Yes, yes and yes but I observe that god belief whatever it's origin and purpose has brought with it very little social bonding beyond the scale of a community/tribe and a great deal of personal and social unrest. And as a tool to manipulate, just about the very best there is.
- but in terms of survivability for the species, that's what's important it would seem. Social bonding can be forced or under completely false pretense as well of course, as you implied. In those terms I fail to see how you could call it lacking. And if nothing else, the fruit of indulging the god idea whether intellectual or for intimidation or whatever, is some form of shared morality. this is the root of social bonding I'd say. We may not be buddies but we both believe the thou shalts. That's social bonding. From this, or rather with this as a shared rationalization - comes when needed common purpose. More bonding. That's the kind of thing I was thinking about. Binding the tribe. . well, that's the everpresent and cyclical clash of value. It's just the nature of the beast that values subjectively - when contrasted with like beings. I don't think the idea of god is a cause for any of that, but it's definately a tool for some of it. you gotta take your judgement out of it man. step outside what you think seems bad and ask if it is in terms of survivability of the species and stuff. is personal and social unrest bad, necessarily? would it have happened for any other excuse were it not for the idea of god? would we have survived long enough to even have hte opportunity to clash if it werent' for the idea? could the idea not exist, or is it an inevitability given its power as a manipulative (not good or bad, just control or bias) tool? i don't think it can be avoided, like pi can't be avoided. it's just too useful of a tool - and yet it doesn't exist as a physical anything. fascinating to me. I think personal and social unrest is 'normal mode', at least historically speaking - and god stuff related to all that it mostly rationalization. hence its inevitability.
who says social bonding is all happy and shit? it can be, but not necessarily at all, lynchy lincherson.
Shared morality - only fleeting if ever it existed at all. Social bonding - only fleeting if ever it existed at all. Such things are the glue and god the veneer. Pick away at this false surface and what do you see? I'm not judging - to each his own, man. Just observing. 'Good', 'bad' and 'ugly' are human value statements and not really applicable to life on earth or out there in the universe. As far as I can tell (with my limited perspective) is that change is the only constant.
As I'm thinking this through further, it seems that given that the idea 'god' is perhaps the most powerful manipulative tool possible... I realize it is also to manipulate self, and that any tool can be used for relative positive or negative.
That's why the ten commandments are in courthouses? That's why skinheads hate jews? Tribes stay tribes because they share values, whether they be hate or love. Any social group is bonded socially, don't be daft. You and me are socially bonded, as something keeps us talking smack here. Oh sure it's pretty loose and rather different that the usual notion, but I'm just sayin. After that it's a matter of degree. Complicated apes, rationalizing the fuck out of their existence. Are so. You're a god hater I can smell it! Lol. Well maybe I'm projecting my former me into your words, but you seem to focus particularly on the negative when to negative and positive can only really be judged from the individual and we're discussing the system here. Perhaps I read too much into your use of "unrest" though. Sounded evident of a "people kill in the name of god" kind of thinking. Now is also constant. It's never "not now'.
But not in sharia 'court houses'. A belief in god; but no sign of shared morality. How is this relevant? Tribes don't stay tribes fixed for all eternity though do they? Only on the smallest social scale. Zoom out and the glue starts to come unstuck. Bonded you and me arggh! so much time wasted. You can smell only your own.... I cannot hate that which does not exist for me. I focus on the positive - getting on with it. The truth, whatever it is will be revealed, if and when; on a need to know basis. That much I'll give you. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
shared morality in the tribe. the more powerful the tribe, the more the morality is basically forced on the other tribes, assimilating them. Tribe with shared beliefs/morality - kill jews is good. I love hating jews. That kind of thing. Of course not, how is THAT relevant? No, the smallest social scale is a group of friends or maybe single family. Morality is share amongst very large groups called religions. Yeah not my fault. I was here first. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! wasted? is that not passing judgement? what do you value more? is there something more 'intrinsically valuable' that they shoudl afford their time? True, depending on proximity and nose-health I suppose. . Of course, but you can hate that others behave in whatever way because they believe it. It can be a cause of hate by invoking an incapacity for "relating to people". I can tell. *ahem* hehe. I'm just giving you shit get off me. Hmm. That's tricky but I don't think it's important to tear into it, so meh. *kowtow*
