a non-physical thing

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by swarm, Jul 10, 2009.

  1. Lori_7 Go to church? I am the church! Registered Senior Member

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    i'm sure some people are going to jump all over this but i really don't try to. in a lot of ways, trying to figure everything out, and interpret these things is what can drive me nuts if i let it. my experiences have been so varied but it all comes together to have meaning. if i try to force the meaning, i find that it is counterproductive.

    in regards to dreams, i've had recurring ones, with a recurring theme anyway, and i've had very lucid ones on a few occasions. i never understand the dream when i have it. but in regards to most of them i remember (which are relatively few), when i look back on them after i've had certain experiences, they seem to be telling.

    there are times when it's like a 1000 coincedences have profound meaning, and this is over time and general and all inclusive to other more specific experiences. there have been specific times when i've actually received a specific message seemingly telepathically, like an impression, and other specific times when it's very concise and verbal, but also in a telepathic way. there are other specific times when much more trippy shit has gone down, like transcendental writing, physical manifestation of something seemingly inhabiting my body, being aware of spirits around me, either by some knowledge that i have no explanation for, or by experiencing a physical sensation in regards to them (like an interaction), or one very trippy time when i actually had physical objects in front of me morph, with no other explanation whatsoever.

    all of these things i've been through have meaning, and in relation to one another. not only that but the experiences themselves and the meaning behind them, have done a great work in me. developed me.
     
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  3. Lori_7 Go to church? I am the church! Registered Senior Member

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    they do for me stranger. that's what all of these seemingly weird things have culmonated in meaning for me. now i'm not defining god, nor do i think i ever could. but there is an intelligence behind what has happened to me that is indicative of what i would call god.
     
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  5. Lori_7 Go to church? I am the church! Registered Senior Member

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    that is a great question!! ARE thoughts non-physical?

    i also think that sock puppets are a great use for condoms!

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  7. lightgigantic Banned Banned

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    And lo and behold, a methodology is called upon to find it out
    Here you go....
    Do you really want to try and argue that you didn't apply any methodologies (or more specifically, the author of the piece, since at the moment you are just accepting information on faith .... a big no no amongst atheists it seems)
    or are you just being evasive?

    Because you are so hard hearted its pointless trying to take you down that path at the moment

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  8. lightgigantic Banned Banned

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    Actually the first step requires a bit of introspection to see what one is already working with when they approach the topic of "real" (something you seem greatly reluctant to do)



    I introduce the idea here
    http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=2304158&postcount=276

    much like any other knowable claim, right methodology often requires right theory
     
  9. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    “ Originally Posted by StrangerInAStrangeLa
    You believed what some of those beings "said" & made assumptions about another(s?)
    Those experiences do not show there is an omniscient omnipotent god. Gods have been the easy answer for so many things humans did not understand yet later the correct answer was found. ”



    Do you believe disease is caused by curses & evil spirits?
    Do you believe the flu is caused by influence from the stars?
    Do you believe disaster is caused by bad stars?
    Do you believe Thor causes thunderstorms?
     
  10. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    “Originally Posted by Condom-Sock-Puppet
    If all is one, then how can anything be seperate from anything else? Then how can here be non-physical? Is air non-physical? Thoughts? Energy? Without form...there is no definition thus it can't even be. ”



    Air is physical. Thoughts are physical. Energy is physical.
     
  11. Oli Heute der Enteteich... Registered Senior Member

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    Is a concept or an idea physical?
    If you pass on an idea to someone else what is actually exchanged?
     
  12. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    -=-

    YOU are HARD hearted & have NO methodology.



    Actually, the 1st step is to learn critical reasoning.
    You introduce no ideas in that thread.
    Right methodology does not require right theory. Right methodology will determine the theory to be false or not credible or unknowable at this time & place or the best credible theory we have. Without the right methodology, 1 cannot know whether a theory is right.
     
  13. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    Concepts & ideas are not physical or nonphysical. Thoughts which produce them are physical.
     
  14. Oli Heute der Enteteich... Registered Senior Member

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    11,888
    The process of thinking is physical.
    Is the actual thought?
    If I think of, say, my cat - is the thought/ visualisation itself physical?

    So what's actually exchanged when you pass a concept on to someone else? How can something be not physical and at the same time not non-physical?
     
  15. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    -=-

    The process of thinking is performed with thoughts. Thinking is having thoughts. Thinking is a physical process of the brain. When I think of my cat, the visualization is an image produced in my brain & perceived by my brain without any outside stimuli.

    Physical or not doesn't apply to concepts. When a concept is spoken of, there is a physical sound. When a concept is written, there is physical material involved. When a concept is thought of, there is a physical process in the brain. The concept tho is simply that. It's not made of anything material yet it's not some nonmaterial thing floating around.

    It is simply & solely the concept which is exchanged. Unlike a box, which 1 could say involves exchanging wood & metal.
     
  16. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

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    15,058
    Sure ... I don't know if it is just me, or whether this is more general, but introspecting on what one considers "real" can lead to nothing short of schyzophrenia.
    Some people who have mental health problems ponder constantly on issues of what is real and what is unreal - without getting anywhere, other than being stuck in mental health institutions.

    It is a very serious issue to introspect on what one considers "real" - unless one of course is already so advanced that such introspection does not throw them into the pit of refuting solipsism and other epistemological, ontological and other nightmares.

    I suspect many people are aware of this danger to some degree, and this is why they don't venture (much) into pondering normative issues of "real" and "imaginary", and instead tend to go by "common sense", "gut feeling" and such.


    Given that the potential introspector has to consider this grim predicament of impending insanity, what do you suggest that they do to avert it?
    What do you suggest that they use for giving themself the courage to proceed?
    What do you suggest that they put in place in advance to use as a safety net for the case that the introspection indeed leads to debilitating states?
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2009
  17. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    15,396
    -=-

    You can't handle the truth.
     
  18. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

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    So - what do you propose that someone "who can't handle the truth" do, in order to become able to handle it?
     
  19. Oli Heute der Enteteich... Registered Senior Member

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    11,888
    So a concept is "nothing" at all?

    Okay, so there's "physical", "non-physical" and "concept-like".
     
  20. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Simple really. You would be deceiving yourself if you continued to claim that you had conversations with a god when all along it was just a medical condition.
     
  21. Lori_7 Go to church? I am the church! Registered Senior Member

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    that's not an answer to the question. i said if it were confirmed to you that i do NOT have such a medical condition, would you continue to deceive yourself regarding my "infliction" ?
     
  22. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    20,855
    We could cross that bridge when we come to it and look for alternative explanations. Have is it been confirmed Lori?
     
  23. Lori_7 Go to church? I am the church! Registered Senior Member

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    i'll tell you what your alternative explanation would be because i already know.

    during the time when i was knee deep in these experiences, i had an mri of my head, and an examination by an md. all results were normal. i also spoke with a psychiatrist for about a half hour. a half hour of my life i'll never get back but, i did this to appease my parents, as they were concerned.

    he went on for a while about literature he was currently reading, that was not even remotely relevant to anything i was going through...just kind of tooting his own horn. my mom then monopolized a chunk of the time with her rendition of what was happening (she's codependent and talks incessantly). i then told him a thing or two about what was happening with me. these were his findings...

    "you have every right to be crazy. your parents have every right to be concerned."

    that was worth $180.00, don't you think? lol
     

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