African Christians will be killed if Church of England accepts gay marriage

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Sorcerer, Apr 5, 2014.

  1. Sorcerer Put a Spell on you Registered Senior Member

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    856
    Interesting article from the Guardian:

    http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/apr/04/african-christians-church-of-england-gay-marriage-justin-welby

    Quote:

    "African Christians will be killed if the Church of England accepts gay marriage, the archbishop of Canterbury has suggested. Speaking on an LBC phone in, Justin Welby said he had stood by a mass grave in Nigeria of 330 Christians who had been massacred by neighbours who had justified the atrocity by saying: "If we leave a Christian community here we will all be made to become homosexual and so we will kill all the Christians.""

    I find this very difficult to understand. On the one hand he says that the C of E has to be aware of this issue, and then he goes on to say (later in the article) that the church doesn't support gay marriage anyway! So it's just a plain NO, and why bring up the issue of the Africans?

    Then there is this bit:

    Quote

    "Welby also condemned homophobia in England. "To treat every human being with equal importance and dignity is a fundamental part of being a Christian," he said. Although he continued to uphold what he called the historic position of the church, of "sex only within marriage and marriage only between a man and a woman", he agreed with the presenter, James O'Brien, that it was "completely unacceptable" for the church to condemn homosexual people more than adulterous heterosexual people."

    I'm trying to make sense of that too. On the one hand everyone is equal, but then gay people can't marry, which makes them less equal. And then we're adulterous even if we're in a stable monogamous relationship!

    Just what thought processes do these people go through to come up with these gems?


    Note to the mods:

    1) I didn't quote too much of the article this time 'cos you didn't like it the last time
    2) I gave my opinion this time 'cos that's what you asked for last time
    So now you can't complain, right? Right.
     
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  3. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    Faithless

    Two Cents

    My two cents happened to go in "The Gay Fray". And also the blogosphere, though there really isn't much difference between the posts.

    But I consider this a forfeiture of faith in God by the Archbishop of Canterbury, and would offer a counterproposal:

    Since some would inevitably use Christ's gift to harm, kill, and suppress people, perhaps He should have honored God by not doing the right thing, saving His own life, and leaving humanity to Sin.​

    Faith is not supposed to be easy. The Archbishop is right that some in Africa will probably seek retribution, but the consequential assertion that the Church should thus abstain from doing what is right is faithless.

    The murders will be tragic. The destruction heartbreaking. But it will also be God's will according to His plan, so they ought not cower from the Lord's wisdom, but instead rejoice. Praise unto God most high, and all that.
     
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  5. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    The Church of England will not even accept gay priests. I think it's rather unlikely that they'll start performing gay weddings. Many Episcopal congregations in the USA split off from the American Episcopal communion specifically because the Episcopal churches approved gay priests.

    This leaves the Redneck churches in an amazing situation: in order to retain their homophobic stance, they had to align with the churches in Africa!
     
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  7. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    I don't. During the Prop 8 battles here years ago, "gay sex will be taught in elementary schools" was a common rallying cry for the anti-gay-marriage crowd. Allowing gay marriage will result in pornography being shown to innocent children, will result in children being "indoctrinated" into Godless secular hedonism, will result in the collapse of the American family - and now will result in minorities being killed. It's a very common tactic.

    (And if you disagree with me, puppies will die, I'm sure of it.)
     
  8. Sorcerer Put a Spell on you Registered Senior Member

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    Oh no, not puppies!

    It's the double-think that I have trouble with. If they're against gay marriage on principle then say so, don't offer up the Africans as a sacrifice.

    And then to call people adulterous because you won't allow them to be married is just breathtaking stupidity.
     
  9. Syne Sine qua non Valued Senior Member

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    No, adultery in a Christian context is extramarital sex (sex with someone other than your spouse). What you describe is premarital sex (sex before marriage). But Many Successful Gay Marriages Share an Open Secret, i.e. adulterous "open" marriages.
     
  10. quinnsong Valued Senior Member

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    Damn, now they are really in for it! Double damnation, whatever will they do?
     
  11. Syne Sine qua non Valued Senior Member

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    How so?
     
  12. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    God knows we have to carefully craft our theology so as not to offend the stupidest, most backwards people on the planet.
     
  13. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    21,635
    So do many successful heterosexual marriages! It's almost like there are similarities. Crazy.
     
  14. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    21,635
    Problem there is that then people call them bigots (and not without reason.) If they are protecting blacks, why, that's the OPPOSITE of bigots. Right? It's all about image.
     
  15. Sorcerer Put a Spell on you Registered Senior Member

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    856
    You're right of course. I would have hoped for something more substantial than that, though, from the Church.
     
  16. Sorcerer Put a Spell on you Registered Senior Member

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    856
    Ok, so let us marry and then we have the opportunity to avoid premarital sex, and both parties are happy, no? Win-win.
     
  17. Syne Sine qua non Valued Senior Member

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    So to avoid premarital sex you want to allow adulterous marriage? http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/29/us/29sfmetro.html?_r=1&

    Seems like you would just be trading one for the other.
     
  18. Balerion Banned Banned

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    8,596
    I'm sorry, are you suggesting that all gay marriages are open? Or that they are less deserving of being married because some of them prefer an open marriage?

    What bigoted bollocks are you trying to peddle here, Syne?
     
  19. Sorcerer Put a Spell on you Registered Senior Member

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    856
    So because some gay people indulge in adultery, means that no one should get married? By that standard no heterosexual people should get married either. Your logic, if that's what it is, is very strange indeed.
     
  20. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    In the interest of keeping the thread on-tack, I am going to recommend we simply ignore Syne and his... well, whatever those inflammatory statements are supposed to be...

    In that vein, and back on topic:

    I am confused... it seems at this point that, because these people feel homosexuality is wrong, they are justified in simply murdering those partaking in it? So... are they claiming the whole "judge, jury, and executioner" roles for themselves here or what? Last I checked, a rather large part of Christianity was that mortals shall not judge the sins of their brothers.
     
  21. Sorcerer Put a Spell on you Registered Senior Member

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    856
    I agree with you.

    It seems to me that they are going beyond what you're saying: they seem to be conflating Christians and homosexuals, and murdering both. Frankly the reasoning - it that is the right word - is beyond me.
     
  22. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    I hate to say it... but perhaps this is a case of damned if you do, damned if you don't... if England allows for Gay Marriage, and Nigera starts murdering groups of Christians because of it... well, there's nothing really to do for it except declare it a crime against humanity and take whatever action is required... personally, I don't know of much that Nigera does for the rest of the world anyway, except apparently spawn dozens of princes who need to move large sums of money out of the country using our bank accounts (and a small stipend so that they can initiate the transaction), so perhaps a little 'Murican style justice might be in order? I mean seriously... perhaps NATO or the World Council or what have you should take note of this and take action, as this is simply xeno/geno/democide
     
  23. Sorcerer Put a Spell on you Registered Senior Member

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    I have some personal knowledge of Nigeria. I went to Lagos on business many years ago to try and free up some cash that was owed to the company I worked for, and a more corrupt place it was hard to imagine. Just before I got there a mob burned down the brand-new telecom tower when they found out that 10% of the cost had gone in 'dash' - bribes. The distributor I was with bribed the bank manager to release some of the money, right on front of me - 'a little tip'. I was glad to leave the place, never to return.
     

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