Anti - Aging

Discussion in 'Human Science' started by kmguru, Mar 11, 2002.

  1. kmguru Staff Member

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    Cris suggested a new thread on Anti-Aging. So here it is. Let us know the stuff that will keep you young and healthy for a long time. Because there are volumes of stuff and books out there, let us distill them to a few top ones. I will post my input later.
     
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  3. *stRgrL* Kicks ass Valued Senior Member

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    Yoga and Pilates!!! A must. Anyone who hasnt tried it, should. Also, I think keeping an open mind also helps. I ride around with my grandma and she will listen to my music and talk about things most grandmas wont talk about, and she still looks and acts really young. Also, she quit drinking and smoking along time ago. (Ultimate agers)

    Groove on
     
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  5. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    Do you mean Joseph Pilates?

    I had never heard of Pilates before your reference. Looks like a set of physical exercises.

    What is so special about Piates?

    Cris
     
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  7. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    One claim I have seen many times for anti-aging is to follow calorie restricted diets.

    Essentially you feel hungry all the time and only consume just above a bare minimum to survive.

    On mice, experiments show significant increases in life-spans - around 40% I believe. They are simply fed highly nutricious food but very low in calories. The mice seem to be full of energy right into old age. They also seem to be more tolerant of infections.

    However, I am really not eager to feel hungry all the time.

    So far this seems to be the best natural method for anti-aging that I have seen.

    Cris
     
  8. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    KM,

    This thread is probably in the wrong forum, I think biology might be a better location.

    Do you agree?

    Cris
     
  9. *stRgrL* Kicks ass Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, I do. Pilates is so "in" right now, everyones doing it. Theres videos, books, all sort of stuff. Anyhoo, I feel great while and after doing them. Also, have you seen what he looked like at 80? Alot better than most at 30. He combines yoga with strength training. Theres other stuff involved that I dont know about, so I cant talk to much on it.


    Groove on
     
  10. kmguru Staff Member

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    Cris

    This is as good a place as Biology, since we will talk about psychology, sociology, cognitive science, emotions and biochemistry in this topic. As in Yoga, meditation, stress management - nature vs nurture....

    This may be the best useful topic in the entire forum. Some of the items one should check out is Arginine synthesis, www.lef.org, Dr. Andrew Weils website, Deepak Chopra, Glucose crosslinks, Metformin, HGH etc...

    Keep them coming....
     
  11. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    km,

    Ok let's see how it goes.

    My past interests were with the Geron corporation and their finding on telomeres, that is where I think we are likely to see some real breakthroughs. But that is really in the area of genetics and biology.

    When I first came across Geron it was being run by Dr Adam West, who has since moved on and is now one of the leading scientists in human stem cell research (private sector). he was at the center of the recent controversy when his group cloned the first human stem cells.

    We have a lot to cover.

    Cris
     
  12. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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    Anti-aging? Calories? Cloned human stem cells? What a crap!

    I agree on Yoga. As well the exercises as the meditation technique. It keeps you young, body and mind. So nothing artificial necessarry.

    Some people grow old because they worry too much and forget to live. It is the way you live your life and what you put into your body to keep it healthy and young.

    Freedom is given to the young of mind! Not genetically engineered or cloned cells.

    Well, have your fun with scientifical youth. I am out of this nonsense.

    Nature people, nature!

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  13. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    Oh Banshee, what are we going to do with you? You are so mixed up and confused.

    Aging is a disease to be cured like any other. Try this link, but there are many. Science does view aging as a disease. http://www.drlam.com/WhatIsAging.cfm

    You it appears like so many others have come to accept aging and the degenerative diseases that are associated with it as natural and acceptable. Well I have news for you, you’ve been brainwashed into thinking that because we haven’t had the means to fight it until now.

    And for you to then call it crap when we try to discuss one of the, and probably the most important medical research in the history of mankind, is irresponsible, and shows significant ignorance on your part. Sorry for the lecture, but I do become very angry when people have such apathy towards wanting to fight against such unnecessary suffering.

    Planetary Death Rate
    (courtesy of the US Census Bureau)
    1.8 humans per second
    106 humans per minute
    6,360 humans per hour
    152,640 humans per day
    55,713,600 humans per year

    It's time we started fighting back.

    Nonsense, your life depends on so-called artificial aids. Ever taken a pain-killer, ever had an anesthetic, would you refuse a replacement heart if yours stopped, how about replacement limbs if yours were lost in an accident, etc, etc. Are you going to refuse all the help that science offers because of some foolish new-age notion that only nature is necessary?

    True, and many others have genetic disorders that massively shorten their lives unfairly. Shouldn’t they have the same chance as everyone else?

    Sorry but that is BS.

    That is more BS. There is nothing special about nature. It is largely a random and chaotic mechanism. It causes cellular degradation and eventually causes death. Nature is something to fight against and not to encourage.

    Life is the most precious thing we have. I intend to fight to keep mine whatever the cost, because if I lose it then I will cease to exist and that is just not acceptable.

    Laugh if you like, and then die like the rest. But if you give any value to life then you too should want to know how to increase it, make it more endurable, and increase its quality.

    Cris
     
  14. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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    *Aging is a disease to be cured like any other. Science does view aging as a disease.*

    Now that is BS! Aging comes with life! Science is made up by humans. They better spend their time by helping the humans who die of starvation!

    *And for you to then call it crap when we try to discuss one of the, and probably the most important medical research in the history of mankind, is irresponsible, and shows significant ignorance on your part. Sorry for the lecture, but I do become very angry when people have such apathy towards wanting to fight against such unnecessary suffering.*

    I don't have apathy towards fighting against unecessarry suffering! You don't know me very well Cris, so who are you to judge me???!!!

    The most important medical research in history.

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    Yeah, right! Forget it! BS! Ignorance on my part? Think again please! What about all the humans who die because they don't have access to these scientific inventions? I stay with my statement. Aging is a natural process of life. What do you think? Everybody lives on forever? You want to play the part of the creating forces which are responsible for us, which gave us life.

    *Ever taken a pain-killer, ever had an anesthetic, would you refuse a replacement heart if yours stopped, how about replacement limbs if yours were lost in an accident, etc, etc. Are you going to refuse all the help that science offers because of some foolish new-age notion that only nature is necessary?*

    Yes! I've had anesthetic and I am dependable on pain killers. I hate it! Yes, I would refuse a replacement of my heart, if mine is not good any more. Without hesitation too! Don't you know the heart is personel, you change, carrying the heart of someone else. Never heard about that? An artificial heart is totally out of the question, I am not a robot, or an artificial half-human. No! I don't want artificial limbs, for the same reason.

    I am not a fool and not new-age thinking!! I have always been this way. From child on!! I sam sorry to disappoint you.

    *...and many others have genetic disorders that massively shorten their lives unfairly. Shouldn’t they have the same chance as everyone else?*

    How you think these genetic disorders exist and even increase now-a-days?? I'll let you figure that one out for yourself! Damn, what the hell do you think?

    *There is nothing special about nature. It is largely a random and chaotic mechanism. It causes cellular degradation and eventually causes death. Nature is something to fight against and not to encourage.*

    Nothing special about Nature??? Now I am starting to think you are a fool! Nature is something to fight against? Oh Cris, you're as lost as all the others. Where is your Inner Sense, your Intuition, given to you by Nature. Don't you see? The human race is fighting itself and you don't even realise it. Tragic...

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    *Life is the most precious thing we have. I intend to fight to keep mine whatever the cost, because if I lose it then I will cease to exist and that is just not acceptable.*

    You don't lose life! Your Earth-bound body dies, not you. You will come back to live another life-time. Cease to exist? You are confused here, you lost contact with Nature and the Cosmos. Not acceptable? It is part of life that your body dies. It is not a big thing you know, it is Nature, Cosmos, Life!

    *Laugh if you like, and then die like the rest. But if you give any value to life then you too should want to know how to increase it, make it more endurable, and increase its quality.*

    Laugh??!! Nothing to laugh about this here! I do give value to life, by living it the best way I can. Trying to understand others and help them if necessarry. Be true to Nature at all costs. And to life. I increase its quality by giving value to other humans and their needs and loneliness. Don't need material well being, do need life and love. Fight my way through darker days and help the ones who need it. I give love and live my life as valueable as possible. When I die, it is because it is my time. I will be back, as always...

    Never the less, I do like you Cris. You are a clever person and I do have much respect for you. Hope we don't going to argue about this. I just live my life in another way, it has never failt me, my way of living. I have gained a lot. No New-Age, please, understand that well. I have nothing to do with New-Age!
     
  15. kmguru Staff Member

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    11,757
    Let us stick to the science, technology and medicine please...

    I have been to nursing homes. We have two of them near by. It really saddens me to see those people suffer. The doctors call them age related disease. The major portion of your life, you contribute to your society, family and friends, and then old age hits you and you are in a nursing home waiting to die while suffering to the max. That is natural? How many animals you see in nature that move to old folks (animals) shelter and wait years to die?

    Banshee, I recommend you visit a few nursing homes and report to us, what you see. Then you will understand where we are going with this thread. Thanks.
     
  16. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    Banshee,

    Banshee, actually I do have a lot of respect for you as well, based on many of your other posts. But we do have some major philosophical differences, and I was aware of that. Knowing that, I was being deliberately confrontational with my post.

    Nature is both our ally and our enemy. If we do nothing it will kill us, if we work with it and understand it, it can help us.

    But death due to aging is not a natural process. Aging is the result of the breakdown of natural processes. And not all life-forms age. Bacteria for example has no aging process. Theoretically the very earliest bacteria from millions of years ago could still be alive if they have managed to find food. Some cacti also do not age, as do some trees.

    But our main difference is a philosophical belief in an afterlife. You believe you will survive death through a supernatural process and I don’t believe any such thing.

    But really our long-term outlook is identical. We both want to live forever. You hope you will achieve it that through an afterlife and I expect to achieve it through science. Our philosophical views have determined how we approach how we live and our eventual future.

    However, if you are wrong, then you will cease to exist when you die. If I am wrong, then I will live in an afterlife. But if I am right and there is no afterlife then I fully expect science to solve the problem in my lifetime, and if not then I am scheduled for cryogenic suspension. Either way I believe I stand a good chance of survival whatever happens. You on the other hand are pinning all your hopes on a supernatural realm that no one has yet show can or does exist.

    I believe your attitudes, which I think are unfortunately typical of many, represent a lazy and fatalistic outlook, a feeling of helplessness that it is not possible to avoid death. I think that view is tragic. I have been watching anti-aging research for the past 20 years and there are some remarkable breakthroughs occurring right now. It seems it is inevitable that human life-spans will be increased significantly to ages of 300 plus and the treatments should be available within the next 15 years. Beyond that it seems most likely that such treatments will be further refined resulting in life-spans that are open-ended.

    I will post the links and discuss such research in this and other related threads.

    Sorry about the new-age reference, I was somewhat winding you up.

    I lost my sister to cancer when she was 55 and I lost my brother to polio when he was 7, and my father to aging with years of suffering when he was 92. Death is the next frontier of the human race, and it is within our grasp to solve very shortly.

    I feel truly sorry for you if you are content to accept death. I see no reason to believe there is anything such as an afterlife and I do see much that suggests that no such thing exists. I’m simply not prepared to sit around and wait to find out.

    Take care
    Cris
     
  17. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    km,

    Yes OK, although the acceptance of anti-aging research and the philosophical issues that will result if science does solve these issues, will have important repercussions. Both the science and the philosophy will need to go hand-in-hand on this.

    Issues of population growth, for example, will have dramatic effects on the economic and political outlooks for the whole planet. This is a case where scienctists must be aware of the implications of their reseach.

    However, in the meantime let's concentrate on what is actually possible, and the short term outlook.

    Cris
     
  18. kmguru Staff Member

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    11,757
    OK, first the disclaimer: anything I express here should imply that it is my opinion based on my own observation in human science and my own research. So, any statement I make should not be confused with the absolute truth and hence please no debate over it. The words implied here are 'should be', 'may be','could be' IMHO, and such....

    Health Science is a hobby of mine. Many years ago, I was admitted to do a MD/PhD program. My interest was to do research in neuroscience. Lack of money prevented me from my objective. Anyway, I have done extensive research in Ayurvedic, homeopathic, and standard western medicine etc.

    Now, I think, Cancer is the result of our environment, both internal and external. A good friend of ours died from liver cancer at age of 38. She was perfectly healthy mormon, no drinking, no smoking, easy going person. The only differential between her lifestyle and ours was: She handled herbicide and pesticide on a regular basis since she loved gardening. She also did a lot of ceramic art and loved to eat rare meat and acidic foods.

    Based on my conversations with a premier breast cancer specialist at University of Utah medical Center, I learned that most cancers have a very strong co-relation with prolonged stress in one's life. And that, 85% of the disease is caused by long term stress.
     
  19. wet1 Wanderer Registered Senior Member

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    8,616
    For your information, I have been working in a nursing home. I know very well what happens to humans who are suffering from an aging disease. There are treatments for that and they get better and better. Who do you think I am? Some idiot who knows nothing from life and how humans live...

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    Further more, I don't believe in an after life, I know there will be a new life, here on Earth. Another life-time. There were life-times before this one.

    Why do you want to stick to the science, technology and medicine? In other words, I cannot post here? Why not?? Because I think it is ridiculous scientists invent an anti-aging pill in stead of inventing a program to save humans from starvation?

    Ah, well, I see how you do that. Poor humans who suffer from an aging disease, no poor humans who die of starvation...

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  20. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    Banshee,

    If that were true, wouldn’t they then live forever?

    But you do believe in some form of essence that represents your soul or spirit, or something that represents an eternal you. Is that correct? Whatever terminology we choose you believe that the death of the body does not mean that ‘you’ die, is that fair?

    Because this is a science forum.

    I’d like you to post here, but with the constraint and acceptance that the object is to primarily discuss science, regardless of whether the particular science should be done or not.

    Why? Very few people die from starvation compared to those who die from aging related diseases. I think your priorities are mixed up.

    Cris
     
  21. kmguru Staff Member

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    11,757
    Banshee:

    If you work in a nursing home, you should be the perfect person to discuss life and what is being done to alleviate their sufferings. We could learn from that a lot - instead of getting your thong up a knot.

    Get with the program, lady...
     
  22. Jez Optimist Registered Senior Member

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    I would say that if you want to live forever you should come up with an invention that keeps the cromosoms from becoming smaller for each time the cell duplicates themselves... like it works on a cancer sell... but I do not think that It would be a good idea to have eternal life because it would stop the idea of natural selection... and evolution would stop...

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    Sorry for my bad english...

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  23. kmguru Staff Member

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    You are talking about telomeres and there are chemicals that inhibit and there are that let it get shorter as in cancer patients...thanks.
     

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