A world with a loving God.

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Xelasnave.1947, Nov 2, 2019.

  1. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    It means it is perfectly designed to do what it is meant to do.
    I gave the analogy with the iPhone.
    Compared to the iPhone, the human being is.... better .

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  3. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    "Perfectly designed" is certainly a phrase I can wrap my head around compared to "perfectly complete", that would indeed have meaning.

    However, I do think that others here have brought up some good points in regards to flaws in that design, that the human body doesn't seem to be "perfectly" designed to do what it is meant to do.

    I suppose it might be necessary to better define what exactly the human body was meant to do if we were to compare or disperse with those flaws.
     
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  5. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Exactly.

    One point of view is that the human body was designed solely by God, and thus represents a Godly perfection, complete in every way. (As someone here put it, our "body suit.") That's pretty easy to disprove.

    Another is that the human body is flawed because it is the result of millions of years of evolution, and evolution doesn't make things that are perfect - it just makes things that usually (sorta, most of the time, in general) work. There is lots of evidence for that.
     
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  7. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    You missed out “...what it is meant to do.”
    That makes it complete.
     
  8. davewhite04 Valued Senior Member

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    So what about 2 "humans". The test to see if you are a human by lifting a box. The first ones fine, the second one has only one arm. Who is human? If it's a physical thing then you must be filled with prejudice.
     
  9. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Okay, what is it meant to do and how does that make it complete?
     
  10. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    We’ve been through this a few times Q.
    I think we should give this particular topic a rest,?as we’re only going round in circles.
     
  11. Halc Registered Member

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    This seems unfair. A human without an arm is damaged, but still human. Damage is not a design fault. The sorts of design faults that have been pointed out are not instances of damage or other failure to implement the design. Of course part of the design is the consistency in which the design is followed. A well designed thing churns out a lower fault rate from the assembly line.
     
  12. davewhite04 Valued Senior Member

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    Well this is the answer. If you have a beating heart you are human.
     
  13. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    I haven't.

    And I'm dumb.
     
  14. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Sorry, I'm just trying to understand what you're talking about.
     
  15. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 70 years old Valued Senior Member

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    Would this count as a low fault from the assembly line?

    *****
    If taking into account the number of known miscarriages and the number of unknown miscarriages, there is a greater chance of miscarriage than not. As alarming as this statement may be, what it illustrates is that pregnancy loss is a commonly occurring event, one that usually goes entirely unnoticed, often because it occurred within days of the conception and was non-viable from the start.

    https://www.verywellfamily.com/making-sense-of-miscarriage-statistics-2371721

    *****

    And the above does not cover unfortunate people who make the end of assembly line and still born with problems

    Perfect indeed

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  16. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Absolutely. He is still 100% human. To use Jan's terminology, his "body suit" is incomplete, but his mind (what wears the suit) is not.
    Usually not. Arthritic knees are often _due_ to a design fault, as is the pelvic floor damage that comes through childbirth.
     
  17. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Yes. And if you believe that God is responsible for our design, then his design terminates far more pregnancies than man does.
     
  18. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    It is not perfectly designed to give birth, to walk upright, to see or to eat and breathe. There are glaring defects in the body that make those things difficult, painful, risky and/or damaging. (And that's not just a few people; as you said, we are all physically incomplete.) The best you could say is that they work sort of OK, some of the time, in some people.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2020
  19. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 70 years old Valued Senior Member

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    I don't and don't subscribe to the design idea

    It may not be a Jumbo Jet assembled by a cyclone but comes close

    What does Ignored say about Microcephaly?

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  20. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    That’s not my terminology dude.
    Those aren’t design faults.
     
  21. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    I quoted you directly. See my previous post. Stop shifting the goalposts.

    Design? You're mistaken. Human beings evolved; we weren't designed.

    What do you mean by "perfectly complete" when you're talking about human beings?

    Is a watch without a second hand a watch? Is it complete?
    Is a watch without an hour hand a watch? Is it complete?
    Is a watch without any hands at watch? Is it complete?

    What does an incomplete watch look like? Not a watch?

    That's what I originally quoted.

    What do you mean by "perfect" in that context? What do you mean by "design"? What do you mean by "complete"?

    Perfection includes defects?

    I would have thought that perfection generally meant defect-free.

    In fact, my dictionary defines "perfect" as "the state of being without a flaw or defect."

    Go figure.

    ----
    What does any of this have to do with a loving god (the thread topic, remember?)?
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2020
  22. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    I disagree.
    Already explained.
    Already discussed this,
    God.
    You can either go back through my responses, or look it up in the dictionary. Your choice.
    No.
    Then we’re on the same page.
    Good point.
    Let’s move on.
     
  23. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    Most creatures have beating hearts. That don’t make them human.

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