person approached with.
Awesome. Now we're getting somewhere. I'm glad to hear this. Now, where would you consider the line of justifiable questioning and arrogance/rebellious questioning? If I prayed for something (100% justifiable request) and it doesn't get answered, you better believe I'm going to be firing questions towards Him, some may not even be cordially worded. Example: a dealership says you will get exactly what you ask for. You order a blue car with power everything, brand new, 10 miles on it. The dealer brings you a red demo base model with 2000 miles on it and says that's all we have. Theoretically, you have a car, but it wasn't exactly what you asked for (which is how most answered prayers (the few that actually get answered) turn out). Now, wouldn't you be firing questions at sales people because you didn't get what you asked for? Why is it any different for God? I still have a prayer that I made a few years ago (before I came to this mentality...and is one of the reasons I do have this mentality) that is still unanswered. The way I see it, is if that gets answered, I'll consider recommitting, but not until. Now with that last statement, I bet I will hear from Xians; 'that's an arrogant mentality', 'God doesn't work like that','you have a hate filled heart', you are too prideful' or something of the like. Oh well.
Imagine a world were all of people´s prayers would turn real... Would there be atheists? Would humans still exist? Would the World still exist? In the Bible, it clearly states that whoever ask God for wisdom, it will be given to him/her. But not any prayer for your personal reasons, that is nonsense. Prayer is meant to be for asking God for wisdom and guidance in our paths... Not asking God personal favors, that sounds like some Disney movie.
