Anti - Aging

Discussion in 'Human Science' started by kmguru, Mar 11, 2002.

  1. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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    * Very few people die from starvation compared to those who die from aging related diseases. I think your priorities are mixed up.*

    No, my priorities are not mixed up, a lot of humans are dying from starvation. Never heard of Africa??

    Further, I have been working in a nursing home, as a volunteer. Don't work there any more. Perhaps the good word should have been worked. My English is sometimes not entirely good, my apologies.

    And yes, I know there is a Earth-bound body and a Cosmic body. Call it belief if you want to. I don't like the word 'belief', too much of a religion.

    I'll go with the program. Talk to you later, I really have a bad day today...
     
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  3. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    Banshee,

    You missed my point. I don’t disagree that many people die of starvation, but the number is insignificant when compared with the number of people who die due to aging related disease.

    But starvation is not an issue for science; that is both an economic and political issue. There is plenty of wealth and food around to prevent anyone starving, or at least the means to produce adequate food, so I suggest you take that up in the politics forum.

    To know means to have knowledge and knowledge usually comes by way of evidence – uhh whatever, wrong forum for that. The point is made that you think you have an essence that survives bodily death. It is that perspective that seems to have persuaded you to have an opposition to anti-aging research, would you agree?

    But there are more urgent needs to solve the problem of aging rather than just allowing people to live forever. And again this is both social and economic, but has a scientific solution.

    In many parts of the world, the wealthiest for the moment, although it looks like the rest of the world will follow shortly, the proportion of elderly people is increasing compared to young people. This is creating a problem that will become a major issue in a few years time. It is the younger people who create the wealth, i.e. they are the workers who produce the goods, which are sold, etc, and which generate an active economy. If the number of workers decrease and the number of elderly increase, then where is the wealth going to come from to support the elderly?

    Many elderly may have provided good pensions for themselves, but most do not do that. But the real issue is that as people age they succumb to age related diseases. IOW words as you age your body’s ability to fight off infections decreases rapidly. This puts an increasing burden on the medical services that have to be funded somehow.

    The USA and most countries in Europe that have active welfare schemes know they are facing a crisis in a few years time.

    Up until the mid forties the concept of retirement didn’t really exist. People would work until they died. But modern medicine had made it possible for people to live longer and the average lifespan was creeping into the 50s and 60s. People were living longer and some were saving enough so that they could stop work and live a life of leisure. Most western countries then adopted the concept of retirement and the idea of pensions, mostly state funded.

    This seemed like a good idea and was politically popular. But what age to set for retirement? At that time the average life-span was 63, so a retirement age of 65 was set. The expectation was that not many would live past 63 so pension schemes could be very easily financed.

    Unfortunately science has continued to help people live longer. The average now for males is around 73 and 79 for females. But it isn’t just a few exceptions but the bulk of people.

    The crisis will come in the provision of medical services and the means to finance that.

    One obvious solution might be to make people work longer, perhaps set a retirement expectation at 75 instead of 65, and there are trends that indicate that is starting to happen. But while people are living longer they are also experiencing many more age related diseases that will prevent many of them from working. And unfortunately science is finding ways for people to live longer but not particularly with a good quality of life.

    The solution to both the economic and the quality of life issue is to find ways to prevent the aging process. If people stay effectively young, then they can work longer if they wish, the drain on the medical services will dramatically subside, and the overall quality of life will dramatically improve.

    The next problem will be overpopulation and how to control that. And that I hope will provoke more research into space exploration. There is a massive universe out there and we have not begun to explore it yet. It is time.

    So anti-aging research is vital for economic, and political stability, as well for the quality of life for all humans. I heard a few years ago that the US government spends more on anti-aging research than they do on defense.

    Cris
     
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  5. Bebelina Feminazi Messiah Valued Senior Member

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    To stay young I recommend:
    Yoga
    Postive thinking
    Meditation
    Vegetarian food
    No sunbathing
    No smoking of tobacco
    No drinking of alcohol
    No frowning

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    Drink lots of water
    Good skin care
    Dress in many colours
    Lots of playing
    Laugh as ofthen as you can
    Wear sunglasses
    Soft lighting next to mirrors
    Ignore time
    Have a vivid imagination


    ..it helps for me anyway, without any scientific investigations or evidence whatsoever.

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    Oh, and I almost forgot..always be in love.

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  7. kmguru Staff Member

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  8. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    Bebelina,

    Just a few notes -

    Dress in many colors – does jeans and casual shirts (different color every day) count? I never wear suits and ties.

    Soft lighting next to mirrors – don’t have any mirrors, apart from one in each bathroom. But all my lighting is indirect and soft, even in my office.

    Ignore time – I let Outlook tell me where and when I should be, and I usually don’t wear a watch.

    Good choices and there is tons of evidence to support you.

    Does loving myself count? I have a committed single lifestyle. I.e. I don’t date anymore, much too stressful.

    Cris
     
  9. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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    8,616
    How do you think it comes, that there are more elderly people then young ones? Because everybody is kept alive longer. Artificial or not.

    Besides, my grandmother died on the age of 98 years old and she didn't have an aging disease. She was the happiest and brightest woman I know...

    *To know means to have knowledge and knowledge usually comes by way of evidence – uhh whatever, wrong forum for that. The point is made that you think you have an essence that survives bodily death. It is that perspective that seems to have persuaded you to have an opposition to anti-aging research, would you agree?*

    No, it is the point that people are kept alive longer and longer. Its against all odds.

    Well, if the worlds society from now-a-days askes for anti-aging medicine, then let it be so. More elderly people and lets see where it goes.

    Time is not in my life either. Never had a watch, only during my schooldays, hanging at my book-bag, to see if the class-hour was nearly over. Ever since, I never had a watch. I don't live in time, it is only necessarry if you have an appointment. A necessarry 'evil'...
     
  10. *stRgrL* Kicks ass Valued Senior Member

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    Uh oh, wrinkles

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    Kidding, kidding
     
  11. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    Bebelina,

    But OK if we do all those things how much time will that buy us, a few years, a decade or two? Really not very much. Once the build up of oxidation takes over and telomeres wear out, you’re dead.

    At best it is reckoned that about 120 years, with good quality, is what we can expect from optimum lifestyles and appropriate diets and supplementation. After that we need to solve the real problems that cause cellular defenses to fail and chromosomes to decay.

    We are gradually beginning to understand the mechanisms of aging, although there is still much to be done. It is fully expected by many scientists working in the field that it is only a matter of a short time before we do have effective medical treatments for slowing, stopping, and eventually reversing the aging process.

    The result of course will be that people will simply not age. The only way to die will be by accident, murder, suicide, or a fatal disease for which we have not found a cure.

    From a personal philosophical view I expect that once we achieve the status of having potentially eternal life-spans that life will be viewed as immeasurably more valuable, priceless in fact, and that all means would be taken to protect it. Wars will become unacceptable by orders of magnitude compared to our current views. And religious beliefs will have to be re-examined to assess whether there is any meaning left to them.

    So next post - ‘telomeres’.

    Cris
     
  12. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    9,188
    Telomeres.

    A good article from Scientific American, although there are many others our there –

    http://www.sciam.com/explorations/1998/020298telomere/

    Some short extracts -

    It may not sound as appetizing as aquavit, but telomerase--an enzyme discovered only a decade ago in a single-celled protozoan--may well be the elixir of youth. This chemical acts in immortal cancer cells, sperm and ovum to repair telomeres, the strands of DNA that tie up the ends of chromosomes. And now it seems that activating telomerase in sundry other cells grants them a longer lease on life as well.

    But does lengthening the telomeres actually prolong the life of human cells? Groups from Southwestern Medical Center and Geron proved just that in the recent Science article. By introducing the hTRT gene, they caused three different kinds of cells--retinal pigment epithelial cells, foreskin fibroblasts and vascular endothelial cells--to resume telomerase activity.

    In all three cell lines, the telomerase knit new DNA onto the ends of chromosomes, artificially elongating the telomeres. And all three lines lived much longer than usual. Whereas unaltered cells in the study reached senescence after a fixed number of divisions, the hTRT-positive cultures had seen 20 population doublings beyond that point at the time the report was published--and they were still going strong. "We have found that cellular aging can be bypassed," said Jerry Shay, who headed the Southwestern Medical Center team with Woodring Wright.

    Have fun.
    Cris
     
  13. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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    I humbly bow my head and leave the thread quitely...

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  14. kmguru Staff Member

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    Just got an email to buy aeon which allegedly contains Somatotropin. I did not think you can buy HGH without prescription. And even then, there is any spray delivery or patch system that I can find.
     
  15. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    9,188
    Banshee,

    I think you promised something similar earlier in the thread, but you came back.

    So I suspect you'll be back. You are simply much too curious. And really deep down you know I'm right in everthing I say, right? And you long for my next revelations of wisdom, right?

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    Cris

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  16. kmguru Staff Member

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    Cris,

    It looks like just you and me on this topic. Rest are too young to care...
     
  17. Rick Valued Senior Member

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    Kmguru,
    are you serious?

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    you are a Sanatan Dharma practising person right?i woudnt accept that from you at least...are you afraid of dying?i am sure you are not.(very positive about this!)...

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    bye!
     
  18. kmguru Staff Member

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    Hi zion,

    Out of all the people, you should know that yoga and meditation is part of Sanatana Dharma (SD). Why? to keep body and mind healthy untill your time to meet the maker. The entire Ayurvedic medicine has tons of stuff that reduces age related illness or problems.

    Tradition says that yogis lived twice the age of normal people. So where is the conflict? Why suffer because of stupidity? I also practice Gyana Yoga (Yoga of Knowledge). What is knowlege? It is the ability to utilize the data for the benefit of the body, mind and spirit....you get the idea....
     
  19. Rick Valued Senior Member

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    3,336
    Err...yeah...


    Got your point.



    bye!
     
  20. Bebelina Feminazi Messiah Valued Senior Member

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    Well, it would definitely be interesting to see what happened with humanity if we could become physically immortal. So keep working on it, you scientists.

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    But right now, it feels like an unnecessary luxury when there is so much else to straighten out, people are starving to death and killing eachother mostly beacuse of greed, is there no cure for that instead?
     
  21. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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    Cris*And really deep down you know I'm right in everthing I say, right? And you long for my next revelations of wisdom, right?*

    Yeah...Right!

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    Originally posted by Bebelina
    *But right now, it feels like an unnecessary luxury when there is so much else to straighten out, people are starving to death and killing eachother mostly beacuse of greed, is there no cure for that instead?*

    Now I am curious for your answer on this...

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  22. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    Banshee, Bebelina,

    How is starvation and greed connected to anti-aging research?

    I agree that starvation and greed are not admirable aspects of life, but what is your point in bringing up the subject here?

    Cris
     
  23. Counterbalance Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    373
    Why should research into anti-aging be sacrificed because part of the world has not solved the problem of feeding/supporting its citizens? Or for that matter, when has the greed of some members of mankind been an adequate reason to abandon or ignore man’s (other) potentials to improve--or prolong--his existence? Those who are not interested in anti-aging are free to age as naturally as they like. No one is forcing them to live longer.

    Because some people feel a concern, or even a responsibility, for the general welfare of others, does that mean that all of mankind should share the same level of concern? The reality is that we don’t all share the same levels of concern or interest, and we’re never going to. Anti-aging research is not standing in the way of people being fed, and has nothing to do with people being murdered.

    Who has the right to tell me how to spend my own money? Who has the right to tell me what should be important to me?

    The topic is anti-aging. It would be nice if some real discussion were allowed to happen.

    ~~~

    Counterbalance
     

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