I'd jus tlike to point out that the medieval Catholic church didnt have much trouble with the earth being round, only with the idea that it wasnt the centre of the universe.
What evidence do you have that this has anything to do with atheism or- for that matter- science of any kind? What evidence do you have that all or any of these allegedly connected factors are connected or even exist? Read Szasz: what makes you think medicine in general and psychiatry in particular historically have much to with science? One of Szasz's points, if I remember rightly, is that people should take responsibility for their actions and should always be punished for their actions, whether they are mad or not. I would think you would take fairly drastic action if i were to behave in a way that challenged your tenets in a way deemed unacceptable by your belief-system: activity such as hitting you repeatedly over the head with alarge piece of wood with nails through the end. What does your unsubstantiated claim for the Deep Significance of Myth which, in some way, is Meaningful in a way that mere superficial truth have to do with atheism or science? Which Deep Significant Myths do atheists take literally? In my experience atheists take that sort of balderdash frivolously. What is the Deep Mythical Significancce of science lying under the statement and formulae which just say "that's the way thing work put down numerically"? Thersites: could you show some examples of "REAL direct spirituality", and show how the world they live in differs from "this superficial very violent world" giving statistics for comparative peacefullness? which can you give you a better description of "Nature/the universe Now" and interacts more closely with it: a mathematician, a biologist, an astronomer or one of your spiritual interrelationists? The latter are far more likely to divide it up into your wierd set of categories- in fact, like you, they may arbitrarily insert atheists and scientists into the bad/hell/death/wicked and evil capitalist categories. in fact, shouldn't you be exploring your spiritual interelation with them rather than arrogantly dismissing them? I'm not sure whether you ought to stop taking the tablets or increase the dose. What has your deep exploration ever revealed that could be communicated to another human being?
Thersites.......i am not trying to demonze scientists. what i am trying to commincate is that positivist science is limited. it pretends that the only criteria for understand is via measurement. When i talk about direct spirituality, i'm meaning actual experience. deep ecstatic experience, that can be full of meaning, and deeper your sense of yourself. yo telling me to keep taking the 'tablets' is the EXACT example of reponse of the atheistic mindSET which embraces positivist science, which becomes the fundamental 'religion', and is dangerous, just the same as fundamental religion can be. you seek to pathalogize my thoughts and experiences i talk about with you, just as the fundamental religionist would demonize what i am speaking about
well, ive never seen/experienced one personally, either. but, i will believe that they exist until given total, abslute, undeniable proff that they dont. same thing about Nessie, BigFoot, Yeti, Kraken, Leviathan, and Mokole Mbembe.
Let's see: Love George W. Bush because he is God. Love Britney Spears because she is God. Love Terri Schiavo because she is God. Love Adolf Hitler because he is God. Love Wes Morris because he is God. Love Water because she is God. ... Luh-vely.
why do humans have a constant want to know "how does thing work" or "how does this do that"? Why?!! Why do we strive to know things that we don't NEED to know?!!?
No. What science says is that the only way criteria for scoentific understanding is measurement. What is said scientifically can be understood exactly by other people; what is said "spiritually" may mean nothing or something completely different to other people and we will never know. Take a look at Edward Wilson's autobiography: it was precisely his interest in nature, in animals and the way they work and live that made him a biologist. Newton said he was like a child playing with shells on a sea-shore- but he knew the sea was there. This seems rather an egotistical- as well as vague- definition of "knowledge" and "meaning". I also suggested that you might stop taking the tablets. This is an example of experimental science techniques at work. Will your perceptions alter if you vary the dosage or change the kind of tablets you are taking? You demand that we accept a unique "deep ecstatic experience ...full of [undefined] meaning", as more significant than something with exact meaning that can be precisely communicated to other people. I'm soorry, but i don't.
Like the Holy Grail, the quest is the important thing. Unlike the Quest for the Grail, the quest for objective reality finds some very interesting stuff along the way. "And what were they going to do with the grail when they found it, Mr Rossetti?"
"Love Wes Morris because he is God." You're finally coming around. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Hey one point about what you said to crunchy is not that o.b.j.e.c.t.i.v.e. r.e.a.l.i.t.y. can be known, but that in order to understand... it must be sought. No?
it is a continuum. really there is nothing WRONG with scientific endeavour, as i am saying. but where it DOEs go wrong is when it becomes cut off from sensual experience. For different ways of exploring NaTURE, reality, and being shiiit, your SO left braiiin
I could be difficult and ask you to support why the quest is the important thing. But I won't. If the important thing is the quest, then finding the grail -- and thus ending the quest -- would rob the seekers of their purpose. Then what? Ah, secret societies.
Hey! I was the original member of the Wes is all, all is Wes movement!! ! *griiiinssss* Heaven forbid it should be found and it won't be what we hoped it would be!
