Antifa, BLM and SJWs vs White Nationalist, Battle of Charlottesville

Discussion in 'Politics' started by ElectricFetus, Aug 12, 2017.

  1. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    Yeh, more
    The Mercers do have an agenda.

    as/re the above timeline and recent news that Bannon had tendered his resignation on August 7.
    (wild guess)It only seems an unreasoned spur of the moment action to those who lack introspection.

    ...............................
    (but, then again, I could be wrong)
     
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  3. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    So far, it has involved getting rid mostly of Republicans who did get on the Trump train, as needed - but that was the campaign and consolidation phase. Hmmm.

    Bringing Bannon back outside to lean on Congress, then? Plausible. But I doubt they care about the Trump train.
     
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  5. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    g'morning

    OOPS
    We seem to have left the sphere of the op of this thread. mea culpa
    Perhaps, a mod could take posts 119,120,121,122, and this 123 and start a new/different thread(the libertarian-populist agenda?)?

    Meanwhile:
    If you see the Mercers as anti-corrupt washington establishment inbred political families representing themselves at the expense of the american people, with a sprinkling of nationalism , then the Mercers and Trump train are already headed in the same direction.
    I think that they think of themselves as libertarian populists, and would like to see more of that ideology in congress.

    I doubt that the consolidation phase is over yet.

    Washington/congress seems to present as a grouping of wild dogs intent on fighting each other rather than working as a pack going after (the) big game. Many presidents have tried to tame those wild dogs and turn them into an effective hunting pack. And seem to have largely failed if success(libertarian perspective) were defined as doing something for the greater good which would be excepting military adventurism and abrogating our rights and freedoms.

    I think it best if I stop rambling and amble down to the woodshop and continue cutting the caps for the wainscoting.
     
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  7. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Last edited: Aug 19, 2017
  8. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    This is the "bothsides" narrative. It's bullshit. You have one specific Party, as the central problem.
    They are supposed to be guard dogs, not hunting dogs.
    Not because of Trump. He has no ideology, or aversion to corruption.
    And why would anyone see the Mercers as "anti-corrupt"? Or as opposed to the inbred Washington political families?
    I doubt even they are crazy enough to see themselves as populists, and their "libertarianism" is rich people's fantasy of life without taxes and restrictions. They are after tax cuts and corporate deregulation, not drug and abortion legality, not prison and police and court reform.
     
  9. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    From the blogging world, with some links etc:
    http://www.mahablog.com/2017/08/20/myths-and-realities-of-political-violence/

    Key point: the violent rightwing organizations are tolerated, sometimes even supported, by American government at all levels. Antifa - the go-to violent organization of the "left", basically because there aren't any others of any consequence - is not only fringe and tiny compared with any of the major violent rightwing organizations, it is much more restricted in its threats and behaviors, in what it can get away with. Imagine open carry of assault rifles by violent lefties in DC, or a Leftwing equivalent of Cliven Bundy and his crowd.
     
  10. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Here is a perspective from a independent journalist who was there:

     
  11. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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  12. Kittamaru Now nearly 40 pounds lighter. Staff Member

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  13. geordief Registered Senior Member

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    Because they are small ,unrepresentative groups that should not inspire fear but rather loathing?

    If anything do they make the anti Trump case more forcefully and graphically?

    If it was not so clearly wrong one would be tempted to think they were being used as stooges.
     
  14. Kittamaru Now nearly 40 pounds lighter. Staff Member

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    I would contend that, at one time, the anti-semetic wave the Nazi's rode to power was a "small, unrepresentative group" that simply happened into a charismatic speaker and a problem they could pin on a scapegoat (the Jews). Now, we have a dumpster fire (Trump) and a problem (economic hardship/illegal immigration/take your pick) being pinned on a scapegoat (illegal aliens/minorities/et al)
     
  15. geordief Registered Senior Member

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    Yes I think we all see the similarities (and after all has human nature changed so much) but it is surely obvious that this is a very new scenario (where the admonitions to be vigilant and for good men to not do nothing remain in place)and extremely different from Germany after the first world war.

    I am personally more worried about what comes after Trump as his incompetence is plain to see. This is also what those neo Nazi groups are also looking to I have noticed.

    Quite apart from any danger from that quarter I feel that American Democracy is too important to allow to wither on the vine( but that may be its fate as all things have their natural evolution and so it will change somehow ,just for the better I hope)
     
  16. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    I don't know what you define as the high road, but my ancestors left, and had a very distinguished history of leaving thing before they got bad.

    For what is happening now here in the USA now, violence is not and option for the left. The white nationalist have dream for decades of a race war, they are built of stores of guns for a race war, and now some of the left are trying to give them what they want.

    All we can do is try to elect back democrats, rally the left to vote, and provide candidates with actual progressive vision, rather then moderate centrists. Anything else would rally the right and bring about a true fascist take over. The republicans are openly fracturing over those that are a like "what we fought the nazis didn't we, this is bad!" and those that are "Nazis we right it is time displacing the non-whites!". If we on the left can stay peaceful we can attack while the right are eating themselves.
     
  17. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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  18. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    OK
    So: AntiFa may not actually be a terrorist organization(despite all evidence) but they do seem to attract, and give licence to, a criminal element who are terrorist wannabes(and/or your run of the mill thugs, vandals, arsonist, and petty thieves).

    Those of us who are reasonably intelligent and fairly well educated need to stop the divisiveness-------------it ain't a game with any winners, and gives licence to those who are mentally challenged.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2017
  19. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Once again antifa is not the biggest problem here, antifa is literally a reactionary counter-movement to the white nationalist, if the white nationalist were to go back to meme posting and not elect huckster morons for president, antifa would shrivel up and go away. Unfortunately now the two feed of each other existence, so as antifa grows it grows white nationalist, none the less we all know the white nationalist will be murdering people soon enough as their goals require ethnic cleansing. The White Nationalist have a massive collection of guns and the antifa has what, bike locks in a bag? Again this is like comparing cancer and a hang nail. The only reason I give the left grief is because antifa and violence only empowers the right, whose goals are the utter destruction of civilization and order to replace it with their Reich.



     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2017
  20. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    This is not a new scenario, in the US. Not at all. Even the recent manifestation of the problem, the Trump voter etc, has been obvious and central and consolidating power overtly since 1980.
    They are large enough to have been the key base of support in the election of the current US government - Congress and President both.

    They have far more "representation" in US government (and society, btw) than anyone on the left.

    And so forth.

    This is not new. That's kind of important.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2017
  21. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    Because what worked for Clinton and Sanders will work for us as well?

    There is no such "we".
    And holding "the left" accountable for how Fox and Breitbart and their media minions frame the doings of every college kid, black street thug, and agent provocateur, in the US strikes you as a reasonable approach.
     
  22. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    Have you been to their website? It's strategic mayhem, they have a purpose.
     
  23. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    Which brings us to the source of the "divisiveness" - as represented politically by the Republican Party entire and a large fraction of the others, intellectually by at least 60% of the punditry and output of every major news source (and 100% of a plurality of them), economically by an effectively controlling fraction of the corporate executive management and capitalist investing class, socially by at least a third of the adult population and a majority of the socially organized (church membership, etc) adults.
     

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