America is becoming more secular

Discussion in 'Religion' started by timojin, Oct 4, 2017.

  1. Gawdzilla Sama Registered Member

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    Nature and your imaginary friend are too entirely different things.
     
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  3. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Let me start this way: Church going does not mean much, If you don't follow or intent to follow the teaching of Jesus . The teaching is to help us on how to get alone with our fellow man.
    1 ) The mass murder we have is mainly in areas of high density population. Canada and UK does not have the crazy law that we have ( 2nd amendment the right to bear arms )
    2 ) I would separate murder from mass murder , a) emotional reaction , b ) premeditated reaction in the case of USA many murders are emotional reaction in a particular segment of the population . ( I live in a suburb for over 30 years , there have not been any murder in our area. )
    So please let be a little more careful in using statistics.
    In regard to your last paragraph : Sorry I picked up one of them.
     
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  5. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    How do you see it ?
     
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  7. Gawdzilla Sama Registered Member

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    Sorry, I misread your post. Working with one eye and oxycontin right now.
     
  8. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    So it doesn't matter if the country was a theocracy (in opposition to the Constitution), it only matters if you accept that murder is wrong. So you are saying that if people believed murder was wrong, they wouldn't murder. So I have two responses, one is that people murder even when they know it's wrong (Jim Jones's cult, abortion clinic bombers, lynchings), secondly that there are plenty of secular reasons not to murder.
     
  9. gmilam Valued Senior Member

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    It would be just as easy to say how much worse things have gotten since they put the phrase "under God" into the Pledge of Allegiance.
     
  10. Gawdzilla Sama Registered Member

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    Religion hijacked things like morals because they're intangibles and don't cost anything to "produce". They sell an intangible product, "salvation" that has not passed any peer-reviewed trials and is completely unfalsifiable. If they weren't a religion they'd be done for being scam artists.
     
  11. river Valued Senior Member

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    US being more secular is

    Good.

    To get away from abrahamic religions is a Good thing .
     
  12. Gawdzilla Sama Registered Member

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    You're obviously unaware of the number of Buddhist mass shootings we've had in the US.

    In fact, so am I.
     
  13. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    Religion is the problem. Faith is the problem. Buddhism is not the "good" religion.
     
  14. Gawdzilla Sama Registered Member

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    Detection of sarcasm, failure of, is a problem.
     
  15. geordief Registered Senior Member

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    You should make your sarcasm clearer

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    .
     
  16. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah, that wasn't clear at all.
     
  17. Gawdzilla Sama Registered Member

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    Picturing Buddhists as violent people didn't need smileys.
     
  18. geordief Registered Senior Member

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  19. Janus58 Valued Senior Member

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    Sounds like the "True Scotsman" fallacy. "Sure these people go to church, but they are not "true" Christians. " But even if a given percentage of "Churchgoers" fall into this category, What evidence do you have that this percentage is higher in the US than in other countries?
    Well, that only stands to reason because where you have a high population density, you have a higher chance of pretty much any occurrence dealing with humans. That being said, The UK has 3 times the population density of The US and still has a lower murder rate.
    Then let's just consider the US. Louisiana has the highest murder rate in the US per capita, yet ranks 24th in population density and ranks number 4 in terms of how religious it population is, based on the percentage that identify as Christian, say that they definitely believe in God and pray daily.
    Why? Your whole premise is that secularism leads to less reverence for life, why distinguish between one type of murder from another. If your argument holds, then it should hold equally for both. In fact,
    Says the kettle to the pot. Your whole argument is based on Cherry-picking. Above you mention high population density, but neglect to consider that it is one of the factors that increased since 1960 in the US. You bring up the 2nd amendment, but ignore that it makes guns more available and thus makes mass murder easier to perpetrate in the US than in other countries. Instead, you want to blame it on an increase of secularism; a connection you don't have evidence for.
    But you did so without any real evidence that it was even a factor in increased mass murders, other than this is what you want others to believe.
    Earlier in this thread you brought up the Ten Commandments. You should be more mindful of the one against bearing false witness, which is exactly what you are doing when claiming that secularists have less regard for life than "True Christians".
     
  20. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    They are just as violent as anyone else. Look at Myanmar, or WWII with the Japanese.
     
  21. Gawdzilla Sama Registered Member

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    Those weren't TRUE BUDDHISTS!
     
  22. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Grant you, you tore my argument apart, but, you last paragraph . In the 10 commandments it say thou shalt not murder. That is saying to me if the individual believes in God and is a God obeying individual he will not kill or commit murder.
    A secular individual he does not recognize God so he will not obey God he will do things at his will and when necessary in his reasoning he will kill and commit murder. Do I need evidence , I don't need numbers, the point here , to do murder is the individual will and not God's will.
    Now this perhaps will clear your accusation on me to be a false witness.
     
  23. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    God believers kill too, they just get forgiveness afterward. If a non-religious person believes they shouldn't kill, they also won't kill. Religion doesn't prevent killing. Most of the world is religious, and killing happens all the time.
     

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