# Al Queda is a figment of the US media imagination

Discussion in 'World Events' started by Brian Foley, Nov 4, 2004.

1. ### Brian FoleyREFUSE - RESISTValued Senior Member

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For a group that the American media trumpets as the greatest threat to civilization , sure is one hell of an elusive adversary . The name Al Qaeda was imposed by Western officials and media sources. Mr. Bin Laden has, in fact, never mentioned "Al Qaeda" publicly. Every individual that has been arrested since 9/11 , none has been successfully proven to be a member of Al Qaeda, strange as this organization according to American intelligence sources has 30,000 members . The American media has described each detainee as having ' links to ' or they were ' sympathizers ' to Al Qaeda but not actual members . The foreign detainees America has illegally imprisoned in Cuba , none are Al Qaeda but Taleban . This Al Queda which has been accused of masterminding the spectacular attacks in Kenya , the 9/11 attacks and the attacks in Yemen , Bali and Madrid yet Al Qaeda have never claimed responsibility for any of these attacks . Notice that while the US has not blamed all post-9/11 attacks on Al Qaeda, it has passively allowed others to claim themselves as Al Qaeda or to blame it .

3. ### Insanely EliteQuestions reality.Registered Senior Member

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I tend to agree with the spirit of your post.
In order to wage war, you need an enemy.
In order to wage endless war, you need an enemy you will never defeat.

I am in the minority of people that do not believe Al Queda is the all powerfull secretive network of infinite cells bent on the destruction of the US.

Based on US actions, I find it much more likely that the progenators of the new American century built the threat of terror using an all powerfull secretive architect.

5. ### c20H25N3oShiny Heart of a Shiny ChildRegistered Senior Member

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Oh I find this hard to believe ...

Why would a country be against itself???
Conspiracy theories are great work's of the imagination but that's all they are.
The government does not have money in and of itself, it relies upon the taxes of the nation it is installed by. Government officials are your servants - we call them 'Public Servants'.
America is under threat by muslim fundamentalists. We have seen this with our own
eyes.
Brian - could you really look at the woman who has three children in her care and say that you believe Al-Queda is a work of the American people's imagination given that her husband jumped out of a window of a very tall building in New York because An Al-Queda operative learnt to fly a plane to make that very thing happen?
What is Al-Queda anyway? Perhaps it is just a collective term for all those who hate the heart of America and would kill Americans to show their hatred not just with words but with actions. Al-Queda just means 'Adversary' to the Americans and if you want to know why they think that, please take time to study the documents contained in the following link. These documents were found very very very close to where I live and as such I know them to be genuine.
Bush gone mad or trying to save your ass*s, ungrateful worms that you are?

http://www.usdoj.gov/ag/trainingmanual.htm

7. ### Insanely EliteQuestions reality.Registered Senior Member

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Here is a brief history of just one proven 'conspiracy'
If you think that the public servants are not in need of scrutiny, read this

A History Of US Secret
Human Experimentation
3-25-3
1931 Dr. Cornelius Rhoads, under the auspices of the Rockefeller Institute for Medical Investigations, infects human subjects with cancer cells. He later goes on to establish the U.S. Army Biological Warfare facilities in Maryland, Utah, and Panama, and is named to the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission. While there, he begins a series of radiation exposure experiments on American soldiers and civilian hospital patients.
1932 The Tuskegee Syphilis Study begins. 200 black men diagnosed with syphilis are never told of their illness, are denied treatment, and instead are used as human guinea pigs in order to follow the progression and symptoms of the disease. They all subsequently die from syphilis, their families never told that they could have been treated.
1935 The Pellagra Incident. After millions of individuals die from Pellagra over a span of two decades, the U.S. Public Health Service finally acts to stem the disease. The director of the agency admits it had known for at least 20 years that Pellagra is caused by a niacin deficiency but failed to act since most of the deaths occured within poverty-striken black populations.
1940 Four hundred prisoners in Chicago are infected with Malaria in order to study the effects of new and experimental drugs to
combat the disease. Nazi doctors later on trial at Nuremberg cite this American study to defend their own actions during the Holocaust.
1942 Chemical Warfare Services begins mustard gas experiments on approximately 4,000 servicemen. The experiments continue until 1945 and made use of Seventh Day Adventists who chose to become human guinea pigs rather than serve on active duty.
1943 In response to Japan's full-scale germ warfare program, the U.S. begins research on biological weapons at Fort Detrick, MD.
1944 U.S. Navy uses human subjects to test gas masks and clothing. Individuals were locked in a gas chamber and exposed to mustard gas and lewisite.
1945 Project Paperclip is initiated. The U.S. State Department, Army intelligence, and the CIA recruit Nazi scientists and offer them immunity and secret identities in exchange for work on top secret government projects in the United States.
1945 "Program F" is implemented by the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission (AEC). This is the most extensive U.S. study of the health effects of fluoride, which was the key chemical component in atomic bomb production. One of the most toxic chemicals known to man, fluoride, it is found, causes marked adverse effects to the central nervous system but much of the information is squelched in the name of national security because of fear that lawsuits would undermine full-scale production of atomic bombs.
1946 Patients in VA hospitals are used as guinea pigs for medical experiments. In order to allay suspicions, the order is given to change the word "experiments" to "investigations" or "observations" whenever reporting a medical study performed in one of the nation's veteran's hospitals.
1947 Colonel E.E. Kirkpatrick of the U.S. Atomic Energy Comission issues a secret document (Document 07075001, January 8, 1947) stating that the agency will begin administering intravenous doses of radioactive substances to human subjects.
1947 The CIA begins its study of LSD as a potential weapon for use by American intelligence. Human subjects (both civilian and military) are used with and without their knowledge.
1950 Department of Defense begins plans to detonate nuclear weapons in desert areas and monitor downwind residents for medical problems and mortality rates.
1950 I n an experiment to determine how susceptible an American city would be to biological attack, the U.S. Navy sprays a cloud of bacteria from ships over San Franciso. Monitoring devices are situated throughout the city in order to test the extent of infection. Many residents become ill with pneumonia-like symptoms.
1951 Department of Defense begins open air tests using disease-producing bacteria and viruses. Tests last through 1969 and there is concern that people in the surrounding areas have been exposed.
1953 U.S. military releases clouds of zinc cadmium sulfide gas over Winnipeg, St. Louis, Minneapolis, Fort Wayne, the Monocacy River Valley in Maryland, and Leesburg, Virginia. Their intent is to determine how efficiently they could disperse chemical agents.
1953 Joint Army-Navy-CIA experiments are conducted in which tens of thousands of people in New York and San Francisco are exposed to the airborne germs Serratia marcescens and Bacillus glogigii.
1953 CIA initiates Project MKULTRA. This is an eleven year research program designed to produce and test drugs and biological agents that would be used for mind control and behavior modification. Six of the subprojects involved testing the agents on unwitting human beings.
1955 The CIA, in an experiment to test its ability to infect human populations with biological agents, releases a bacteria withdrawn from the Army's biological warfare arsenal over Tampa Bay, Fl.
1955 Army Chemical Corps continues LSD research, studying its potential use as a chemical incapacitating agent. More than 1,000 Americans participate in the tests, which continue until 1958.
1956 U.S. military releases mosquitoes infected with Yellow Fever over Savannah, Ga and Avon Park, Fl. Following each test, Army agents posing as public health officials test victims for effects.
1958 LSD is tested on 95 volunteers at the Army's Chemical Warfare Laboratories for its effect on intelligence.
1960 The Army Assistant Chief-of-Staff for Intelligence (ACSI) authorizes field testing of LSD in Europe and the Far East. Testing of the european population is code named Project THIRD CHANCE; testing of the Asian population is code named Project DERBY HAT.
1965 Project CIA and Department of Defense begin Project MKSEARCH, a program to develop a capability to manipulate human behavior through the use of mind-altering drugs.
1965 Prisoners at the Holmesburg State Prison in Philadelphia are subjected to dioxin, the highly toxic chemical component of Agent Orange used in Viet Nam. The men are later studied for development of cancer, which indicates that Agent Orange had been a suspected carcinogen all along.
1966 CIA initiates Project MKOFTEN, a program to test the toxicological effects of certain drugs on humans and animals.
1966 U.S. Army dispenses Bacillus subtilis variant niger throughout the New York City subway system. More than a million civilians are exposed when army scientists drop lightbulbs filled with the bacteria onto ventilation grates.
1967 CIA and Department of Defense implement Project MKNAOMI, successor to MKULTRA and designed to maintain, stockpile and test biological and chemical weapons.
1968 CIA experiments with the possibility of poisoning drinking water by injecting chemicals into the water supply of the FDA in Washington, D.C.
1969 Dr. Robert MacMahan of the Department of Defense requests from congress \$10 million to develop, within 5 to 10 years, a synthetic biological agent to which no natural immunity exists.
1970 Funding for the synthetic biological agent is obtained under H.R. 15090. The project, under the supervision of the CIA, is carried out by the Special Operations Division at Fort Detrick, the army's top secret biological weapons facility. Speculation is raised that molecular biology techniques are used to produce AIDS-like retroviruses.
1970 United States intensifies its development of "ethnic weapons" (Military Review, Nov., 1970), designed to selectively target and eliminate specific ethnic groups who are susceptible due to genetic differences and variations in DNA.
1975 The virus section of Fort Detrick's Center for Biological Warfare Research is renamed the Fredrick Cancer Research Facilities and placed under the supervision of the National Cancer Institute (NCI) . It is here that a special virus cancer program is initiated by the U.S. Navy, purportedly to develop cancer-causing viruses. It is also here that retrovirologists isolate a virus to which no immunity exists. It is later named HTLV (Human T-cell Leukemia Virus).
1977 Senate hearings on Health and Scientific Research confirm that 239 populated areas had been contaminated with biological agents between 1949 and 1969. Some of the areas included San Francisco, Washington, D.C., Key West, Panama City, Minneapolis, and St. Louis.
1978 Experimental Hepatitis B vaccine trials, conducted by the CDC, begin in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco. Ads for research subjects specifically ask for promiscuous homosexual men.
1981 First cases of AIDS are confirmed in homosexual men in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco, triggering speculation that AIDS may have been introduced via the Hepatitis B vaccine
1985 According to the journal Science (227:173-177), HTLV and VISNA, a fatal sheep virus, are very similar, indicating a close taxonomic and evolutionary relationship.
1986 According to the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (83:4007-4011), HIV and VISNA are highly similar and share all structural elements, except for a small segment which is nearly identical to HTLV. This leads to speculation that HTLV and VISNA may have been linked to produce a new retrovirus to which no natural immunity exists.
1986 A report to Congress reveals that the U.S. Government's current generation of biological agents includes: modified viruses, naturally occurring toxins, and agents that are altered through genetic engineering to change immunological character and prevent treatment by all existing vaccines.
1987 Department of Defense admits that, despite a treaty banning research and development of biological agents, it continues to operate research facilities at 127 facilities and universities around the nation.
1990 More than 1500 six-month old black and hispanic babies in Los Angeles are given an "experimental" measles vaccine that had never been licensed for use in the United States. CDC later admits that parents were never informed that the vaccine being injected to their children was experimental.
1994 With a technique called "gene tracking," Dr. Garth Nicolson at the MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, TX discovers that many returning Desert Storm veterans are infected with an altered strain of Mycoplasma incognitus, a microbe commonly used in the production of biological weapons. Incorporated into its molecular structure is 40 percent of the HIV protein coat, indicating that it had been man-made.
1994 Senator John D. Rockefeller issues a report revealing that for at least 50 years the Department of Defense has used hundreds of thousands of military personnel in human experiments and for intentional exposure to dangerous substances. Materials included mustard and nerve gas, ionizing radiation, psychochemicals, hallucinogens, and drugs used during the Gulf War .
1995 U.S. Government admits that it had offered Japanese war criminals and scientists who had performed human medical experiments salaries and immunity from prosecution in exchange for data on biological warfare research.
1995 Dr. Garth Nicolson, uncovers evidence that the biological agents used during the Gulf War had been manufactured in Houston, TX and Boca Raton, Fl and tested on prisoners in the Texas Department of Corrections.
1996 Department of Defense admits that Desert Storm soldiers were exposed to chemical agents.
1997 Eighty-eight members of Congress sign a letter demanding an investigation into bioweapons use & Gulf War Syndrome.

Last edited: Nov 4, 2004

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9. ### androidnothing human insideRegistered Senior Member

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1,104
al-Qaeda seems real, but it is a disorganized loose network of militants. As far as why they exist, see the quotes from OBL at the link below. I think Bush allowed the attack (9-11) to occur much as Roosevelt encouraged Pearl Harbor.

http://www.amerika.org/

10. ### Repo ManValued Senior Member

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4,955
I can't vouch for the entire list, but the Tuskeegee syphilis "experiment" is easily verified.

11. ### towardsRelax...head towards the lightRegistered Senior Member

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"al-Qaeda seems real, but it is a disorganized loose network of militants. As far as why they exist, see the quotes from OBL at the link below. I think Bush allowed the attack (9-11) to occur much as Roosevelt encouraged Pearl Harbor.", android

I love how all you followers of conspiracy theories believe these wild ideas about what the government does, but then Bush can't fake a few weapons of mass destruction in Iraq and Bill Clinton can't hide his sex life.

12. ### Insanely EliteQuestions reality.Registered Senior Member

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360

As for the list, cut and paste keywords or names and find multiple sources.
Only 1 case has to be true to prove that the powerful are in dire need of scrutiny.
I verified several in this fasion so I posted the list.

c20H25N3o wrote
Why would a country be against itself???
Conspiracy theories are great work's of the imagination but that's all they are.

I am trying to make a point that what we are told from our government ain't necessarily so. It seems all to often that conspiracy theories turn out to be verified, sometimes easily verified. I realize that it is uncomfortable to change a belief. But dismissing anything that makes you uncomfortable as conspiracy theory is stagnation. I know that it is reassuring to believe everything we are told from Uncle Sam (or news outlets for that matter). I did so myself, I'm not throwing stones.

I would suggest that there is no unified American heart that is spoken of. Many Americas drawn along 300 million lines of differences. Geograghy even matters less as years pass. There is a war on terror. These words (war on terror)are right out of Orwell doublespeak. How is it that so many do not question it? Where is the congressonal declaration of war? Who are we at 'war' with? 'The terrorists and the countries that harbour them' we have been told. Name a country! If there is no country than the rules of engagment are out the window. Would you agree that this includes dozens of countries? Rumsfeld said so. Generational war? Why? 9/11.
Every couple of days more Americans are killed by cigarette smoke than 9/11. Where is the war against big tobacco?
The list on American human medical experiments is scary, but verifiable. I don't blame you for dismissing it. In your own time.

13. ### blobranaRegistered Senior Member

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2,214
Hum,
There was a recent BBC documentary exposing this fiction.
There was no global network of terrorists.
they didn't have hitec cave systems in torabora, they simply didn't exist.

It seems that the term Al Qaeda it self was just made up by the media/government.
And that osama bin ladin only took up that name when he realised that america was blaming him and his organisation...(there was of course no organisation, or that most of them had died in the 9/11 attack)...

But it was very convenient for bush to extend american influence into the middle east, and to terrorise (if that is the correct word) the american population with a made-up threat.

i hope youre not still scared of dirty bombs, are you? - (theres more risk to ones health from taking too much salt, or dairy products)

The threat i suppose now is that a load of disenchanted people will pretend that they are part of al qaeda and make osamas stance stronger and more mainstream...

oh well ...

14. ### M-16Registered MilitantRegistered Senior Member

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Ladies and Gents, this is what i call thinking, questioning, something that Americans are afraid to do.

15. ### towardsRelax...head towards the lightRegistered Senior Member

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"There was no global network of terrorists", blobrana

I guess the towers must have had structural problems to collapse like that, as well.

16. ### M-16Registered MilitantRegistered Senior Member

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I guess the so called "Al'Qeada terrorists" are the only humans capable of doing such a thing.

17. ### Brian FoleyREFUSE - RESISTValued Senior Member

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In order for an immense operation like 9/11 to happen their must of been collusion from Americas security services . As for Al Qaeda I dont believe in fairy tales , I dont believe some bearded fanatic is hiding in some mountain cave and America cannot catch him ?

18. ### towardsRelax...head towards the lightRegistered Senior Member

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"I dont believe some bearded fanatic is hiding in some mountain cave and America cannot catch him ? ", Brian Foley

I am not sure why this is so hard to believe that a man who is making limited contact with the outside world and is no longer commanding his troops, could hide from the U.S. government. As a matter of fact, I would say it would be nearly impossible to catch him, with the loyalties that follow his leadership.

And once again, I am not sure how you think the government could fake his existence, and then not be able to place some WMDs in Iraq, which would be considerably easier. Answer that question before you continue your conspiracy theory.

19. ### Brian FoleyREFUSE - RESISTValued Senior Member

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I never said Bin Laden never existed , I said Al qaeda is a figment of media imagination , a deliberate propaganda concoction . Saddam Hussein was caught in an pit he like Bin Laden had 'limited contact with the outside world and is no longer commanding his troops' .

20. ### blobranaRegistered Senior Member

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2,214
Hum,

But that is exactly the point that most have been fooled by, OBL no longer commands his troops because he hasn't any.....

DOH!
all his followers were killed on the planes of 9/11...

i have seen propaganda videos of him being escorted around by his armed bodyguards - but it turns out that they were just hired for that day (and told to take their own guns!)

ok, i know we should all be sceptical,
but this revelation is so powerful that if it's true, which i believe it is, that we should be holding a sort of House of Un-American Activities Committee public inquiry right now....

21. ### towardsRelax...head towards the lightRegistered Senior Member

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"I never said Bin Laden never existed , I said Al qaeda is a figment of media imagination , a deliberate propaganda concoction", Brian Foley

In a odd way you are correct, but it does not have as much to do with propaganda as with an emerging movement. Al Qaeda did exist in Afghanistan, in the fact that it trained terrorists and spread them throughout the world. Osama did have some communication with various cells at that time, and had some authority over its members. With the destruction of that central base, the organization is basically a buch of cells spread in many countries. Osama really has no control over most of these groups, either by order or financially.

I think Osama's latest speech was an attempt to contact cells in the U.S., if they exist, and issue an order for attack. The point is that those cells may not exist, and bin Ladin would not know himself. Many of those cells spread may now have broken up, or simply lacked the financing to continue.

Many groups have now taken the name Al Qaeda, simply for its notoriety, but not because of any connection with bin Laden. This is why it is more of a movement then an organization these days. The media's role in spreading it would not be by a deliberate attempt, but rather by the attention that they give the name.

22. ### guthrieparadox generatorRegistered Senior Member

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4,089
That reminds me of a Reader Digest Article I read a while back, its from the April 2002 UK edition.
Essentially, there is a French judge called Jean-Louis Bruguiere who has been tracking down the people trained in Afghanistan who may be loosely labelled Al Qaeda, since 1994. An Air France jet was hijacked, and after it had been stormed by special forces, the investigators found a piece of paper with a London address, which was then raided by MI6. Amongst other things found was a drawing of an airplance crashing into the Eiffel tower. By the next year French counter intelligence was assembling a dossier on Osama bin Laden and his henchmen and their activities. He spent the next few years tracing links and cells and such about the world. Then in 1999 he supplied information which led to the conviction of Ahmed Ressam in 2001 one a plot to bomb somewhere in the USA. (He was stopped at the Canada/ USA border)

Ultimately though it takes Sept 11 2001 to happen before he is called in to advise the US gvt.

23. ### slottyColostomy-its not my bagRegistered Senior Member

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Good point, i agree with you.